Tony Robbins and #MeToo

[secretkeeper12]

So, the motivational speaker Tony Robbins recently made a gaffunk on stage when he said some people misuse the #MeToo movement to feel "significant." Alone, that might not sound so bad; surely there are some people who use a good movement like it for their own personal agenda.

Problem is, he didn't stop there. He was later questioned on his comment by a woman, Nanine McCool, who it turns out is a survivor of sexual assault. On stage, he actually asked Ms. McCool to step up to him, pushed on her, then asked why she resisted.

Yeah...

New York Times covered the story if you want to go in depth: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/09/business/tony-robbins-me-too-apology.html

Proof that this happened [youtube]https://youtu.be/74YILhy4RgE[/youtube]



I gotta say, Tony Robbins never really spoke to me, and for someone who tries to improve others, he's got some learning to do himself. He's not a monster, but he definitely should school himself on appropriate behavior.

Your thoughts, comments, etc.? Let's have a civil discussion; no rage or hate, please.

 

[Thaluikhain]

Is there much to say? Especially if we have to be civil...that's flat out a terrible thing to say/do. That's about it.

 

[Kyrian007]

I really am not surprised. Robbins was an author a "life coach" and "inspirational speaker." Meaning he's made a living (and a pretty good one) peddling "self help" snake oil to rubes. That's already a pretty scummy way to make a living (especially off the backs of people who may be going through some tough times in their lives.) Now someone says he acts like kind of a scumbag. I'm just not surprised. It would be like someone telling me an ID thief was a "bit of a dick sometimes."

And I do apologize to anyone who may have found his "teachings" helpful, but he learned his "trade" from another scammer peddling scientifically discredited bs instead of getting any kind of actual psychology degree. I don't want to discourage anyone having trouble in their lives from turning to someone or something for help, but I guess my advice is stay away from folks who's first suggestion is "give me money." Generally the very rich and successful ones are BEST at making themselves rich, and any help they might give out is a lower priority for them than that.

 

[Bobular]

Everyone deserves a fair trial. There are definite cases where a guy's life has been ruined because of a false rape accusation so yeah, protections need to be put in place to stop that happening.

But in addition to that everyone deserves a fair trial and this incudes the possible rape victim. The same way you shouldn't go around accusing people of rape without proving it you also shouldn't accuse people of faking/hyping up rape charges for the attention without proving it and there needs to be protections put in place to stop that happening too.

 

[ErrrorWayz]

He's got a point, it's totally out of control mob bullying with no fact corroboration. It dangerously tries to elevate and conflate a wide range of sexual behaviours into assault and rape and has put law enforcement into such an invidious position they are routinely withholding evidence in order to force sexual assault convictions (in the UK) because all right thinking modern people know all men are rapists right?

Not really sure why he shoved someone or why her past history makes his point less valid.

 

[Squilookle]

I don't want to discourage anyone having trouble in their lives from turning to someone or something for help, but I guess my advice is stay away from folks who's first suggestion is "give me money."

Then you've just ruled out all forms of professional help anyone could get.

That is terrible advice.

 

[gigastar]

A civil discussion about #MeToo in off topic?

Brave man. I cant wait to see who gets suspended.

I don't want to discourage anyone having trouble in their lives from turning to someone or something for help, but I guess my advice is stay away from folks who's first suggestion is "give me money."

Then you've just ruled out all forms of professional help anyone could get.

That is terrible advice.

Last i checked the police serve people for free.

Unless 'murica turned into the Anarcho-Capitalist paradise everyones been talking about while i wasnt looking...?

 

[Neurotic Void Melody]

Self-help gurus do appear to thrive in places where there exists no functioning state-funded and/or properly regulated mental healthcare. Great business opportunities abound, no doubt. All sounding rather charismatic during the actual speaking process, but nothing retains of any worth afterwards. Like a religious preacher almost. "Don't trust those cynically motivated psychologists making up problems solely for you to keep returning and paying their salaries? No worries, soldier! I got your back! Pay me instead to tell you that you're only as awesome as you believe you are." People with legitimate undiagnosed issues be damned to a fate of mere self-loathing instead. Just watch any modern animated kids film and you'll get pretty much the same message for much cheaper with far more entertainment value. Maybe put on a psy-trance album at the same time if it's all about motivation.

