WandaVision

Nick Calandra

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Just in case you guys missed it, we recently launched A Marvelous Escape on the movies channel which is a weekly discussion on the Marvel TV episodes. We did all of WandaVision and start Falcon and the Winter Soldier coverage this weekend.

 

Chimpzy

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Why is White/Phantom Vision not just Ultron? I know in the comics Vision has a different backstory, but in the MCU Ultron + the mind stone = Vision, and now Vision doesn't have the mind stone.
MCU Vision is not Ultron. Never was.

Ultron created the body, using the Mind Stone as its power source, but Cap and co prevented him from uploading himself into it. The "operating system" in the Vision is the Jarvis AI, put there by Tony and Banner. White Vision is the original body with that OS still installed, there just wasn't anything to power it anymore, cuz no infinity stones. The explanation for why they got it back up and running again is kind of lame tho: a drone with some of Wanda's power (which is stone-boosted) left in it, which is apparently as good as a proper stone.
 

laggyteabag

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How was that a twist? If you seen like 10 movies in your whole life, you'd know from the 1st scene who the bad guy is. I don't even know Iron Man comics or the character and I knew who the bad guy was after the first scene of the movie.
Killian being a villain wasn't a twist. Im pretty sure anyone woth half a brain-cell knew that he would turn out to be a baddie. I mean, the dude is called "Aldrich Killian", being evil might as well have been on the guy's birth certificate. The twist I was referring to, was The Mandarin being fake. I expected Killian and The Mandarin to maybe be in kahoots or something, but I never in a million years expected The Mandarin to be a complete fabrication, especially not as goofy as it was.

Also come to think of it, Agents of Shield did a whole Darkhold storyline. I guess WandaVision just renders AoS noncanon?
The canonicity of the MCU's shows outside of D+ has been in question, in my mind, for a while.

I mean, Mahershala Ali who played Cottonmouth in the Luke Cage series is now going to be playing Blade, and that is going to be a completely new character in the MCU, so that indicates that maybe Netflix's Luke Cage isn't canon. But, things get a little shaky when you consider that Netflix's Daredevil is rumoured to show up in Spider-Man 3 (alongside seemingly everybody else). So what is canon, and what isn't?

Officially, the current stance AFAIK is it is canon, but I wouldn't be surprised if most of it was swept under the rug later on down the line, retconned, or replaced with some kind of multiverse shenanigans.
 
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Eacaraxe

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Also come to think of it, Agents of Shield did a whole Darkhold storyline. I guess WandaVision just renders AoS noncanon?
Ike Perlmutter being a racist POS, and the shit-flinging contest between him and Feige thanks to Perlmutter being a racist POS, rendered AoS non-canon. Along with the other shows and Netflix Marvel. Perlmutter retained creative control over the television stuff while Feige had creative control over the films, after the 2015 Marvel Studios restructuring that saw Feige reporting directly to Disney. Hence Daredevil and Jessica Jones season 1's referencing the Avengers whereas everything after it had no MCU tie-in, whilst MCU tie-ins on AoS ended mid-season 2 and Agent Carter was only minimally tied into the MCU.

Hayward shows Wanda Visions corpse, and then I think it was 9 days later he brings Monica and the others in to help with the Hex. Okay, sure. But they have been experimenting on Vision for the last 5 years, since his death in Infinity War, and then like the next day White Vision is fully assembled from the body. So...what were they doing the past 5 years that they managed to finish in a handful of days that led to White Vision?
The more interesting story is how SWORD managed to wrestle a few billion dollars' worth of vibranium in the form of Vision's "corpse" away from Wakanda.
 

Dalisclock

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The more interesting story is how SWORD managed to wrestle a few billion dollars' worth of vibranium in the form of Vision's "corpse" away from Wakanda.
It's possible they made the claim they "owned" vision(the SWORD director more or less said this when Wanda confronted him) and somehow made it work legally(Don't ask me how that works), or they offered Wakanda some kind of sweetheart deal in return.

SWORD: You can have Florida, Texas and California in exchange for Vision's body.
*Beat*
Wakanda: Come back when you're serious about this.
 
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Phoenixmgs

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Killian being a villain wasn't a twist. Im pretty sure anyone woth half a brain-cell knew that he would turn out to be a baddie. I mean, the dude is called "Aldrich Killian", being evil might as well have been on the guy's birth certificate. The twist I was referring to, was The Mandarin being fake. I expected Killian and The Mandarin to maybe be in kahoots or something, but I never in a million years expected The Mandarin to be a complete fabrication, especially not as goofy as it was.
I guess it was because I just didn't know the character and the character is what you'd think he was if you didn't know the character.
 

SilentPony

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It's possible they made the claim they "owned" vision(the SWORD director more or less said this when Wanda confronted him) and somehow made it work legally(Don't ask me how that works), or they offered Wakanda some kind of sweetheart deal in return.

SWORD: You can have Florida, Texas and California in exchange for Vision's body.
*Beat*
Wakanda: Come back when you're serious about this.
See I'm guessing they offered aid. I mean Vision is dead in Wakanda, but so is Black Panther, Shuri, the Queen, half of the Wakanda's armies, etc...
Plus Infinity War ends with Captain kneeling next to Vision's corpse, so I can imagine the Avengers taking his body with them, and maybe somehow SWORD convinced them they could bring him back or something. I can't imagine Captain America or Black Widow leaving his body behind.
 

