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From what I understand, its sales have also fallen off faster than a lot of other games this year.
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TLOU2 Review Thread
- Thread starter Phoenixmgs
- Start date
that does not surprise me in the slightest. A similar thing happened Resident evil 6 in sales.
I always find it interesting how it's only female characters that ever get this kind of back lash right? Yet nobody gives a shit about every male character being built like a super hero.
And the thing I don't like is the shame that people want to put on attractive female characters. It's almost the same shame that's issued everytime it's "another cis white dude" protagonist. Most of the time the characters aren't even all that attractive, their just women who aren't fat.
Freya in God of War 4, for example, is not a particularly attractive character. She's just a woman, and nothing remarkable imo.
Aloy from Horizon Zero Dawn, is just a girl who looks like she runs from robots alot.
Even the New Lara Croft, isn't anything spectacular.
Tifa and Aerith from FF7Remake aren't......well....okay they're crazy good looking I guess.
I guess what I'm getting at here, is there is nothing wrong with attractive characters. People like attractive characters. Male or female doesn't matter.
I admittedly hated Abby's design, but looking back on it I think I just fucking hate the character I wanted to ***** about even more shit about her. Her design is whatever. It's fine. I hate it, but it's fine. But people clearly don't like her design, and let's face facts here. Rule 34 is a metric that shows you how much attractiveness resonates with an audience.
Overwatch isn't that great of a game, and certainly not one that is worth spending the fuck loads of time on. But it is a cultural hit, because of the attractiveness of the character design (including the men). Even Roadhog the pig mask wearing fat fucker has a certain attractiveness because that is what happens when you design a good character. Even a well designed (ugly) character will have an appeal for people.
And Jim plays it off as cringey or eye-rollingly stupid, but people's desire to jerk their cranks to a character directly relates to how well a character is liked. In Abby's case I don't think it's 100% because of her man-body. I think that some people are stupid, and cannot describe why they truly hate a character on the merits of the character itself, so they result to insulting the physical appearance.
Jim can call it stupid all he wants, but no matter how he wants to play it, he can't stop people from hating Abby.
I know not everyone likes a character based off how much they can't whack off to her or him, for that matter. Yeah whatever reasons, most of them boil down for petty or pointless reasons instead of actual legit reasons. Either way, they are miserable and pathetic with not much going on in their lives.
I just dislike Abby and a majority of the characters in The last of us in general. Another post-apocalyptic world full of assholes, ain't seen that before.
Jim knows he can't stop them from hating Abby, but I'm happy that he's calling out will crap like he sees it. just because there's a lot of haters or lovers, does not make either immune from criticisms.
To me, Abby always looked fine from the front but from the back (when you play as her) her arms did look a bit odd. I have no reason why though, probably because you rarely do see muscular women from the back like that or possibly the character model is a bit off in some way.
It's likely the rigging. Her body type doesn't match with her voice actor's so there's weirdness to her movements I believe.
Her run cycle feels like it lacks some refinement, but then so does Ellie's. With Abby though you can tell they wanted her movement to feel heavier and more "stompy", but I don't feel it was given the time to make it fit well with her realistic design. Kratos in GoW '18 had a similar problem, but it's less noticable due to the more hyper realistic character design. He still looks kinda dorky when he's running though.
It’s likely because the biceps only physically account for about a third of upper arm mass, whereas triceps are two thirds.
The other factor tying into that of course would be viewing angle and how lighting plays off of skin surfaces. Tris look bulkier not only because they are, but the irregular shape of them creates more contrasting tones, giving them a bit more depth. Her model viewer says it all.
The Last of Us Part II has trophies for Grounded and Permadeath
You don’t have to do them at the same time [Update: Apart from Grounded and Permadeath, The Last of Us...
www.destructoid.com
They've added new trophies. Which is stupid.
This game was miserable enough for the two playthroughs I needed to do for the platinum.
I hate when devs add extra trophies post launch, because a lot of people play the game and trophy hunt out of the gate. I'm sure many players who beat the game on Grounded or permadeth already are going to be annoyed at having to do it again for a trophy they should have already earned.
If you wanted difficulty trophies then put them in at launch. Don't add them later just to screw people over months later.
It has always happened the moment the weebs got persecuted and no longer being pandered to in the west and actually being activated counter marketed like "Your Mom hates Dead Space"
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Yeah, can't say I was a fan of Abby's design.
I actually really like her design at the very end of the game quite a bit more. The leaner design with the more squared off shoulders just looks a lot better and more realistic.
Yes, women can be muscular, but to get as muscular as Abby pretty much requires steroids or a pretty extreme hormone imbalance.
Her proportions made her look cartoonish in a hyper realistic art style. Zarya from Overwatch has the same kind of design proportions and Blizzard makes it work so much better.
I actually really like her design at the very end of the game quite a bit more. The leaner design with the more squared off shoulders just looks a lot better and more realistic.
Yes, women can be muscular, but to get as muscular as Abby pretty much requires steroids or a pretty extreme hormone imbalance.
Her proportions made her look cartoonish in a hyper realistic art style. Zarya from Overwatch has the same kind of design proportions and Blizzard makes it work so much better.
The Last of Us Part II has trophies for Grounded and Permadeath
You don’t have to do them at the same time [Update: Apart from Grounded and Permadeath, The Last of Us...
They've added new trophies. Which is stupid.
