Was Dragon Age II really that bad?

[Woodsey]

They turned Dragon Age into Mass Effect when it never needed to be.

They could've just let DA be its own thing, but apparently that wasn't good enough for EA.

I am dubious as to how much this is EA's fault. Time was obviously an issue, but trying to take it in a direction that people didn't play the original for does seem to be some full-retard logic that occurred with the project leads at BioWare.

 

[Sp3ratus]

I enjoyed it, I thought it was a fun, if average game. I agree with most of the comments in here, regarding the flaws, but I'd like to add another two new ones; spawning enemies and difficulty. The spawning enemenies part really annoyed me, I don't understand why they didn't stick with the ability to see what enemies you were supposed to defeat, like in DA:O.

This also leads me to difficulty. Bioware, for some reason, really, really fucked up balancing in DA2. I tried playing on nightmare and it just sucked. I enjoyed nightmare mode in DA:O a lot, it was a challenge, but it was fun and manageable, unlike DA2. The idea of nightmare mode is intriguing and I really wanted to like it, but I just couldn't. Enemies who oneshot random people, stupid amounts of spawning enemies and ridiculous boss fight just turned me off nightmare mode completely and made me play on hard instead. I mean hell, if I wanted to play on nightmare, most strategies involved running away and/or kiting enemies. I don't think it was supposed to be like that and if that was actually the intent, I'm glad I didn't stick with it.

 

[RedEyesBlackGamer]

They also:

Spoiler

Retconned Leliana's death for some, and they tried to imply a connection between Hawke going missing and my Warden dying. This is two completely unrelated people, one of whom Leliana was shagging, and she describes him as missing. When he had died.

It was some pretty spectacularly lazy writing.

As I've read on the forums, one that they deeply regret not specifying properly in-game:

Spoiler: DA2 spoilers

She means that your Warden's body has disappeared from his/her resting place.As for Leliana... do remember that you killed her right next to the Urn of Sacred Ashes

Spoiler

Ashes that you ruined, remember? That is why she attacks you. Double

OP: It was a big meh wrapped in disappoint and unnecessary retcons. Origins was meant to be its own game. You can tell that Bioware desperately tried to shoehorn a connection between the two games.

Edit: I forgot laziness. DA2 reeked of it. Wave spawning, anyone?

 

[RagTagBand]

No not really; A few plot grievances here and there (Depending on how/if you played the first) and too many copy pasted dungeons and maps but ultimately it was still a half decent game.

What it WASNT was the second coming of Jesus Christ holding a D&D board and announcing the return of RPG's from the mid-90's, which is what (judging from the reaction) people were expecting, instead they got a merely Average Action RPG experience.

Personally I wasn't surprised that it wasn't brilliant, the Development time was only 14 months and I've seen far worse from games which have had more time than that (Alan Wake springs to mind) But ultimately I had fun in DA2 and not a significant amount less than I did with DA1

 

[Melon_Commander]

I enjoyed DA2, although I never played Origins. I though the combat was some of the most spectacular I've seen, characters felt powerful and animations were brutal (particularly as a mage). I didn't really mind the re-using of environments, it was a little annoying at first but didnt ruin the game for me. Having never played Origins I can't really say anything about the quality of the story and choices, but I thought it was pretty good. I also enjoyed Kirkwall as the main location, it meant you got to learn about that environment in good detail and really get to understand whats going on, rather than being carted off to new places every 10 minutes.

In conclusion I don't really agree with PC Gamer's 'RPG of the decade' statement, but I do think it is a very competent game and didnt deserve all the haters

 

[blackdwarf]

it was a solid game, but just not that good as origins. and it was rushed.

 

[MisterShine]

Spoiler

Ashes that you ruined, remember? That is why she attacks you. Double

Spoiler: DA:O spoilers

If you bring Oghren with you, he talks about how the area you're in is literally brimming with Lyrium, which he says could be how the Guardian and the Gauntlet were formed, as opposed to some Divine Intervention. True you destroyed the ashes, but you also left the body(s) there, in that mountain filled with magic and lyrium. I won't say bringing her back isn't something of a retcon and how it was presented in DA2 wasn't very good, however that mountain is the only place where Leliana can die in the game, and they did that deliberately. Similar to how you can't kill Morrigan anywhere (sadly)

 

[Andothul]

Dragon Age 2 wasnt a BAD game it just wasnt up to snuff to the original and over simplified.