SilentPony

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Reminding his agent he actually has a movie deal so why would he waste his time on TV?
Honestly my thought was money is money, and they simply didn't have the budget to afford him, even for a 1 episode cameo. Its why I never thought they'd get Patrick Stewart or James McAvoy, just getting them on set would have broken the bank for a subscription service streaming show.
 

Johnny Novgorod

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The MCU is doing an exceptional job at catering to my incredibly low-bar expectations for the franchise. Im having a great time.
I'm sure they are and I bet you do. I'm not walking around with a sandwich board telling people Disney is cancer, even if it spreads like one.
Honestly my thought was money is money, and they simply didn't have the budget to afford him, even for a 1 episode cameo. Its why I never thought they'd get Patrick Stewart or James McAvoy, just getting them on set would have broken the bank for a subscription service streaming show.
It's always money. They already tried to get A-listers on Agents of Shield and the most they could swing was 2 minutes of Nick Fury. Look up the TV interview where the Coulson actor pitches the show to RDJ & co. It's embarrassing.
 

SilentPony

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It's always money. They already tried to get A-listers on Agents of Shield and the most they could swing was 2 minutes of Nick Fury. Look up the TV interview where the Coulson actor pitches the show to RDJ & co. It's embarrassing.
Which is a shame because if anyone doesn't need to worry about money, in an MCU star. Robert Downey Jr has more money that the entire lifetime's networth of everyone on this forum combined, he doesn't need to act a single second ever again and his great great great grandchildren will still live comfortably. He has hundreds of millions of dollars, and knowing Hollywood financing its mostly in secret holdings in barely legal off shore accounts on some small island nation that exists purely as a tax haven.
If I was him, and his character was still alive in the MCU, fuck yeah I'll be in the show. Have me show up in episode...5 of any given show to give the heroes their new suits, and call them cool dudes, and leave.
Although on the flip side I can see tv actors thinking its bullshit they're characters, and thus careers, aren't legitimate until an MCU star shows up and accepts them. I can see the cast of Agents of Shield not wanting RDJ or Scarlet Johannsson showing up, completely up-staging them and now the best episodes of the TV are ones with the guest stars. I can see that being a real sticking point for them.
 

Gethsemani

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If I was him, and his character was still alive in the MCU, fuck yeah I'll be in the show. Have me show up in episode...5 of any given show to give the heroes their new suits, and call them cool dudes, and leave.
My bet is on the SAG having a lot of things to say about it. They are notorious for not letting anything slide that would have an established actor take a pay cut when working for an established studio (at best they can look the other way while high profile actors go indie).
 

Johnny Novgorod

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Which is a shame because if anyone doesn't need to worry about money, in an MCU star. Robert Downey Jr has more money that the entire lifetime's networth of everyone on this forum combined, he doesn't need to act a single second ever again and his great great great grandchildren will still live comfortably. He has hundreds of millions of dollars, and knowing Hollywood financing its mostly in secret holdings in barely legal off shore accounts on some small island nation that exists purely as a tax haven.
If I was him, and his character was still alive in the MCU, fuck yeah I'll be in the show. Have me show up in episode...5 of any given show to give the heroes their new suits, and call them cool dudes, and leave.
Although on the flip side I can see tv actors thinking its bullshit they're characters, and thus careers, aren't legitimate until an MCU star shows up and accepts them. I can see the cast of Agents of Shield not wanting RDJ or Scarlet Johannsson showing up, completely up-staging them and now the best episodes of the TV are ones with the guest stars. I can see that being a real sticking point for them.
I think it's less about the material need for money and more of a status thing. Robert Duvall always tells the story of why he refused to return for Godfather III: not because he wasn't offered a shit ton of money, but because Pacino was given 5 times that. How much of a slap is it for TV actors when a guest star makes more money in an afternoon than they do all year working the same venue? And how humiliating is it for the star to have people either think your movie career is over or that you're contractually obligated to fly-bys like some kind of party clown? Also, the real money in TV is the backend. Notice how any show starring a big shot is almost invariably exec produced by that big shot, either because they want to break into creative work and/or they get to work on their own terms, something Disney would never allow.
 

sXeth

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Honestly my thought was money is money, and they simply didn't have the budget to afford him, even for a 1 episode cameo. Its why I never thought they'd get Patrick Stewart or James McAvoy, just getting them on set would have broken the bank for a subscription service streaming show.

>_>

You realize Patrick Stewart is literally currently on a subscription service streaming show... right? (He also doesn't seem super hard to book, looking at some stuff he's been in. Although thats mostly voice acting)
 

SilentPony

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>_>

You realize Patrick Stewart is literally currently on a subscription service streaming show... right? (He also doesn't seem super hard to book, looking at some stuff he's been in. Although thats mostly voice acting)
I realize that a TV show that budgets Patrick Stewart as its main draw and focus has a much bigger PS budget than an third rung Marvel show, when Patrick Stewart isn't even in the MCU.