Total War Tactics!

[Realitycrash]

A topic for all of you that enjoy the Total War franchise. Here, we exchange tactics and tips!

Here's a useful one I've discovered concerning Shogun 2: The AI is still a moron.
Now, to be more specific; If you parade a fast cavalry unit (or any unit, but preferably cavalry) in front of an enemy army, there's a good chance that a sizable chunk of it will follow said unit. Now, in siege-battles when playing defense, you can usually lead a entire attacking "side" with one unit, making it run around in circles infront of your castle, allowing you archers to pick it apart. This is very handy when playing on Very Hard and you need breathing-space and handle only one or two attacking sides at a time.

What can you share?

 

[SJXarg]

Related to Shogun 2

Once people declare war on you, it's usually too late for all but the most self-punishing diplomacy to have any effect. I decided to head that off prematurely, by paying tribute to a couple of the big Clans that were nearby. 200/turn for 10 turns is a pittance, paying off 3 Clans like that is less than the cost of a single Samurai unit (without extensive discounting), and you'll still get the huge +relationship boost straight away.

Another neat one, is selling military access to people that are friendly with you. Even in the early stages on the game (first 5-10 turns) you may be able to get 3000-4000 koku for 20 turns of military access, which is a massive boost to your economy. You can also sell that access to multiple Clans to really boost the effectiveness of it, and powerhouse your way through upgrades and training higher quality troops to take provinces you aren't dealing with diplomatically, which just opens up more potential buyers for military accees.

Another trick I have, this time related to the in-game battles, when you're assaulting a superior force in a fort, who don't have any way to attack you from range (think 10-18 spear troops for example), a neat trick is to burn down a gate, and send a durable unit, like a samurai or a warrior monk up the ramp to pull an enemy unit down, then run down the ramp, making sure to keep sliding back into them to "grab" the enemy and keep them engaged. Once you pull a few of them out of the gate, hit them from behind with another melee unit, which will then rout the enemy, and send your general on horseback to run them down as they flee, which not only bypasses "fighting to the death" by removing them from the fort, it's free level-ups for your general(s).

Another one, if they have a lot of men manning the walls, is to send troops on an angle to burn down the gate - the torches will hit the wall beside the gate, and when it catches alight, run back. The wall will topple and kill a significant portion of the defenders standing on it. At the right angle you can also burn down the arrow towers that are inside the walls on the smaller forts, removing a slow but constant source of attrition for your troops.

Finally, having 1-2 Yari Samurai hanging back with your general is an absolutely fantastic way to prevent cavalry flanks from killing your leader and/or bowmen while you're too preoccupied with the front line.

 

[Realitycrash]

Related to Shogun 2

Once people declare war on you, it's usually too late for all but the most self-punishing diplomacy to have any effect. I decided to head that off prematurely, by paying tribute to a couple of the big Clans that were nearby. 200/turn for 10 turns is a pittance, paying off 3 Clans like that is less than the cost of a single Samurai unit (without extensive discounting), and you'll still get the huge +relationship boost straight away.

Another neat one, is selling military access to people that are friendly with you. Even in the early stages on the game (first 5-10 turns) you may be able to get 3000-4000 koku for 20 turns of military access, which is a massive boost to your economy. You can also sell that access to multiple Clans to really boost the effectiveness of it, and powerhouse your way through upgrades and training higher quality troops to take provinces you aren't dealing with diplomatically, which just opens up more potential buyers for military accees.

Another trick I have, this time related to the in-game battles, when you're assaulting a superior force in a fort, who don't have any way to attack you from range (think 10-18 spear troops for example), a neat trick is to burn down a gate, and send a durable unit, like a samurai or a warrior monk up the ramp to pull an enemy unit down, then run down the ramp, making sure to keep sliding back into them to "grab" the enemy and keep them engaged. Once you pull a few of them out of the gate, hit them from behind with another melee unit, which will then rout the enemy, and send your general on horseback to run them down as they flee, which not only bypasses "fighting to the death" by removing them from the fort, it's free level-ups for your general(s).

Another one, if they have a lot of men manning the walls, is to send troops on an angle to burn down the gate - the torches will hit the wall beside the gate, and when it catches alight, run back. The wall will topple and kill a significant portion of the defenders standing on it. At the right angle you can also burn down the arrow towers that are inside the walls on the smaller forts, removing a slow but constant source of attrition for your troops.

Finally, having 1-2 Yari Samurai hanging back with your general is an absolutely fantastic way to prevent cavalry flanks from killing your leader and/or bowmen while you're too preoccupied with the front line.

Great post, smart tactic with selling military access, I hadn't thought of it myself.

I'll add another one;
In Rome: Total War, the AI is (of course) a moron. When defending, hav your main fore stationed in a corner, and keep a few cavalry units hidden far away from it. The AI will march slowly towards your main force, and their General will always be in the rear. When you are sure that your cavalry are behind their main force, rush out and gank their general with you cavalry. The AI will have a really slow response-time in turning their forces around to defend their general. If you have 3-4 Cavalry units vs 1 General, you will more often than not be able to kill off their general before any of their other troops intervene.