It was like Cars 2 yeah its good but we expect beyond great from Bioware and it felt a little half-assed.

Like Pixar people just expect a higher quality of game from anything Bioware

 

[Apprentice88]

No it wasn't anywhere near as bad as people complain.

The only grievances I had with the game were the narrative continuity errors between Origins and the recycled environments however other than those the game was pretty solid.

 

[Ninjamedic]

DA:Origins was a linear action-RPG with little choice and depth with writing which ranged from alright to lazy. I hoped that DA2 was going to be better but after seeing the reaction to it and watching my brothers gf play it for an hour I decided to ignore it.

Honestly why do bioware get so much praise nowadays?

 

[RedEyesBlackGamer]

Spoiler

Ashes that you ruined, remember? That is why she attacks you. Double

Spoiler: DA:O spoilers

If you bring Oghren with you, he talks about how the area you're in is literally brimming with Lyrium, which he says could be how the Guardian and the Gauntlet were formed, as opposed to some Divine Intervention. True you destroyed the ashes, but you also left the body(s) there, in that mountain filled with magic and lyrium. I won't say bringing her back isn't something of a retcon and how it was presented in DA2 wasn't very good, however that mountain is the only place where Leliana can die in the game, and they did that deliberately. Similar to how you can't kill Morrigan anywhere (sadly)

Spoiler

But it didn't serve any point besides fanservice. Oh look, Leliana is with the Chantry again. Huh, I thought we were dating and she was hardened. Or I thought she was dead. It didn't have a point other than to piss off fans.
That was my reaction to the writing staff.

 

[kalt_13]

The reuse of buildings doesn't bother me as much as it does other people. Mass effect did the same thing and I enjoyed that game.

The main problem I had was the story, a good rpg should make me want to go back and do things differently this didn't. When I finished the game it was meh.

 

[Casual Shinji]

They turned Dragon Age into Mass Effect when it never needed to be.

They could've just let DA be its own thing, but apparently that wasn't good enough for EA.

I am dubious as to how much this is EA's fault. Time was obviously an issue, but trying to take it in a direction that people didn't play the original for does seem to be some full-retard logic that occurred with the project leads at BioWare.

It's not all EA's fault, but I'm holding them indirectly responsible.

EA wanted Bioware to crank out a sequel as fast as possible to turn DA into a lucrative franchise. And because Bioware only had like half a year to make an RPG, what better way to swift production along then to simply take Mass Effect as a template for the sequel.

Dragon Age 2 would've been atleast decent if you had actual choices in the game, instead of the game forcing its choices on you. That whole "serial killer" subplot is the worst offender in this regard.

 

[Woodsey]

They turned Dragon Age into Mass Effect when it never needed to be.

They could've just let DA be its own thing, but apparently that wasn't good enough for EA.

I am dubious as to how much this is EA's fault. Time was obviously an issue, but trying to take it in a direction that people didn't play the original for does seem to be some full-retard logic that occurred with the project leads at BioWare.

It's not all EA's fault, but I'm holding them indirectly responsible.

EA wanted Bioware to crank out a sequel as fast as possible to turn DA into a lucrative franchise. And because Bioware only had like half a year to make an RPG, what better way to swift production along then to simply take Mass Effect as a template for the sequel.

Dragon Age 2 would've been atleast decent if you had actual choices in the game, instead of the game forcing its choices on you. That whole "serial killer" subplot is the worst offender in this regard.

They had around 18 months, not 6.

 

[Ninjamedic]

Dragon Age 2 would've been atleast decent if you had actual choices in the game, instead of the game forcing its choices on you.

Isn't that the problem with Origins as well?

 

[Casual Shinji]

They turned Dragon Age into Mass Effect when it never needed to be.

They could've just let DA be its own thing, but apparently that wasn't good enough for EA.

