The Human Form: His and Hers

[Paragon Fury]

HEY! NO GASOLINE ALLOWED IN HERE!

Alright, so its time to that I ask something I've been pondering about on for some time. And that thing is;

Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed that despite what women and "professionals" try to tell us, that women, men and humans at large consider and have accepted that men are just inherently less attractive than women?

Not that men can't be attractive, but that even extremely attractive men are less attractive than average/slightly above average women and that there is no way that men could ever hope to come close to inspiring the kind of awe and adoration that very attractive women do. A subset of this would be that attractive men all seem largely interchangeable with each other; while women are far more unique not nearly as interchangeable with each other in terms of attractiveness.

Media, culture and even nature seem to agree here. Particularly nature, who seems to have designed men as afterthought when it got done designing women (WHY ARE OUR PARTS ON THE OUTSIDE? WHAT KIND OF JOKE IS THIS?!). Like..."Crap, I forgot I gotta make two of these. Hmm...well, I'll just slap some stuff together and as long as it works its good to go, right?"

I mean even really attractive men, like Thor - I mean Chris Hemsworth -

Spoiler

Sorry, ladies (and men). Ain't going any deeper than this, since I don't want to be on all sorts of odd mailing lists from my search history.

- while considered hot is pretty replaceable, and he is on the pretty high end there. But it'd be pretty hard to a find a replacement for someone like Maurie-Claude Bourbonnais -

Spoiler

 

[tippy2k2]

Well that's not very fair! I could be a way hotter dude if I had two giant bags of...uh....personality! Bouncy bouncy personality! Personality that one could motorboat the hell out of!....what were we talking about again?

I suppose the main factor in that (besides sexual preference of course) is that woman are curvy where men are almost all the same body shape. Women have a huge variety in body types; men generally don't (unless six pack versus beer belly counts as variety).

 

[DJjaffacake]

A blonde with big jubblies? Yeah, not like there's lots of them around.

I'm going to take a wild guess that you're straight, because having just finished watching Game of Thrones all the way through, I can tell you that I find Robb Stark to be one of the most attractive characters, possibly even the single most attractive. So that's at least oen person who doesn't share your view.

 

[L. Declis]

Really?

I'm gonna cop a lot of shit for this, but I find in general, women may dress better and wear make-up, but men are generally more attractive physically.

Not only that, but men tend to age a lot better as well. A women has to put a lot of effort into looking good post-30, but as long as a guy makes an effort to not eat shit food every day and do some basic exercise, he will look better much longer.

Finally, men's fashion is a lot more standardised. While we have occasional trends (metrosexual in the 2000's, lumbersexual nowadays), men don't really have to deviate much, and we can pull off looking like we rolled out of bed well, whereas a women can't do that.

Don't get me wrong, there are some amazingly beautiful women in the world, but in general, women have to put in a lot of effort to look great, whereas men just need to do some exercise, get a good haircut and wear decent clothes.

 

[Glongpre]

Really?

I'm gonna cop a lot of shit for this, but I find in general, women may dress better and wear make-up, but men are generally more attractive physically.

Not only that, but men tend to age a lot better as well. A women has to put a lot of effort into looking good post-30, but as long as a guy makes an effort to not eat shit food every day and do some basic exercise, he will look better much longer.

Finally, men's fashion is a lot more standardised. While we have occasional trends (metrosexual in the 2000's, lumbersexual nowadays), men don't really have to deviate much, and we can pull off looking like we rolled out of bed well, whereas a women can't do that.

Don't get me wrong, there are some amazingly beautiful women in the world, but in general, women have to put in a lot of effort to look great, whereas men just need to do some exercise, get a good haircut and wear decent clothes.

I don't think that is true at all. Women don't need to put any effort in to look beautiful, some just do because not everyone is attracted to everyone. It is a social construct that women should be attractive to everyone and it is a terrible problem with society.

I prefer women who do not or wear minimal make up. I think that women are the most beautiful in their natural form. I think that simplicity is important.

I mean you are right, women need to put in more effort, according to society.

Women can totally roll out of bed and look sexy, I mean, you just have to find the right girl. Perception is everything.

 

[madwarper]

Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed that despite what women and "professionals" try to tell us, that women, men and humans at large consider and have accepted that men are just inherently less attractive than women?

I'm thinking it's just you. Because there's nothing "inherent" about what is attractive, since that's a concept that is unique to each individual.

Speaking as a heterosexual male, I don't find men attractive in the least. And, I find some women attractive. But, that's not to say my personal tastes speak to anything larger about humanity in general.

But it'd be pretty hard to a find a replacement for someone like Maurie-Claude Bourbonnais -

I'm sorry, but just I don't find her attractive. Appearing to be malnourished, with comically over-sized breasts turns me off. Being blonde doesn't do anything for me, but I won't hold it against her. Though, I do like the short hair cut.

Captcha: which one is the hardest?

Not me, captcha. Not me.