 

[BathorysGraveland]

Something I found in Rome: Total War campaign sieging. Also has to do with the moronic AI. If you're assaulting a stone walled city with siege towers, place one tower by one gate and the second or more towers by another gate. Have your entire army form up at the first tower, then when the battle begins march them over to the second tower. The AI's troops will hold their position on the initial walls and will not move any of them until you capture one of their gatehouses, which takes them fucking ages to get over there. You can potentially rush the town center and turn it into a semi-field battle this way.

I discovered this when I attacked Sparta. Rushed my cavalry into the town square, assassinated the Greek king and every single horseman and then retreated them before the Spartans could retaliate (because they were still moving from the walls into the center). Then it was just a case of surrounding them and destroying them in a pila storm. Not a single sweat was broken on horrible wall fighting and doom-fucking-death the defense towers usually put on your troops.

 

[Realitycrash]

Something I found in Rome: Total War campaign sieging. Also has to do with the moronic AI. If you're assaulting a stone walled city with siege towers, place one tower by one gate and the second or more towers by another gate. Have your entire army form up at the first tower, then when the battle begins march them over to the second tower. The AI's troops will hold their position on the initial walls and will not move any of them until you capture one of their gatehouses, which takes them fucking ages to get over there. You can potentially rush the town center and turn it into a semi-field battle this way.

I discovered this when I attacked Sparta. Rushed my cavalry into the town square, assassinated the Greek king and every single horseman and then retreated them before the Spartans could retaliate (because they were still moving from the walls into the center). Then it was just a case of surrounding them and destroying them in a pila storm. Not a single sweat was broken on horrible wall fighting and doom-fucking-death the defense towers usually put on your troops.

I have never, ever produced a single Siege-tower, even on VH/VH. Well, I have produced, just not fought a battle with one. I either auto-resolve, starve the bastards out, or use only rams (for small villages, the only ones I can bother with fighting straight) or sappers (for large cities). Wall-fighting and using towers/ladders is just not worth it, and tends to lead to horrible casualties.

 

[Jamous]

Medieval 2.
Battle Timers are excellent things.

Upgrade for Cannon Towers ASAP and build Trebuchets in each town. Keep one unit of heavy cavalry as a mop-up. If you get sieged, sally forth against the attacking army, but don't leave your City/Castle. Have your trebuchets positioned so that they can fire over your walls (make sure it's not -into- your walls) and they will WRECK the assaulting enemies. Many units will probably flee before the end, and you'll kill a sizable chunk of the army. If there's only one or two small units left, use your cavalry to mop-up the stragglers; if not, just wait for the time limit to end. Rather than losing, the battle ends in a draw and you're free to do the same thing next turn.

Second, keep a unit of cavalry with all forces. If you're ever moving a small force but are ambushed by a vastly superior force, then you can keep the cavalry out of the fray and run around the edge of the map with them. If you keep them alive and unrouted till the end of the timer, you win the battle. It's a useful save in many situations. To use this to full effect, keep them fresh for as long as possible. Enemy cavalry won't be able to catch them because they'll be tired, and therefore slower.

 

[Occams_Razor]

Something I found in Rome: Total War campaign sieging. Also has to do with the moronic AI. If you're assaulting a stone walled city with siege towers, place one tower by one gate and the second or more towers by another gate. Have your entire army form up at the first tower, then when the battle begins march them over to the second tower. The AI's troops will hold their position on the initial walls and will not move any of them until you capture one of their gatehouses, which takes them fucking ages to get over there. You can potentially rush the town center and turn it into a semi-field battle this way.

I discovered this when I attacked Sparta. Rushed my cavalry into the town square, assassinated the Greek king and every single horseman and then retreated them before the Spartans could retaliate (because they were still moving from the walls into the center). Then it was just a case of surrounding them and destroying them in a pila storm. Not a single sweat was broken on horrible wall fighting and doom-fucking-death the defense towers usually put on your troops.

I have never, ever produced a single Siege-tower, even on VH/VH. Well, I have produced, just not fought a battle with one. I either auto-resolve, starve the bastards out, or use only rams (for small villages, the only ones I can bother with fighting straight) or sappers (for large cities). Wall-fighting and using towers/ladders is just not worth it, and tends to lead to horrible casualties.

Agreed, I never really bothered with assaulting cities in Rome, I've always found it more beneficial to starve them out. I try and goad them in to attacking me, that way I can get the defenders advantage and generally can decimate a much larger force. Often if I'm laying siege to a city, they may attack me with one of their larger armies, letting me kill two birds with one stone. And if they don't, well, I just got a city for minimal casualties.

 

[Ilikemilkshake]

Sell/buy/trade Military Access to/from any enemies you don't plan on going to war with immediately, last time I checked that'll stop them from going to war with you unless they cancel it, which gives you a heads up on their plans.