I am dubious as to how much this is EA's fault. Time was obviously an issue, but trying to take it in a direction that people didn't play the original for does seem to be some full-retard logic that occurred with the project leads at BioWare.

It's not all EA's fault, but I'm holding them indirectly responsible.

EA wanted Bioware to crank out a sequel as fast as possible to turn DA into a lucrative franchise. And because Bioware only had like half a year to make an RPG, what better way to swift production along then to simply take Mass Effect as a template for the sequel.

Dragon Age 2 would've been atleast decent if you had actual choices in the game, instead of the game forcing its choices on you. That whole "serial killer" subplot is the worst offender in this regard.

They had around 18 months, not 6.

Oops sorry, I meant to say one and a half years.

 

[MisterShine]

Honestly why do bioware get so much praise nowadays?

Cuz' they can run circles making rude hand gestures around 90% of other game developers stories and characters, even on a sick day? Same as it has always been, I think.

Spoiler

But it didn't serve any point besides fanservice. Oh look, Leliana is with the Chantry again. Huh, I thought we were dating and she was hardened. Or I thought she was dead. It didn't have a point other than to piss off fans.

Spoiler

It never occurred to you the reaction they were hoping for was "Hey wait a minute... didn't I kill her? Why is she alive now? OH SNAP PLOT TWI... CLIFFHANGER? WTF? Ooh, that was good"

Cuz' that was my reaction at any rate. Again, I can see why if you expected the games to be completely self-contained this would annoy you, but I wouldn't call it a damning flaw if people can easily see it another way.

Why say it was pointless? This new mysterious branch of the Chantry pops up like some kind of Black Ops squad who work for the Divine and you think this ISN'T going to come up in DA3? Really? C'mon now. And it actually came up in the third act, she has her own quest for you. Might be only if she's 'alive' in your imported playthrough. There are like half a dozen hints that the next game is taking place in Orlais anyway.

 

[Canadish]

Yes, it really, really was that bad.
Everything just went wrong for this game from the word go.

Main thing, EA gave Bioware just over a year on the project. Already dead in the water.

Second thing, Brent Knowles, the lead designer from Origins walked out sickened by the idea of being forced to make a rushed "awesome" game. http://blog.brentknowles.com/2010/08/15/bioware-brent-year-10-fall-2008-summer-2009/
Mike "Jade Empire" Laidlaw took his place afterward.

David Silverman. "Awesome, button, connection!" He got drunk during a press interview and revealed that they didn't put any detail into the environments because "No one notices that shit anyway". We did. And we also notice when it's NOT there.

Forth thing, one of the new major writers they took on board HATES playing video games, describing that part of her job as "detestable", and only did it because she had to see what it sounded like during the transfer from page to game.
She's also an on-record Twilight fan, along with Gaider, who formed some kind of un-holy duo.
And that's why all the romance options were a bunch of pathetic whining idiots. Lots of angst and "drama".
"Giggle-Squee".

There, a few points that are not often brought up in discussion, but very relevant.

The game itself was an unfinished, glitchy, button mashing disaster that not only abandoned it's core fanbase, but damaged Bioware's thus far near perfect reputation and lost the company Brent Knowles.

The only saving grace was that it bombed in sales. Which hopefully means other Bioware titles, or even other companies, wont follow in it's footsteps.

Right?
Right!?
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.282070-No-Meaningless-Stat-Games-in-Mass-Effect-3
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/111515-Skyrim-Streamlining-Removes-Confusion-Says-Bethesda

 

[faspxina]

All I wanted from DA2 was to be more "hack & slash" and less "point & click", and it did just that. I also liked way the story was presented, dividing it into 3 acts, even if it became a little more linear than the first. So I'm pretty satisfied with it.

The recycled dungeons, while disappointing, didn't ruin the game for me. But I do hope Bioware doesn't do that kind of stuff again.

 

[Zhukov]

Hey look! It's a time-traveling thread from March 2011.

Anyway, I can understand why a lot of people were turned off it. Personally I thought it was alright. I enjoyed it about as much as the first one. Narrative was a bit of a mess though.