 

[mecegirl]

Some guys just put no effort into their appearance. Something as simple as wearing clothing that actually fits would do wonders .

Really?

I'm gonna cop a lot of shit for this, but I find in general, women may dress better and wear make-up, but men are generally more attractive physically.

Not only that, but men tend to age a lot better as well. A women has to put a lot of effort into looking good post-30, but as long as a guy makes an effort to not eat shit food every day and do some basic exercise, he will look better much longer.

Finally, men's fashion is a lot more standardised. While we have occasional trends (metrosexual in the 2000's, lumbersexual nowadays), men don't really have to deviate much, and we can pull off looking like we rolled out of bed well, whereas a women can't do that.

Don't get me wrong, there are some amazingly beautiful women in the world, but in general, women have to put in a lot of effort to look great, whereas men just need to do some exercise, get a good haircut and wear decent clothes.

Of course you will "cop shit" for those statements. You are basiclly saying that men can look nicer without so much effort. But you seem to be overlooking that fact that the standards for attractiveness for women are a lot higher in western cultures than the standards for attractiveness for men. There is nothing natural about that, its just public perception. A guy can put on slacks, a button down shirt(ones that actually fits that is) and actually comb his hair for once and people will be impressed, but that level of dress is the baseline for women.

This isn't exactally about attractiveness, its just a copy of a dress code, but it's giving me high school flashbacks of how strict the codes were for girls vs the boys.

Spoiler

And it's not that men age better than women, its that showing age is acceptable for men but not for women. For example,when is the last time you saw a wrinkle cream ad for men? What about something that would reduce dark spots? Or even under eye circles? It's not that men don't suffer from such things, they just never have anyone consider them less attractive because of them. For the most part ads for beauty products for men target hair loss. And maybe greying hair but there is a product for men specifically made to show off some of their grey hair...

Spoiler

It just all reminds me of this old skit.

 

[Addendum_Forthcoming]

Part and parcel. One part sex orientation, one part culture. Some ancient cultures celebrated the male form to the point where certain male body characteristics like long collarbones, and bicep muscle development were considered divine qualities. To the point where some of these aspects were portrayed on images of goddesses.

In the same way artists of the Enlightenment treated the female form, people before them lavished attention on the male form.

But in both cases it's always a fabrication. No one is as built as the Thinker, for example. Unless you wrestle elephants for a living. Those artworks that were designed on old classical depictions of the male form. Men amd women go through the a lot of the same shit concerning body issues.

 

[madwarper]

This isn't exactally about attractiveness, its just a copy of a dress code, but it's giving me high school flashbacks of how strict the codes were for girls vs the boys.

Spoiler

I see what you mean... How did they ever get away with treating the males so unfairly? They can only wear pants, shoes, shirts, ties and the occasional jacket? Everyone should be allowed to wear a skirt, high heels and a blouse.

 

[Pirate Of PC Master race]

As a straight male, I am completely biased, and will refrain myself from discussion.

 

[mecegirl]

This isn't exactally about attractiveness, its just a copy of a dress code, but it's giving me high school flashbacks of how strict the codes were for girls vs the boys.

Spoiler

I see what you mean... How did they ever get away with treating the males so unfairly? They can only wear pants, shoes, shirts, ties and the occasional jacket? Everyone should be allowed to wear a skirt, high heels and a blouse.

Or, you know, they could have every single detail of how their pants, shoes, shirts and ties are supposed to look described to them just like the girls do(really, not even a reminder to tuck their shirts in properly). Because there actually is a right and wrong way to wear men's clothing(even for small things like which side the belt buckle is supposed to be on). And there are types of clothing that are appropriate for some venues but not for others. Its just that people rarely expect men to know such things. Its just show up in dress pants and a shirt!

Spoiler

 

[Addendum_Forthcoming]

-snip-

My old school uniform guide had the acceptable dimensions of how boys could wear their hair. A kid got suspended for coming to school with a 3 rather than a mandatory 5 or more.

So I suppose you could say a shot at equality of suppression was at least attempted. Dedicating as much time to boy's uniform description as the girl's. What was funny was that they didn't touch me with a 10' pole despite having 2 foot of hair.

School unoform restrictions are generally bullshit and unenforceable now. At least oitside jewelry, due to potential OH&S issues.

 

[Fox12]

Well, I have noticed something on Deviant Art. Do you know what both men and women have in common? They both like drawing women. Like, 90% of Deviant Art is art work of women.

 

[mecegirl]

-snip-

My old school uniform guide had the acceptable dimensions of how boys could wear their hair. A kid got suspended for coming to school with a 3 rather than a mandatory 5 or more.

So I suppose you could say an attempt at equality of suppression was at least attempted. What was funny was that they ddidn't touch me with a 10' pole despite having 2 foot of hair.

School unoform restrictions are generally bullshit and unenforceable now. At least oitside jewelry, due to potential OH&S issues.

A lot of grade school kids I know all have to wear some form of uniform now, which I guess is a mixed bag. Less rules because all they can wear are khakis and a polo shirt of the right color, but it limits free expression(and its kinda ugly).

