Neither is eating food with a knife and fork, but I do that every night. And driving to work. Or biking, if you will. Or work. Hell "society," "money," "religion," "sex," "love," anything you do that's steeped in language isn't a "natural occurrence." The use of the word "tolerated" here seems to be an intentional flame, and if you don't intend to make moral judgement as you claim, I'm not certain what your point is; the argument is just ontological and circular. I'd like to be enlightened though, if you would, as it seems most people in this thread agree with me.
Transgender
- Thread starter SlasherX
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hater's gonna hate. i won't argue with them or agree with them. i'll just stay in my closet and avoid all that drama, thanks. lol. it's worked so far.
This may net me a warning but I have to point out that, the very way you talked about how you feel about transgenders, is the very definition of a bigoted opinion. Having a prejudice against or dislike of a certain group of people based solely on what they are. [link]http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/bigot[/link]SlasherX said:
There are many people who go through the process to change their sex because, both mentally and physiologically, they are more inline with the opposite gender of what they were born as. Who are you to judge them? You would really rather someone be forced to live as someone they know they aren't? That just seems rather cruel.
Oh, and you really think changing sex is an unnatural thing? I do believe science and quite a few species would like to have a word with you. [link]http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m1200/is_n9_v137/ai_8784789/[/link]
i don't understand the reason for making this statement on this forum. what is it that you want? it seems like you are just out for people to agree with you on this. (of disagree because why else would you mention a possible ban).
why is it necessary to come in here and call some people out on how unnatural they are? seems like transsexuality is not a part of your life so maybe you shouldn't get so worked up over it and just let people be.
why is it necessary to come in here and call some people out on how unnatural they are? seems like transsexuality is not a part of your life so maybe you shouldn't get so worked up over it and just let people be.
Firstly, I'm transgendered myself. I speak from experience, yet only for myself, not the trasngendered community at large. No it is not "Natural". A blind man walking with a cane is not "natural", a person with a pacemaker is not natural (looking at you Ames in MGS2!!!). It is a medical condition, and as such, is treated medically. It is classified as both a mental and physical condition.
Secondly, what's the point in something being considered "natural"? In this world, nothing we do is natural. Cars aren't "natural"
Thirdly: It DOES happen in the animal kingdom, albeit for different reasons. Oysters have been known to change their sex, as well as frogs in accordance to demands (I mean, we all remember the scene in Jurrasic Park, but I digress).
Fourthly: Why did this thread have to exist? What did OP hope to gain? I mean, he's saying he's being forced to accept things......
OP, this is the only advice I'm going to give you; I am transgendered. It is my life. You may not like it, and do not have to like it. You do not even have to be silent about your dislike. Just ask yourself, do you get stones thrown at you, insultful comments, even death threats just by walking down the street.
This is a real issue for some people, and if it doesn't affect you, move along.
Secondly, what's the point in something being considered "natural"? In this world, nothing we do is natural. Cars aren't "natural"
Thirdly: It DOES happen in the animal kingdom, albeit for different reasons. Oysters have been known to change their sex, as well as frogs in accordance to demands (I mean, we all remember the scene in Jurrasic Park, but I digress).
Fourthly: Why did this thread have to exist? What did OP hope to gain? I mean, he's saying he's being forced to accept things......
OP, this is the only advice I'm going to give you; I am transgendered. It is my life. You may not like it, and do not have to like it. You do not even have to be silent about your dislike. Just ask yourself, do you get stones thrown at you, insultful comments, even death threats just by walking down the street.
This is a real issue for some people, and if it doesn't affect you, move along.
A lot of things in the world are not natural doesn't mean we are weirded out by them and I'm also going to argue your claim 'Most average people' what average are you subscribing to? An average to you which isn't average for everyone. You are fully entitled to your opinion and I will respect it even if I must sadly disagree with you however an opinion does not make something unnatural just food for thought.
(An example - Planes if we were ever designed to be able to fly why don't we have wings?)
I do believe you being annoyed is over reacting a fair bit read your post again in your first Sentance you said Transgender isn't normal and natural then later claimed 'average' people are weirded out if you are transgender and you are annoyed when people get upset. So answer me would you not get annoyed or upset if someone picked on an aspect in your life and declared because of it you are weird, not nautral or normal? So do you see where they may be getting a little upset with you?
