The Portrayal of Men and Masculinity in Video Games

[OtherSideofSky]

Recently, I've seen a lot of discussion about the limited number of stereotypical roles female game characters are forced into, and it caused me to realize that there is an array of tropes and stereotypes attached to male characters as well. I would like to talk about them.

It's no secret that game writing is, on average, fairly poor and that it is often filled with stereotypes. I think that changing this requires looking at and criticizing stereotypes many may consider to be positive as well as those generally considered to be negative portrayals.

First, some questions I would like to ask people:

-What archetypes and tropes do you see in the portrayal of male characters in video games? Are these the same tropes you observe in other media?
-Do you consider these traits positive or negative? Why?
-What do you think this says about how our community, or our culture in general, defines masculinity? Do you think this definition needs to change? If so, in what ways?
-What are some characters that do not conform to stereotypes? How common are such characters? Are they more common in some genres than others?

Men:
-Do you relate to the male characters in the games you play? Do you admire them or desire to emulate them?
-Do you believe that you possess any of these qualities yourself? Do you think they are common in other men?
-Is there anything you would like to see in the portrayal of male characters that you do not currently observe? Why?

Women:
-Do you like or admire the male characters you see in games? Do you relate to any of their experiences? If not, what is it about male characters that make them unrelatable to you? Could this be changed?
-Do you think these stereotypes are representative of qualities you observe in the men you encounter in real life?
-Are there roles or qualities you would like to see in male characters that you do not see now? What would make these characters more appealing to you?

Please remember:
This is not a thread about who is worse off than who, a general thread about sexism or a soapbox for people to express their like or dislike of contemporary feminism. It is intended to be a simple discussion of an aspect of video game writing I do not see being discussed in this way elsewhere.

 

[Vault101]

male charachters I like and dislike

Nathan Drake really shits me for some reason

and I don't know why...I think its because he has no real flaws

now take somone like Issac Clarke....technically his personality is on the "standard" side of things..however for some reason I feel sowmaht attatched to him..I think its because of all the shit he goes through and his situation

Altiair from assasins creed I really liked at the time, unlike other peopel I dont see him as bland, but instead a professional assasin who comes to question everything he is told

compared to Ezio who I wasnt a fan of..I think the "lovable rouge" charachter doesnt apeal to me..however unlike nathan drake I warmed up to him

Adam Jensen from Deus Ex....I like too, probably because I can have some imput into his actions

so I guess what I'm saying is its not always about gender...BUT gener can be important

like chell from portal, she's awsome

 

[blah_ducks]

I can't believe there's a gender roles thread that isn't comprised of a million people arguing. Anyways, while I will admit that I'm more prone to dissecting female stereotypes in games I've found the "grizzled badass" trope is turning up more and more.

There's nothing wrong with having a character with a dark past and we don't have to make every character a wide-eyed innocent, but can you PLEASE emote something other than anger or regret?! I feel that it perpetuates the stereotype that men can only be manly if they stay far away from girly things like joy or emotions. I've always been annoyed that it's deemed unmanly for someone to share their feelings. I know there's some things that people don't want to go blabbing to everyone, but I feel our culture equates emotions with femininity which is just plain stupid for both genders.

Though this tends to be just a problem with RPGs and animated shows (*coughLegendofKorracough*) I really hate it when a male character is made to angst just to drive up their fangirls. This sort of adds in to the "They only express one emotion" schtick of the gritty badass, but I feel this one is only used for female titillation and it gets pretty fucking annoying when you have a character that does nothing but brood. It's especially annoying since their situation is either overdone or just stupid. Though I might be a hypocrite for liking Fenris from DA2 at least he would be snarky every once in awhile and I find his situation deserving of a traumatic outlook.

My favorite type of male character is usually the happy-go-lucky snark or the father figure. I normally play (J)RPGs and these archtypes I find the most fun. They provide the most fun and likability in my eyes.

 

[Prosis]

The main character is seldom a deep character. Why? Because he is the vehicle for the gamer. Additional personality destroys the gamer's immersion. This is why some of the most popular protagonists of all time (such as Gordon Freeman, Link, and Chrono) are silent protagonists. Without any real character, the gamer is able to define himself through his in game actions.