But yeah dress codes could range from the reasonable to the stupid depending on how they are written. Or even how they were enforced. In my high school this math teacher dubbed himself king of the dress code. Well, he did for female students anyway. He would stand in the entrance to the cafeteria and watch everyone as they walked in for breakfast just to call girls out for things being too short or whatever(which prompted the finger tip test, and most girls would actually pass said test. So he was wasting his time anyway.) But things like sagging pants were against the dress code and this teacher would just let dudes that were sagging walk by. A lot of the students(both male and female) thought he was creepy over his fixation.

 

[madwarper]

Or, you know, they could have every single detail of how their pants, shoes, shirts and ties are supposed to look described to them just like the girls do(really, not even a reminder to tuck their shirts in properly). Because there actually is a right and wrong way to wear men's clothing(even for small things like which side the belt buckle is supposed to be on). And there are types of clothing that are appropriate for some venues but not for others. Its just that people rarely expect men to know such things. Its just show up in dress pants and a shirt!

Tell me, where in that little pic you posted above stated that the girls couldn't wear the same pants, shoes, shirts, ties and occasional jackets that the guys could wear? Because, it seems the girls could choose to wear them, AND the skirts/dresses, heels, etc.

If it seems the girls dress code is more strict, it's because they have so much MORE variety to choose from.

 

[renegade7]

I think at least a part of it is that humans select sexual partners based strongly on body shape and we didn't really evolve any particular "signals" of sexual availability like what occurs elsewhere in the animal kingdom. And it just so happens that traits of the ideal female shape (wider hips and bust in particular) are more pronounced than those of the ideal male shape (a broader chest than waist), especially when you're given the expectation that people wear clothes. It's easy to miss that someone has a six pack if they're wearing an outfit not explicitly design to make that clear, but it's much tougher keeping breasts and hips completely hidden because they have an avoidable effect on the person's profile and silhouette.

If you think men are less attractive than women it's probably because you're straight.

And also this.

 

[mecegirl]

Or, you know, they could have every single detail of how their pants, shoes, shirts and ties are supposed to look described to them just like the girls do(really, not even a reminder to tuck their shirts in properly). Because there actually is a right and wrong way to wear men's clothing(even for small things like which side the belt buckle is supposed to be on). And there are types of clothing that are appropriate for some venues but not for others. Its just that people rarely expect men to know such things. Its just show up in dress pants and a shirt!

Tell me, where in that little pic you posted above stated that the girls couldn't wear the same pants, shoes, shirts, ties and occasional jackets that the guys could wear? Because, it seems the girls could choose to wear them, AND the skirts/dresses, heels, etc.

If it seems the girls dress code is more strict, it's because they have so much MORE variety to choose from.

Where did you see that it said that they could? I see nothing of the sort. It says that they are to wear dresses or a shirt and a skirt. But if it were something so simple as girls having more to choose from then there would have just be a longer list of items, not detailed directions, and certainly no expectation to choose an outfit that is "pretty enough to show that you are a women and covered enough to show that you are a lady." All the measurements and modesty bullshit isn't necessary. Dress, or blouse and skirt, and dress shoes is all it would take.

 

[Addendum_Forthcoming]

-snip-

My old school uniform guide had the acceptable dimensions of how boys could wear their hair. A kid got suspended for coming to school with a 3 rather than a mandatory 5 or more.

So I suppose you could say an attempt at equality of suppression was at least attempted. What was funny was that they ddidn't touch me with a 10' pole despite having 2 foot of hair.

School unoform restrictions are generally bullshit and unenforceable now. At least oitside jewelry, due to potential OH&S issues.

A lot of grade school kids I know all have to wear some form of uniform now, which I guess is a mixed bag. Less rules because all they can wear are khakis and a polo shirt of the right color, but it limits free expression(and its kinda ugly).

But yeah dress codes could range from the reasonable to the stupid depending on how they are written. Or even how they were enforced. In my high school this math teacher dubbed himself king of the dress code. Well, he did for female students anyway. He would stand in the entrance to the cafeteria and watch everyone as they walked in for breakfast just to call girls out for things being too short or whatever(which prompted the finger tip test, and most girls would actually pass said test. So he was wasting his time anyway.) But things like sagging pants were against the dress code and this teacher would just let dudes that were sagging walk by. A lot of the students(both male and female) thought he was creepy over his fixation.

Ah... that's screwy. I hate when teachers are like that. Every school is different, and what I find is that it's the teachers that either make or break a school uniform code. Most teachers were pretty chill where I went, but one year we had a Nazi year group advisor like that.

But he cracked the whip down hardest on boys. But he was also pretty good at emotionally sabotaging any girls he thought were 'trespassing core fundamentals of modesty.'

He ragged on me once, as being deleterious to the image of the school, I lifted up a picture of the school's patron. "Like this guy? I don't seem to be wearing as much blush."

Worth it <.<