This makes me fear our future.

[Zer_]

Same principle applies here , if someone doesn't like homosexuals, you can't force the person to like them, that is their right

You make it sound like "rights" are some kind of law of nature. They aren't. They are made up stuff put in place to help a society function. If they fail to do that, they need to be changed. Here in Germany, "insulting, maliciously maligning, or defaming segments of the population" is strictly illegal. Probably because our ancestors learned the hard way where it leads to if you let free speech run unchecked. It can't stop people from thinking that way, but it's quite helpful for stopping them from spreading their corrupted ideas, which are the sole reason why people start thinking that way in the first place. Nothing good comes from xenophobia or homophobia, so there is no reason for allowing it to exist.

You and I have every right to tell other Christians who soil the very good name we are that they can go eat a dick. Or even call them inhuman fuck douches. I'm catholic and I think people in my religion who do this are assho- No. BEYOND Assholes.

I'm willing to accept that many if not most Christians are good, decent people at heart. But I'm sorry to inform you that those Christians are still very much a big part of the problem. It's great to hear that your morals are so profound that you're capable of distancing yourself from the darker parts of the Bible, but even though you don't agree with all of it's message, and excuse the caps, YOU ARE STILL HELPING TO SPREAD ALL OF IT'S MESSAGE.

The difference between a fringe group of demented people and a World Religion is you. Those homophobic evangelicals might only be a very small minority, but they are backed by a silent majority that gives credence to their cause by identifying themselves with the same, completely hollow umbrella term that is "Christian". It's like saying even though you are proud to be a Nazi and happily wear their uniform and come to their meetings, you are very much opposed to the way they treat Jews, and actually expect absolution for saying so. They didn't just come up with homophobia (and antisemitism, by the way). It *IS* part of the Christian message.

Brilliant post my friend. Freedom of Speech does not include any form of verbal abuse, though. These assholes would probably try to hide behind the Constitution, but in the end, the spirit of the laws is as such. You can say, or do anything you want as long as it does not harm another human. The Klu Klux Klan is allowed to exist. They are not allowed to attack blacks or other people, both physically and verbally.

 

[Torrasque]

THAT IS IT!

Going to get a book on stone working and going to start buying tools. Moving to Canada to become a hermit. Cannot take this country anymore. This makes me too sad to even be angry. I think i broke something in my head so i will go lay down for a bit.

Lol, you can just move to any of our cities and hang out wherever you want dude.
Hell, I'll even buy you your first real Canadian beer as a "welcome to Canada!" gesture

So i can move there and just chill no one will bother me. I just might take that offer.

Wellll... If you do your hermit thing, some people may look at you funny, but provided you just act normal (or pretend to be normal like Clark Kent) then we won't attack your street with people carrying signs saying how bad it is to like cherries instead of strawberries.
There may be the occasional crazy in city centers, but even then they are mostly something to be laughed at by all.

Oh. And stay the fuck away from Toronto.

By hermit i don't mean crazy guy wearing potato sacks and yelling gibberish at passers by. Will you attack my home for building my manor inside the mountain i colonize? Cause that's what i would do to avoid marring the landscape with a shack.

Avoiding Toronto then.

http://www.vgcats.com/comics/images/031124.jpg

Depends which mountain you colonize. Some of them will collapse right on top of you due to instabilities caused by mining many years ago, while others have large quartz nodes you can't exactly mine through. You'd have more luck "marring the landscape" since you'd be close to a major city in most provinces you did that in and would be given land to make productive if you somehow found a patch that someone hasn't already claimed.

<spoiler=Here is the first comic I had in mind but didn't find in time>http://www.vgcats.com/comics/images/040412.jpg

 

[Aprilgold]

I am not one to fight back on stuff like this at all but when Christianity builds something it isn't as a brand. They are built as a service, the people being paid usually need it because their religious services require them to take time out of their lives and do something.

It may sound on paper like its stupid to pay a guy who tells you things (you don't have to pay him) about sin and how certain actions contribute to a sentence in hell. But even he knows god forgives people for anything. Even if they do not repent. The way I see it, god is the most calm person about things, kinda like Jeff Lebowski in "The Big Lebowski". He just does stuff, he doesn't stop people or hurt them, he just lets things go. Unless they blatantly harm him of course. Trust me when I say it never hurts anyone to believe in something.


Christians are not bad people. It's just there are morons who make us look bad. Like these fucking people who had an underground war against gay people.

Never said that the whole group was the issue, now did I? The background of the area that the school is based is basically anti-gay and pro-Christian. And while I might piss off 90 different people for saying this. So I won't. But it goes along the lines of 'Following a scripture from long ago can make people use it as a excuse for being dicks.'