 

[SckizoBoy]

I have never, ever produced a single Siege-tower, even on VH/VH. Well, I have produced, just not fought a battle with one. I either auto-resolve, starve the bastards out, or use only rams (for small villages, the only ones I can bother with fighting straight) or sappers (for large cities). Wall-fighting and using towers/ladders is just not worth it, and tends to lead to horrible casualties.

Not to mention it takes fucking ages. Send the orders to take the walls and you can go do your taxes, get a coffee and come back and they still wouldn't've gotten themselves over.

OT: From R:TW you can, from the strategy map, typically guess which location on the battle map reinforcements will come in from. Line up your infantry along that front and they'll just engage the reinforcements as they come onto the battlefield. The kicker being that the reinforcing units arriving cannot fight back until the whole unit is within the red-border. So you're just sitting there poking them to death. You can deal with a massive army like this with minimal casualties.

From N:TW, set up your artillery on a hill right at the back of the battlefield so they've got a decent wide view and arrange everything else to protect them. Start battle, target the enemy's cavalry and bully them to death. Doesn't matter if they're out of range, artillery will still absolutely destroy them. Once the cavalry's dealt with, take the light infantry out and flank/roll up the enemy foot. The AI just will not move its battle line to deal with this threat, especially if it's two or three units.

Erm... OK, serious stuff now... eh... when I fight 'seriously', I generally use historic methods. Phalanx with missiles in front and cavalry on the flanks, or triplex acies, attack in column (three deep companies then fanning out once they get within engagement range), defence in line etc. etc. Yeah, I'm not very imaginative, but good at adapting, though with the problems the AI has, it's usually not necessary... -_-

 

[Soviet Heavy]

Medieval 2. The Scottish Death Mob.

Whatever Pikeman you can get, take around eight to ten. Form your front line with these guys. Three Archers, two to four cavalry, and the rest are Highland Nobles.

Set up your army like this.

^^^^^^^^^^
C AAA C
I I I I I

Legend: (^=Pikeman, C=Cavalry, A=Archer, I=Highland Nobles)

Just march towards the enemy. Once in range, open up with your archers to draw them into your pikes. If a cavalry unit tries to flank you, intercept with your own Cavalry. Just bog them down long enough to direct one of your Highland Nobles into the Cavalry then pull your own horses out.

In the main body of your army, continue to draw the enemy into your pikes. Once he is fully committed, countercharge with your Highland Nobles. The Pikes will keep them pinned while your heavy infantry rip the opponents to shreds. Rinse, lather, repeat.

This army setup works wonders against Cavalry heavy armies like France or eastern nations.

 

[Joseph Harrison]

snip

Is that why the guy in A Scotsman in Egypt LP like only uses Pikemen? Based on the screenshots it seems like that's his entire army and he always devastates his enemies in battle.

Ot:Uuuuuuum... I'm not really good at Total War games but some advice for sieges...
Whenever you're fighting Milan they always seem to make their entire armies out of genoese crossbowmen and never actually attack you, they just sit outside the walls. What I do is I make armies of like 5-8 cavalry and take 7 of them send them out the back gate of my castle and send them around so they're behind the Milanese army. Then I take my cavalry unit that isn't outside the walls and just send them outside the gates just a little bit so that they draw all of the Milanese units into range of the cannon towers. When the Milanese get close enough to actually attack your units send them back inside the city and the Milanese will return to position. Repeat this process until the army is weak enough that your flanking cavalry can rout the army and run them down.
This may seem like a rather specific circumstance but in my games as Venice, France and the Holy Roman Empire, I've used this to great effect.

 

[BlazeRaider]

Your all fools. The only way to win on M2TW or any total war game for that matter is to spam massive quantities of easily defeated basic troops and win through attrition! My Holy Roman Empire sleeps well at night knowing that there are always thousands of troops dying every turn just doing routine patrol against rebels, tens of thousands if a war is going on.

Read this, look upon this strategy as your new model, and become a god.
http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Imperial_Guard
^Inspiration for all my strategy.

 

[Gennadios]

I think OP tries too hard with Sieges. The tactics are too complex to deal with siege AI, which is a Moron.

I prefer to choose my expansions carefully to give myself access to as many choke points as possible and leave critical locations guarded with 8-10 stacks of Yari or loan-sword Ashigaru.

No matter how many rank 4 Samurai or archers they throw at me, the horde of poorly equipped units with nowhere to retreat and no morale breaks will be able to deal with the initial rush of melee units scrambling up the walls. Eventually, the archers scramble up, which after that point aren't an issue, and finally the pleasure of slaughtering the Daimyo, Son & Heir, and the two generals that dismount and rush the walls themselves.

Seriously, it never fails to work. I very seldom see the AI sieging or retreating after the main melee force is dead or routed.

In Medieval II, I love sneak attacking cities while they have an army nearby. During the enemy turn the nearby army will attack, if all goes well both the castle defense army and he attacking army are slaughtered, causing my force to take control of the town.

The next turn the Pope ALWAYS forces a 5 turn ceasefire, meaning I have 5 turns to shore up defenses and rebuild my forces without fear of retaliation.