Am a little confused as to the reason why some of his clients say they see hiring attractive women as a risk though. Is this an "attractive women are more likely to make up sexual harrassment stories" thing or a "men will just not be able to help themselves around them" thing? Perhaps a bastard child of both? Sexual harrassment is only a state of mind anyway, bro.

 

[maninahat]

Am a little confused as to the reason why some of his clients say they see hiring attractive women as a risk though. Is this an "attractive women are more likely to make up sexual harrassment stories" thing or a "men will just not be able to help themselves around them" thing? Perhaps a bastard child of both? Sexual harrassment is only a state of mind anyway, bro.

It could also be because the boss was worried that if he hired an attractive women, people would assume he only hired her because she's an attractive woman, so he rejected her for being an attractive women instead. It's hard to say, since this Tony Robbins character was just providing this anecdote to show how justifiably terrified men are of being criticised by women (because who could criticise a guy for refusing a job to women based on her sexiness?).

It's also weird to see a self-help guru trying to explain why women shouldn't become active or speak out, because courage must be a bad thing and being angry at people committing sex crimes against you is wrong.

 

[Kyrian007]

I don't want to discourage anyone having trouble in their lives from turning to someone or something for help, but I guess my advice is stay away from folks who's first suggestion is "give me money."

Then you've just ruled out all forms of professional help anyone could get.

That is terrible advice.

Actual professionals generally work on referral; meaning someone first turned to a friend, family member, medical professional... and that person gave them good advice about approaching a professional. So no, that doesn't rule out professional help. Also, as secure as I am in my own agnosticism I have to admit there are religious based operations that do very good work... pro bono. Plus community centers (in the U.S. anyway) generally have plenty of help groups available, usually for no charge. That may be different by location, but I'm from a little town of less than 4000 people and our center has at least one meeting every night, depending on what you need help with.

 

[Baffle]

Last i checked the police serve people for free.

Unless 'murica turned into the Anarcho-Capitalist paradise everyones been talking about while i wasnt looking...?

Pretty sure they get paid actually. Free at the point of contact isn't the same as free, it's just paid for differently (e.g. the NHS).

 

[gigastar]

Last i checked the police serve people for free.

Unless 'murica turned into the Anarcho-Capitalist paradise everyones been talking about while i wasnt looking...?

Pretty sure they get paid actually. Free at the point of contact isn't the same as free, it's just paid for differently (e.g. the NHS).

Of course they get paid, but you dont hire them to do specific things.

Unless youre in a country like Pakistan but thats wholly unrelated to this.

 

[CaitSeith]

So, the motivational speaker Tony Robbins recently made a gaffunk on stage when he said some people misuse the #MeToo movement to feel "significant." Alone, that might not sound so bad; surely there are some people who use a good movement like it for their own personal agenda.

Problem is, he didn't stop there. He was later questioned on his comment by a woman, Nanine McCool, who it turns out is a survivor of sexual assault. On stage, he actually asked Ms. McCool to step up to him, pushed on her, then asked why she resisted.

Yeah...

New York Times covered the story if you want to go in depth: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/09/business/tony-robbins-me-too-apology.html

Proof that this happened


I gotta say, Tony Robbins never really spoke to me, and for someone who tries to improve others, he's got some learning to do himself. He's not a monster, but he definitely should school himself on appropriate behavior.

Your thoughts, comments, etc.? Let's have a civil discussion; no rage or hate, please.

Spoiler: My opinion about Mr. Tony in the most civil way that I can put it...

 

[Silentpony_v1legacy]

Everyone deserves a fair trial. There are definite cases where a guy's life has been ruined because of a false rape accusation so yeah, protections need to be put in place to stop that happening.

But in addition to that everyone deserves a fair trial and this incudes the possible rape victim. The same way you shouldn't go around accusing people of rape without proving it you also shouldn't accuse people of faking/hyping up rape charges for the attention without proving it and there needs to be protections put in place to stop that happening too.

Eh, kinda? We're still an innocent until proven guilty country. Its not an accused job to prove he didn't rape someone, its the accusers job to prove he did.
Absent any evidence at all, just claiming someone raped someone else isn't enough to get charges, let alone a conviction. Probably isn't enough for an arrest.
Tony went stupidly, horrendously over the line. But his bit about #MeToo being used to people to garner attention, regardless if they've been sexually assaulted, is a legit point to make, and he should have shut his mouth there.