Finally as to address the point as to shoving opinions down peoples throats as the only people who are annoyed by your opinion and that you don't need blind acceptance that may be true however by making a forum thread about this don't you think you are also trying to force your opinion onto others in a similar way?
Then again everything is subjective to personal opinion so you may think what you wish and I will respect your right to that opinion.
(An example - Planes if we were ever designed to be able to fly why don't we have wings?)
I do believe you being annoyed is over reacting a fair bit read your post again in your first Sentance you said Transgender isn't normal and natural then later claimed 'average' people are weirded out if you are transgender and you are annoyed when people get upset. So answer me would you not get annoyed or upset if someone picked on an aspect in your life and declared because of it you are weird, not nautral or normal? So do you see where they may be getting a little upset with you?
Finally as to address the point as to shoving opinions down peoples throats as the only people who are annoyed by your opinion and that you don't need blind acceptance that may be true however by making a forum thread about this don't you think you are also trying to force your opinion onto others in a similar way?
Then again everything is subjective to personal opinion so you may think what you wish and I will respect your right to that opinion.
It's not a person's gender indentity disorder that offends me. I just hate being deceived.
I'd much rather be told, "I'm a [gender] trapped in [another gender's] body." As opposed to, "I'm a woman... [several hours later] with a penis." Sex and gender refer to the respective biological and psychological identity of an individual, and sometimes they don't always match.
I'll definitely acknowledge and tolerate their lifestyle, I just don't want to have to deal with transvestite trickery a la Zelda/Sheik.
I'd much rather be told, "I'm a [gender] trapped in [another gender's] body." As opposed to, "I'm a woman... [several hours later] with a penis." Sex and gender refer to the respective biological and psychological identity of an individual, and sometimes they don't always match.
I'll definitely acknowledge and tolerate their lifestyle, I just don't want to have to deal with transvestite trickery a la Zelda/Sheik.
I thought it had been proven that some people are born with a brain that functions as that of the opposite sex?
" I don't hate them for it, It's not like I avoid them because of it. I'm just saying that it isn't a normal or natural occurrence."
So? Neither is taking a shit indoors and flushing it down a pipe, I bet you'd still rather do that then simply do exactly what is "natural".
If you don't care - as you seem so desperate to try and claim - then why even bring it up?
" I don't hate them for it, It's not like I avoid them because of it. I'm just saying that it isn't a normal or natural occurrence."
So? Neither is taking a shit indoors and flushing it down a pipe, I bet you'd still rather do that then simply do exactly what is "natural".
If you don't care - as you seem so desperate to try and claim - then why even bring it up?
If we did things that were natural, we'd walk around naked, hunting (without tools) and gathering...
Fair enough, if you're saying someone has made the decision to change genders and that they weren't born that way. True, but who cares?
Fair enough, if you're saying someone has made the decision to change genders and that they weren't born that way. True, but who cares?
It's often difficult to say to a person "I'm a [gender] trapped in [another gender's] body" or "I am a transsexual". Some Ts feel, perhaps in a misguided sense of fear, that some's opinion of them should be based on how they interact in the "dating" stage, and not the genitals one of them used to have. Although, if they still currently have their old-sex's genitals, openness is definatly a big point, (to say it less nicely, honesty is best, certainly it should be said when the mention of sex is brought up in a casual encounter but that's just my humble opinon)moosek said:
You could say exactly the same thing about heart transplants.SlasherX said:
You're tired of being called a hater and that you don't dislike transgendered people. So why are you saying this? What is your goal here? As people have already pointed out, being normal and natural does not mean good or worth preserving. Are there are a large number of transgender people claiming to be 'normal' that is offending you in some way? I'm sure a lot of transgender people have a hard time being accepted and feeling normal, and I fail to see why you are making an effort to remind them they are not 'biologically normal'.
Thanks, (if not guessed, Bridgeru is Japanese for Bridget, and I say "it's a trap" all the time, so I'm not exactly above the classic tropes "of my people" xD)feauxx said:what i was trying to say but then a lot better said.
respect for speaking up
To be honest, I just don't see the point of the thread. Like, at all. >.>
I agree with you one-hundred percent. It's definitely not normal to be gay or transgender, but that doesn't make it inherently bad. I mean, I imagine it would cause a few problems for the gay or transgender person, but those problems are there own, not anyone else's. It's definitely not the government's business, at any rate.SlasherX said:
I am agreed. Transgenderism, amongst other things, is not natural. However, that doesn't mean that people who feel that way shouldn't be allowed to express themselves accordingly.