There are main characters with more personality though, and they're probably more fitting as examples.

As for side characters, I usually find that they aren't worth looking up to or admiring. Too shallow. Most characters are flawless, or their flaws fall on stupid lines such as "my family was killed, I have a drug/drinking problem, I'm emotionally crippled, etc." They aren't relateable flaws. And flawless males almost always fall into that sort of "competent badass" role, which is fun to watch, but not really relateable.

There are some good male characters which I found relateable. Zulf from Bastion. Junpei from Persona 3. Jak from Jak 3 (not Jak 2, he was an idiot in that one).
But probably the best was Wander from Shadow of the Colossus. He wasn't superhuman, loaded with weapons and magic. It was him against earth shaking titans, with only a sword, a bow, and his horse. Although he doesn't say anything during the game, something about the way the his character acted toward his beloved was really gripping. An ordinary main willing to go to impossible lengths for his love.

As for portrayal of men... I'm tired of the middle-thirties-hard-boiled-grizzled-competent-badass. And the angsty JRPG teens.

 

[the abyss gazes also]

I think games, as with other media, falls to often into the the "everyone must be pretty" troupe. While male characters might have a bit more range than most female characters in games (compare say Altair, svelte strong guy, and Marcus Fenix, strong guy with shoulders trying to eat his neck to most female characters are lamp posts with melons strategically strapped to them) they do fall into some bland rehashes.

Now occasionally graphics limit how "pretty" people look but usually the world is devoid of average or ugly people. Unless of course it is the horrible scarred bad guy. (I'm sure there are a few games that escape this, but at the moment none are springing to mind.) And I can understand that games are a bit of escapism and wish fulfillment, so I'm not saying that we need to play an overweight, triple chinned, asthmatic but can this person at least exist in the game world?

As for personality... what personality? Very rarely do these guys have a personality beyond "I'm a hyper capable 1) lovable douche-bag 2) unlovable douche-bag."

I might not mind a little railroading if it meant that I could have a character with some personality.

As for portrayal of men... I'm tired of the middle-thirties-hard-boiled-grizzled-competent-badass. And the angsty JRPG teens.

Amen to that.

 

[OtherSideofSky]

Thank you for all the great responses.

I feel like I should answer my own questions, so:

I am just as tired of the "grizzled badass" as the rest of you. I hate their inability to express any emotion other than rage and I really hate the way so many of them are completely incapable of interacting with other people or the world around them except through violence. I consider the eternally smug Drake as bad as the perpetually scowling Kratos in this regard. I don't relate to or admire these characters and I often dislike or disagree with the way they act to the point that it seriously diminishes by enjoyment of the games they star in.

I'm also really fed up with the way games tend to portray soldiers. They've been omnipresent in AAA releases for quite some time now, and they almost always turn out to be the same one-note stereotypes that bear little to no resemblance to any real person. I especially hate the degree to which none of them seem to have any identity besides being soldiers.

I tend to enjoy characters like Phoenix Wright and Professor Layton a lot more. I also found myself sympathizing with some of the characters in Shadow Hearts (as well as a few minor characters in Xenosaga). I was also fairly okay with Welkin from Valkyria Chronicles. What generally sticks out to me about these characters is that, while they are not necessarily very deep or especially well written, they have established interests and lives beyond their professional roles, establish and maintain personal relationships with the people around them and are portrayed as actually putting some thought into what they are doing and why.

As far as more traditional action heroes go, I like the goofiness of characters like Gene from God Hand, who is funny not because of Nathan Drake-style wisecracks but because he isn't nearly as cool as he clearly thinks he is. I also liked Enoch from El-Shaddai, although I couldn't tell you why for sure (I would also like to point out that El-Shaddai is a game in which you play a buff pretty-boy in designer jeans who becomes gradually less clothed as he takes damage. Most reviewers appear to have missed this fact).