 

[THM]

He's got a point, it's totally out of control mob bullying with no fact corroboration.

THIS. ALL the this. People are losing their jobs based on the whisper of a whisper now. It's insane. I'm glad I work for myself. It's getting to the point that the only way to feel 'safe' is to show up to work with your genitalia in a jar and a sign around your neck saying 'I NO WANT RAPE' - or possibly that's overstating things.

As for the pushing, I can see the point (kinda) in that he's asking the question 'why did you resist now but not then?' (PLEASE NOTE: I'm probably WAY off on that one), but that probably wasn't the best way of expressing it.

 

[Catnip1024]

So, the motivational speaker Tony Robbins recently made a gaffunk on stage when he said some people misuse the #MeToo movement to feel "significant."

Well, people use every hashtag to make themselves feel significant. That's no more of an issue than Twitter in general (which is an issue, don't get me wrong). What really worries people though, is the potential for strategic accusations.

I can't really see what this guy here has done that warrants any sort of internet mob response, though. He's no worse than any other motivational speaker selling bullshit to the masses.

(Actually, saying that, there is a certain irony in a man who makes a living out of making people feel significant complaining about people feeling significant through use of a hashtag...)

 

[Avnger]

So, the motivational speaker Tony Robbins recently made a gaffunk on stage when he said some people misuse the #MeToo movement to feel "significant."

Well, people use every hashtag to make themselves feel significant. That's no more of an issue than Twitter in general (which is an issue, don't get me wrong). What really worries people though, is the potential for strategic accusations.

I can't really see what this guy here has done that warrants any sort of internet mob response, though. He's no worse than any other motivational speaker selling bullshit to the masses.

(Actually, saying that, there is a certain irony in a man who makes a living out of making people feel significant complaining about people feeling significant through use of a hashtag...)

Did you really not read beyond that sentence? I mean it clearly explained how he then followed that up by badgering an actual sexual assault victim on stage. I get that it doesn't fit with your storyline, but come the hell on mate.

 

[Catnip1024]

Did you really not read beyond that sentence? I mean it clearly explained how he then followed that up by badgering an actual sexual assault victim on stage. I get that it doesn't fit with your storyline, but come the hell on mate.

Which is still a bit dodgy, but not out and out worse than any other motivational speaker / wannabe guru out there. It's an industry of sleazy snake-oil salesmen. The guys a prick, but that doesn't exactly elevate him from the crowd.

 

[CaitSeith]

I don't want to discourage anyone having trouble in their lives from turning to someone or something for help, but I guess my advice is stay away from folks who's first suggestion is "give me money."

Then you've just ruled out all forms of professional help anyone could get.

Not in Canada.

 

[FoolKiller]

Everyone deserves a fair trial. There are definite cases where a guy's life has been ruined because of a false rape accusation so yeah, protections need to be put in place to stop that happening.

But in addition to that everyone deserves a fair trial and this incudes the possible rape victim. The same way you shouldn't go around accusing people of rape without proving it you also shouldn't accuse people of faking/hyping up rape charges for the attention without proving it and there needs to be protections put in place to stop that happening too.

Eh, kinda? We're still an innocent until proven guilty country. Its not an accused job to prove he didn't rape someone, its the accusers job to prove he did.
Absent any evidence at all, just claiming someone raped someone else isn't enough to get charges, let alone a conviction. Probably isn't enough for an arrest.
Tony went stupidly, horrendously over the line. But his bit about #MeToo being used to people to garner attention, regardless if they've been sexually assaulted, is a legit point to make, and he should have shut his mouth there.

I agree that it shouldn't be on the accused person to prove their innocence. However, there is one problem and that is while an accusation won't get charges, conviction, or an arrest, false accusations can ruin a person's life. I have a friend who is going through that since the middle of last year and his life is in turmoil.

He's a teacher and he essentially has to fight to prove his innocence if he wants to have any hope of a future even though he didn't do anything wrong. The accusations, even though false, could end his career if they get out. All because of a jealous woman with a broken heart.

And the saddest part of all this is that now anytime him or any of his friends, male or female, hear someone claim they've been raped, we all question it instead of believing her. The worst thing that a false claim does is make everyone question legitimate claims more.