This game was miserable enough for the two playthroughs I needed to do for the platinum.
I hate when devs add extra trophies post launch, because a lot of people play the game and trophy hunt out of the gate. I'm sure many players who beat the game on Grounded or permadeth already are going to be annoyed at having to do it again for a trophy they should have already earned.
If you wanted difficulty trophies then put them in at launch. Don't add them later just to screw people over months later.
The Last of Us Part 2 getting permadeath, Grounded difficulty in new update
The PS4 game’s trophy screen reveals some upcoming features
It sounds like those are new options/difficulties, but yeah. Same with the Uncharted Collection and getting an extra difficulty needed for Platinum. Even worse is adding trophies through DLC packs, which are usually MP only. I think trophies should lean towards being SP only because we’re already starting to see PS3 games no longer possible to Platinum after servers go away. Most people just end up boosting the more ridiculous MP trophies anyways, so what’s the point.
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Watching Jim's new video, I am struck remembering something that proves gamers don't generally hate over-muscular women.
Remember Dragon's Crown? The game with the really buxom Sorceress that people complained about, including that Scrier guy who ended up getting the creator of the game to draw him a half naked dwarf? Well, I was reading the artbook that came with it a while back which is why I had it fresh in my mind and it turns out that game also had THIS character:
Yes, our badass barbarian archetype is being met by a muscular Amazon. One people genuinely loved, one that nobody complained about like with Abby. See, it isn't just the muscles that instantly make someone look manly, and the Amazon has WAY more muscles than Abby does. No, it is the overall package. The Amazon manages to be unabashedly FEMININE while also being muscular and strong and empowering and so on. In fact, the only people who complained about her I believe were the ones who'd be prone to defend Abby, and they took issue with her revealing outfit, meanwhile they would be the first to defend the sex scene in the last of us 2.
I think my point is clear by now but yeah, Jim is 100% wrong, the muscles aren't the problem, not really. It's the general aesthetic of the character, the whole package. You can't dismiss someone with such a valid concern.
Remember Dragon's Crown? The game with the really buxom Sorceress that people complained about, including that Scrier guy who ended up getting the creator of the game to draw him a half naked dwarf? Well, I was reading the artbook that came with it a while back which is why I had it fresh in my mind and it turns out that game also had THIS character:
Yes, our badass barbarian archetype is being met by a muscular Amazon. One people genuinely loved, one that nobody complained about like with Abby. See, it isn't just the muscles that instantly make someone look manly, and the Amazon has WAY more muscles than Abby does. No, it is the overall package. The Amazon manages to be unabashedly FEMININE while also being muscular and strong and empowering and so on. In fact, the only people who complained about her I believe were the ones who'd be prone to defend Abby, and they took issue with her revealing outfit, meanwhile they would be the first to defend the sex scene in the last of us 2.
I think my point is clear by now but yeah, Jim is 100% wrong, the muscles aren't the problem, not really. It's the general aesthetic of the character, the whole package. You can't dismiss someone with such a valid concern.
Neat, slap some big ol' titties almost pouring out of a chainmail bikini on there. Prettier face, dash of mascara. As much exposed skin as you can get away with. Boris Vallejo that shit. Problem solved, design fixed.
Nah her chest is not that large proportionally. She's just gigantic (second largest playable character in the game) so they are pretty big but in scale when you see her in motion they look like B cups at best. This is what big titties look like with this art style:
And yeah, the face especially goes a long way to make the character likeable and pairs well with the muscles to incorporate them into a feminine whole. I don't think you celebrate women by just having them mimic men, you're just erasing them by that point, might as well have them be a dude. Also it may be a bit hard to see in that image but she has a very hourglass shape too despite the muscles, her hips are very wide and her waist is thin. So you can do muscles in the right way which will not alienate your fans and you still can make people who like muscles in particular happy too.
Ultimately, the point is it's not the muscles. People don't have a problem with muscles.
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Oh, I knew all along that muscles weren't the problem, but that Abby's not designed to be traditionally attractive to straight men i.e. she's not hot.
It's really not just not being hot though. You can have someone look plain and frumpy but that's not gonna make people hate the character or even actively dislike em, it'll be more like an apathetic meh.
So it's less about being unattractive and more how in particular she is unattractive, not by being ugly in a way that you can fix in some way, say with a diet or a wardrobe update or a nose job, but rather by being more fundamentally off-putting in a core sense.
I believe Neil Druckman in a game developers conference stated specifically that he did not want to make his female characters attractive. There is a GDC youtube video.
Which i think is the reason for the design of the ladies. This adds to the reason why people dislike Abby. Her design is deliberately meant to be a put off for people.
When you design characters for an outside belief that very few other people share, you essentially are purposelessly designing characters to be alienating.
The simple fact of life is, everyone EVERYONE likes attractive characters. Regardless of personal preferences that might tip your scale in other directions, nobody looks at a character like Lara Croft and thinks, "Damn she gross." Even if you arent getting your buttons pushed by her, you also arent put off by her due to her just registering as "standard female protagonist #33".
That isnt to say somebody doesnt find Abby hot. Even if someone finds her attractive, there is also no argument that other characters of more traditional attractiveness arent also attractive.
People wonder why characters are always attractive men and women of non offensive skin tone, and the simple answer is to appeal to the majority. Generic characters are safe, thats why most of them are "generic".