One thing I would like to see, both in video games and in media as a whole, is more male characters in the "victim" role. I think that the insistence on invincibility and sbsolute self-sufficiency is a part of the traditional masculine ideal which can have very harmful results in the real world. Society has traditionally seen the weak, injured or submissive man as a threat and a subject of disgust, very much like the way powerful or dominant women are often portrayed (you will find both as common inspirations for monsters in horror both classic and modern). For example, when you learn that a male character in any medium has been a victim of child abuse, sexual or otherwise, it is almost invariably as a justification for the literal or figurative monstrosity he has become in the present. As a former abuse victim myself, I find this a very disturbing trend.

 

[Arakasi]

As much as people ***** about male and female tropes, the fact is that we are objectified (if you are into that existentialist bullcrap) and steryotyped about equally.

Yay for equality!

 

[OtherSideofSky]

Oh, one other thing I'd like to add:

I'd like to see male characters expressing grief in ways other than bloody, revenge-fueled rampages. This isn't a problem exclusive to male characters, but it's a fairly common issue I have with AAA games. Character death is to often reduced to nothing more than a reason to kill more dudes, which robs it of emotional impact. This often occurs in the service of making sure that the 'grieving' character is able to display anger in place of sadness, thus keeping within the acceptable emotional range.

 

[Zydrate]

-Do you like or admire the male characters you see in games? Do you relate to any of their experiences? If not, what is it about male characters that make them unrelatable to you? Could this be changed?
I like some. But to be quite honest, I mostly just Rule 63 most of my videogame protagonists.
RPG's fix this issue by letting my choose my playable gender.
And Halo: Reach thankfully let me have a female spartan, even if she was a shallow husk of a... thing.

-Do you think these stereotypes are representative of qualities you observe in the men you encounter in real life?
Ahaha, no. I am under the impression that men in real life go about their lives trying to fit into the "status quo" in a way, as we are all guilty of. I in no way find any men I know to ever be qualified as "heroic". That's not their fault. Games wouldn't be fun if we played as mentally broken deadbeats.

-Are there roles or qualities you would like to see in male characters that you do not see now? What would make these characters more appealing to you?
Auron. That man made me straight for about three seconds.

 

[Kahunaburger]

Oh, one other thing I'd like to add:

I'd like to see male characters expressing grief in ways other than bloody, revenge-fueled rampages. This isn't a problem exclusive to male characters, but it's a fairly common issue I have with AAA games. Character death is to often reduced to nothing more than a reason to kill more dudes, which robs it of emotional impact. This often occurs in the service of making sure that the 'grieving' character is able to display anger in place of sadness, thus keeping within the acceptable emotional range.

I've got no idea why our modern culture is so insecure about this. I mean, seriously, the characters in Homer are brutal warlords who go around burning villages and taking slaves, but they cry when they're sad. So does Gilgamesh. So if the people who wrote these incredibly machisimo-laden stories are okay with dudes having emotions beyond "angry" and "very angry," why aren't we?

 

[Fluffythepoo]

Oh, one other thing I'd like to add:

I'd like to see male characters expressing grief in ways other than bloody, revenge-fueled rampages. This isn't a problem exclusive to male characters, but it's a fairly common issue I have with AAA games. Character death is to often reduced to nothing more than a reason to kill more dudes, which robs it of emotional impact. This often occurs in the service of making sure that the 'grieving' character is able to display anger in place of sadness, thus keeping within the acceptable emotional range.

I've got no idea why our modern culture is so insecure about this. I mean, seriously, the characters in Homer are brutal warlords who go around burning villages and taking slaves, but they cry when they're sad. So does Gilgamesh. So if the people who wrote these incredibly machisimo-laden stories are okay with dudes having emotions beyond "angry" and "very angry," why aren't we?

Another thing those men had in common is they had sex with other men, different cultures produce different dramas

 

[Kahunaburger]

Oh, one other thing I'd like to add:

I'd like to see male characters expressing grief in ways other than bloody, revenge-fueled rampages. This isn't a problem exclusive to male characters, but it's a fairly common issue I have with AAA games. Character death is to often reduced to nothing more than a reason to kill more dudes, which robs it of emotional impact. This often occurs in the service of making sure that the 'grieving' character is able to display anger in place of sadness, thus keeping within the acceptable emotional range.