Religion is supposed to be a beacon of all that is good in the world, and it shouldn't be corrupted to the level where West Boro Baptist Church is still around. Donations are fine, but there is no reason for there to be Christian Rock Bands, Christian Coffee Mugs, T-Shirts, Christian Dating Services and more. I guess the proper thing to say here, is would Jesus sell merchandise of himself to his followers? I don't think he would, I think he would be content with them just following the good word.

And this is the key thing here. We can guess for as long as time what God wants, but we can always go back and look at what Jesus might want in a certain situation. He's characterized enough that we can guess more accurately at what he would want.

My point. Christianity is defienetly more corrupted at the core of itself then it should be. It is also very, highly marketable. Religion is supposed to be a shining beacon of hope to humanity, show what is all good in the world, yet it is the cause of several things due to the inside not wanting to stop the trouble makers from ruining their reputation.

 

[Hattingston]

Donations are fine, but there is no reason for there to be Christian Rock Bands, Christian Coffee Mugs, T-Shirts, Christian Dating Services and more. I guess the proper thing to say here, is would Jesus sell merchandise of himself to his followers? I don't think he would, I think he would be content with them just following the good word.

I'll concede that mugs and t-shirts are a bit much, but Christian rock and dating services are fairly reasonable. The dating service would allow Christians to meet other people who share their beliefs with relative ease, and the Chrisitan rock that I've heard is an expression of the bands emotion about their faith, which can feel empowering and hopeful if you share that faith.

OT: This article enraged me. Almost brought me to tears. The way the schools, the board and the government have treated this situation ... I can't describe it. I wish it wasn't so late here, the gym is closed and I really want to beat the shit out of something. My prayers go out to the familys of the victims and to anyone suffering under conditions like these.

 

[Aprilgold]

Donations are fine, but there is no reason for there to be Christian Rock Bands, Christian Coffee Mugs, T-Shirts, Christian Dating Services and more. I guess the proper thing to say here, is would Jesus sell merchandise of himself to his followers? I don't think he would, I think he would be content with them just following the good word.

I'll concede that mugs and t-shirts are a bit much, but Christian rock and dating services are fairly reasonable. The dating service would allow Christians to meet other people who share their beliefs with relative ease, and the Chrisitan rock that I've heard is an expression of the bands emotion about their faith, which can feel empowering and hopeful if you share that faith.

Then why isn't it regular rock? You don't have Lesbian Hip-Hop or Muslim Dubstep, so why Christian Rock?

 

[BiscuitTrouser]

http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact/submit-questions-and-comments

I have spent the last 10 mins writing to mr Obama. I constructed a message showing him this article and reminding him what America really stands for. Where presidents before him have faced up to hatred and intolerence even prevelent among the majority and said no. They have seen that no injustice is too small to fight, no minority is too small to defend. No freedom is to small to withdraw.

I reminded him how his forebearers dealt with such hatred and intolerence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Rock_Nine

I reminded him that the America the world will stand behind will be one where everyone is free. Where everyone is fought for tooth and nail. Where a THOUSAND troops will be deployed in the defence of a SINGLE mans rights. Or even 9 people. Where no citizen can sleep in fear of their military but instead in the safe knowlegde that they will mobalise in an INSTANT to ensure they live a free and happy life.

These monstrous people are not human. But let us not throw hate at them. Lets make it VERY clear that this is not ok. That these poor people are not a minority. That EVERYONE straight or gay will fight and fight and fight for this to stop. And we will never ever back down. That their lifestyle is their own choice and they have every right to live and laugh and be happy with themselves. That such debased hatred is not tolerated in a modern society. We need to purge this hate mercilessly, stamp it out with messages of peace and action to defend those too outnumbered to defend themselves.

I am appauled and disgusted this even happens. Keep up the good fight. I URGE you to write as i have written, if the whitehouse gets a THOUSAND angry messages that this is NOT ok then action may be taken. Please please write. Even if it seems pointless your voice means something.

 

[Hattingston]

Then why isn't it regular rock? You don't have Lesbian Hip-Hop or Muslim Dubstep, so why Christian Rock?

Christian rock is Christian because the people who wrote it were inspired by their Christian faith. It's just normal rock with Christian themes (typically ones like love), and as a Catholic, I personally find it uplifting. Don't get me wrong, I don't listen to exclusively Christian rock, I like me some Dio and Franz Ferdinand too; I just don't think it's fair to label it as part of a corrupt establishment when I percieve it as an expression of genuine faith and emotion. I honestly can't say why there is no Lesbian Hip-Hop or Muslim Dubstep, but I don't see why that means we can't have Christian rock. While I'm not opposed to discussing this further, I'd rather not bring the thread off track, so this will be my last post on this thread in regards to it. If you'd like to debate it further feel free to pm me.

 

[Aprilgold]

Then why isn't it regular rock? You don't have Lesbian Hip-Hop or Muslim Dubstep, so why Christian Rock?