You know what else isn't natural or biologically normal? EVERYTHING ELSE IN OUR LIVES.SlasherX said:
Namely, things like: clothes, glasses, medication, surgery, modern medicine entirely, sanitized water, soap, cooking, polyester, cars, computers, the internet, electricity, batteries, haircuts, romance, houses, TV, radio, music, plumbing, dishes, painting, condoms, religion, politics, light bulbs, jobs... etc, etc, etc.
I think it's fair to say being "natural" or not is hardly relevant.
It's a bit short sighted to put your personal qualms of what is 'normal' above other people's thoughts and feelings towards themselves.
And it's all well and good that people of the LGBT community you personally know can empathise with your point of view but you shouldn't use that as a 'get-out-of-jail-free' card when talking to other people who have view points on the subject.
And it's all well and good that people of the LGBT community you personally know can empathise with your point of view but you shouldn't use that as a 'get-out-of-jail-free' card when talking to other people who have view points on the subject.
Perhaps you're already decided fully on this viewpoint, which is your own and I fully understand what you mean, and your intentions are admirable. But I've been dumped for my physical body before, a few times infact. It isn't easy on the person.bahumat42 said:
What I mean to say is, if you find a nice girl, please don't let the mere fact that a) despite her now being a girl she didn't start life as one (well, post-foetus I mean), and b) the fact that she cannot have children be the sole reason to end a relationship.
And this thread is starting to tire me tonight (mainly because the OP didn't return and it's just people focusing on the same issue, but I digress), if anyone for some reason has questions about transsexualism (like,those who think they might be trans) feel free to message me because I've been/going through it. Hope it helped anyone.
I had my own issues with this that are only loosely related.
When I was about 19 and still hadn't grown out of that angsty teen phase, I dated a 28 year old just coming out of a marriage for about 6ish months. "She" was waaaayyyy out of my league in pretty much every way(to the point of being outright suspicious, but I played the gullible fool masterfully), so of course eventually the actual truth came out that this very attractive and interesting woman actually had a penis that was still in the process of being edited.
What's an angsty teen, yet to turn into a competent adult, supposed to do in that situation? The obvious thing, get pissed as hell and paint everyone in that group with the same color paint. For quite a while I was almost violently opposed to the entire thing.
Well, that's been an unspecified-but-significant number of years ago, and I'm pretty much over it now. Still, I do take issue with calling men women just because they think they are. I'm willing to ease it up to at least requiring a man to appear female before calling him "her", but as far as relationships go that dirty laundry needs to be aired out in advance, not in a bedroom decorated with recently worn clothing. Just allowing people to freely assign themselves their gender tends to cause problems that shouldn't ever be happening.
Edit: My entire rant there seems to only target men changing to women. I don't really like calling women men when they are obviously still women, but I've never really met a convincing woman -> man switch(Even saw one with facial hair, it just looked like a chubby chick with an early puberty mustache). Also it can't ever affect me, it makes it a bit difficult to get all up in arms about it.
When I was about 19 and still hadn't grown out of that angsty teen phase, I dated a 28 year old just coming out of a marriage for about 6ish months. "She" was waaaayyyy out of my league in pretty much every way(to the point of being outright suspicious, but I played the gullible fool masterfully), so of course eventually the actual truth came out that this very attractive and interesting woman actually had a penis that was still in the process of being edited.
What's an angsty teen, yet to turn into a competent adult, supposed to do in that situation? The obvious thing, get pissed as hell and paint everyone in that group with the same color paint. For quite a while I was almost violently opposed to the entire thing.
Well, that's been an unspecified-but-significant number of years ago, and I'm pretty much over it now. Still, I do take issue with calling men women just because they think they are. I'm willing to ease it up to at least requiring a man to appear female before calling him "her", but as far as relationships go that dirty laundry needs to be aired out in advance, not in a bedroom decorated with recently worn clothing. Just allowing people to freely assign themselves their gender tends to cause problems that shouldn't ever be happening.
Edit: My entire rant there seems to only target men changing to women. I don't really like calling women men when they are obviously still women, but I've never really met a convincing woman -> man switch(Even saw one with facial hair, it just looked like a chubby chick with an early puberty mustache). Also it can't ever affect me, it makes it a bit difficult to get all up in arms about it.