I've got no idea why our modern culture is so insecure about this. I mean, seriously, the characters in Homer are brutal warlords who go around burning villages and taking slaves, but they cry when they're sad. So does Gilgamesh. So if the people who wrote these incredibly machisimo-laden stories are okay with dudes having emotions beyond "angry" and "very angry," why aren't we?

Another thing those men had in common is they had sex with other men, different cultures produce different dramas

That, too. Srsly, vidya gaems, human beings depicted a range of sexualities and emotions in fiction before we had electricity, plumbing, or stirrups. This should not be a problem.

 

[xPixelatedx]

Snip

-What archetypes and tropes do you see in the portrayal of male characters in video games?

-Are these the same tropes you observe in other media?

In American media or media trying to appeal to Americans, yes.

-What are some characters that do not conform to stereotypes? How common are such characters? Are they more common in some genres than others?

Mario, Sonic, Link, Ratchet, Sly, etc. Not common anymore, because they lack BROWN and BORING. Translation: they aren't edgy enough to have never ending stubble of doom.

-Do you relate to the male characters in the games you play? Do you admire them or desire to emulate them?

You mean the all-jagoffs you play as in every game now? Hell NO, on both counts.

-Do you believe that you possess any of these qualities yourself? Do you think they are common in other men?

I do everything I can to be a PERSON, and not a walking, thinking, self aware cluster of testosterone. Sadly in my area it is very common for men to try to appear and act like the exaggerated caricatures portrayed in movies and games.

-Is there anything you would like to see in the portrayal of male characters that you do not currently observe? Why?

Well, I would like to see actual characters again like we did back in the day, they don't even have to be human. That's the best answer I can give. Fuck playing as the guy who looks like the janitor at my old high school... I want to play as robotic rabbits again!

 

[Gorrila_thinktank]

I?m imagining a post-post-apocalypse game where the main player character is a tough-as-nails Mexican women. We are introduced to the character when an AI unlocks her prison cell doors and tells her It needs her help to save the son of its creator. The problem is the whole city state is being invaded so the character must navigate the first part of the game to find this guy. When the women finds the guy he is caring for a 7 month old orphan he found in the wreckage of his bombed out apartment. The game then becomes a journey out of the city state with the guy trying to care for the kid and emotionally manipulating the women into saving and protecting a ragtag group of survivors. Along the way he becomes her manic-pixie-dream-dude and attempts to emotionally open up the hard-ass ex Special Forces lady. The AI helps too. Along the way you occasionally play stealth sections as the guy trying to sneak around with his orphan baby to create suspense.

Bam. That?s some gender stereotype reversal.

 

[Gennadios]

They all kind of bother me.

On the one end of the spectrum you have the dude-bro Nathan Drake, who is to video games what Dane Cook was to comedy.

EDIT: The "in-between" or non-combat characters tend to emulate the whiny ***** Shia LeBouf types. As in the primary Assassin's Creed protagonist.

Then you have a stable of testosteroned out man-babies like Kratos and whatever the name of Gears of War guy is.

Probably why I prefer my protagonists silent. Or at least RPGs where I can choose the lesser of 2-3 evils during any cut-scene.

EDIT2: Now that I think about it, I must admit that I liked many Survival Horror protagonists, can't even think of one that was worse than than bland and forgettable. James Sunterland from Silent Hill 2 and Alan Wake had just the right vulnerable but stoic vibe for me.

 

[lacktheknack]

It's because I just played it today, but my first thought was this:

http://www.newgameland.com/wp-content/uploads/The_Binding_of_Isaac.jpg



Anyways, men in video games reflect the concept of masculinity in culture, which is your tired old tripe like big muscles, takes command, kills all the things, etc. I like it when men in games utterly subvert these ideas. See: Above, a game which features a small boy going through the most traumatic experience imaginable where he defeats creatures by crying at them until they go away. If reduced to minimal health, he pees himself constantly. Imagine if they tried that with a young adult. I'd play it.

 

[Something Amyss]

male charachters I like and dislike

Nathan Drake really shits me for some reason

and I don't know why...I think its because he has no real flaws

Being a major douchebag is what does it for me.