Christian rock is Christian because the people who wrote it were inspired by their Christian faith. It's just normal rock with Christian themes (typically ones like love), and as a Catholic, I personally find it uplifting. Don't get me wrong, I don't listen to exclusively Christian rock, I like me some Dio and Franz Ferdinand too; I just don't think it's fair to label it as part of a corrupt establishment when I percieve it as an expression of genuine faith and emotion. I honestly can't say why there is no Lesbian Hip-Hop or Muslim Dubstep, but I don't see why that means we can't have Christian rock. While I'm not opposed to discussing this further, I'd rather not bring the thread off track, so this will be my last post on this thread in regards to it. If you'd like to debate it further feel free to pm me.

That is all art. Art is the purest expression of faith, in ones self, in ones surroundings, in ones life ETC. There is no point in there being Christian Rock, or Catholic Rock, not saying there can't be Catholic Rock songs, its just sorta odd to have a category of music that is not so changed from the original.

 

[Sam6066]

Vault101 got suspended for saying "damn... that's.. awful"? Really moderators? Really?

I know it was a brief post and that the user didn't support their opinion with evidence, but come on, did that really deserve an account suspension? As long as a comment doesn't amount to a baseless insult or obscene remark etc. then it should surely be allowed.

When you start suspending people for not being eloquent or expressing themselves clearly (which The Escapist seems to be doing more and more these days), you're treading into grounds that I'm not comfortable with...

 

[sinterklaas]

I could go on a rant filled with obsceneties and death threats to everyone being anti-gay in a manner described in this article, but that would only make my post appear faint with a nice red text next to my name.

Instead, I'll only say this. These people aren't Christians. They aren't people. They aren't even monsters. The only thing they are good for is to be put down.

 

[Caligulove]

What I really want to know is how many of these terrible people are actually gay themselves. Constantly think about it and repress their own shame of themselves by hurting others as a conduit for themselves.

 

[SeriousIssues]

Hey here's a thought. You think that blaming suicide on middle school bullying will give kids the idea that it's perfectly reasonable to commit suicide over middle school anti-gay bullying?

Most likely correct.

Honestly, I think that a bit of backbone and quitness can go a long way in situations. Of course the openly gay, flamboyant kid is going to attract more bullying than someone keeping their sexuality to themselves. And don't say "There's no reason for them to keep it to themselves!" when there clearly is, as evidenced by all the bullying.


Also, the views on bullies might just be a bit too passionate. Jeering 7th grade kids aren't hellspawn sent for the sole purpose of destruction. They're just middle schoolers.

 

[Matt Dellar]

Isn't it odd, yet unsurprising, that some groups of "Christians" tend to ignore the entire New Testament? I'm horrified that these people claim the same religion as me.

There's nothing we can do about the past, but we can certainly help to prevent these kinds of things from happening in the future.

 

[German Lynx]

quote="German Lynx" post="18.343682.13808027"]Living in a small, conservative town I can promise you this isn't an isolated incident. At my district alone there's been at least 2 other suicides in the past few years due to the tight-knit community's ability to alienate someone to such a degree that they see no other option but taking their own life. These places are pockets of hell on earth that take two steps back in human development for civilized society's one step forward. Man do I hate right-wing small towns and the cult-cloaked-as-christian religious freaks that inhabit them. Thank God they're *somewhat* few and far between.[/quote]
wow, could you make a more sweeping generalization. I grew up in a tiny conservative right-wing town and nobody has killed themselves because of bullying there. There are several LGBT people in that community and they aren't bullied any worse than the rest of us. Same with non-whites, there were several but they were actually quite popular for the most part. Hell, I don't think any of them were bullied anywhere near as bad as me, and I'm a WASP.

Furthermore, bullying happens everywhere, not just small towns. It's a product of human nature, not location.[/quote]

I don't disagree that bullying is everywhere, but you can't honestly believe that being singled out in a small community is the same as in a metropolis or suburb, where you have some protection through anonymity and the ability to become a face in the crowd.

You're giving me the experience of ONE person (you) in ONE town. Maybe you got lucky, but let me ask, do you still live there? And define small town, give me a population size. I'm speaking to places with a total population well under a thousand, with a 99% white christian demographic. I've traveled to a number of these places all over the country, and while there are differing levels of prejudice for different minority, the overall air of hatred for outside ideas remained. Is every. single. Last. little town. like that? Probably not, but there's a reason the closed minded backwater hick is a cliche. And my point still stands that when you take a group of people minute enough to self sustain an outdated belief and quash any attempts of modernization, you get something very nearly equivalent to a progress-slowing anchor that society has to drag along due to the simple fact that said small group refuses to separate itself wholly from the future-bound society that plays host to it.

Again, are these people everywhere? Of course, look at some of the gang communities in large cities. Same principal.

To assume that there isn't something fundamentally WRONG with a society that refuses to update their beliefs and outlooks on the world with the changing times, whilst imbuing the next generation with the prejudice mindset that is now the shame of a nation, is utterly foolish.