What is it with British accents?

[Warforger]

Before I go into this rant, I'd like to say I'm a fan of history, be it whatever wherever whenever. I in turn get very interested in history movies. Which is why I feel a little outraged every time I hear a goddamn British accent on someone who historically did not even speak a Germanic language much less live in the Isles. By this I mean every time there's a movie depicting Romans, they speak English in a British accent. Sometimes it's so awful they have goddamn Napoleon Bonaparte speaking in a British accent. That is a downright insult to the man. I mean good lord, the people who make these movies went through the trouble to trying to create the right costumes, buildings and characters for their setting and then they make the characters speak in a British accent? At the very least have Romans speaking in an Italian accent, or even better have them speaking Latin with subtitles in English. If you're going to make a movie about Napoleon at least make him speak in a French accent. I know this is perfectly reasonable, I've seen documentaries from Eastern Europe about say the invasion of Czechoslovakia 1968 with the Soviets not only speaking in a Russian accent but also in Russian requiring subtitles in my native language of Bulgarian. Even then there are linguistic courses where people learn to speak in a British accent, I'm sure there's a way to do it for other accents as well. The problem with this is that it creates or reflects a sort of ethno-centrism; every great leader or "cultured" people are depicted with British accents because British society is looked at as high class. Thus instead of associating the Romans with say Italians, Romanians or French people people would get the impression they're associated with the British. Even though the modern British are nothing like the British the Romans conquered.

 

[Thaluikhain]

British, or at least certain English accents are seen as being upper class, so they get used.

I remember one Doctor Who story where an alien leader had a Scottish accent, which seemed really weird. If he'd had an English accent, it wouldn't have been noticeably, because aliens just do talk like English people.

(Likewise, Australian made shows which have Australian accented space monsters just seem odd)

 

[sXeth]

Britain was (and still largely is) the main centre of English-speaking classical theatre. US, Canada, and Australia have it certainly, but its much more a mainstream thing there. So when the filmmaker is looking to cast high dramatic actors, they often dip into that well. The tendency to associate historical drama with higher drama has led to such castings being the standard, and its sort of fallen into being a trope of sorts, where the british accent has become a "standard dramatic voice".

 

[elvor0]

First up, paragraphs!

Secondly, dodginess having British accents on other ethnicities aside; I really don't think people are really that thick. Someone watching a show about Romans, is not going to think "Oh they must be British or associated with them in some way!" And if they are that stupid, they've likely got bigger issues.

Plus you've gotta work with what you got, if you can't get a troupe of Italian actors, and your actors can't do a decent Italian accent without sounding like Mario, then just suspend disbelief and have the actors talk normally. And most people don't want to read subtitles. Sure a lot of us are used to it here, as a fair few of us watch anime, but your general populace? They don't want to read subtitles, and there's nothing wrong with that.

That or you interpret as being translated for you and they /are/ all speaking Latin.

I mean MGS3 is a good example, except when two American people are talking to each other, the characters are all actually speaking Russian. Sokolov states that "Your Russian is excellent, America is a scary place", despite them never actually audibly speaking Russian in that scene, and Sokolovs voice actor is English, but he is in reality speaking Russian throughout all the scenes he's in.

 

[JoJo]

I believe a lot of US-made films use British accents for historical or fantasy settings, since they sound exotic but not too exotic. For example, I'd imagine Romans speaking English in an Italian accent would sound a little silly and out of place, and arguably be no more accurate since modern Italians mostly likely speak quite differently to their Latin-speaking forbears.

 

[Zhukov]

If you're having historical characters speaking modern English when the real people they are based on spoke another language entirely then getting sniffy over the accent they use seems rather trifling.

So yes, having them speak their actual language with subtitles would be best. However, that would involve more effort for less payoff since a lot of people can't stand subtitles.

 

[McKinsey]

The answer to your question is very simple. British English and British pronunciation is considered to be the purest form of English language, and American English and all the other variations and dialects are its degenerative cousins. So, since we can't recreate the tongue those ancient people spoke, we look to the thing closest to it on the lingustic timeline, and it just happens to be BE.

To put it another way, BE is the oldest form of English compared to all its other contemporary forms, and thus the most logical candidate for an Olden Tongue Substitute.

 

[Coppernerves]

I'm guessing it's because we had histories' largest empire by land area and population, with many attempts to "civilise" countries, though the modern British are nothing like the British who conquered.

RP also sounds very old fashioned due to it's traditional institution ("it's not what it's *pardon*", even though I suspect an American Southern drawl is actually older.

Actually, I think the trope isn't so much "British Accent", (general cosmopolitan British English sounds quite different, as "Recieved Pronunciation", as it was taught in highly regarded, and expensive boarding schools.

Still nowadays people have started to find RP a bit silly, and are more comforted to hear a Yorkshireman in charge, they give the impression of actually knowing what they're talking about rather than having dabbled a bit in everything. (Think "modern major general")

Spoiler: Here's an example of a mild Yorkshire Accent:

 

[Casual Shinji]

So yes, having them speak their actual language with subtitles would be best. However, that would involve more effort for less payoff since a lot of people can't stand subtitles.

It can also make the actors not perform as well as they should. Sure, having them speak in latin or mayan may sound more authentic, but it can also make them come across more wooden and constructed. Because they have to put all their effort into speaking a dead language.

British generally feels like a classic dialect, that most actors can express themselves with perfectly. So it's a fine middle ground.

 

[Hazy992]

RP sounds a lot more anachronistic than American English accents, so outside of just having it in the native language its one of the better options.

 

[Mutie]

[EDIT: I am currently trying to figure out how the hell to put youtube vids on a post, been on the site 5 years and never done it successfully -.- EDIT: It's not going to work, I've just up, just follow the bloody links ]

If you're going down this route, I honestly think it's more offensive to replace the actual language of the character with some accented form of the audience language, as opposed to just having them speak normally (unless it is as foreign character speak, in-character, in a different language. An excellent example of parody in regards to the subject can be found in the "Brisitsh" character Officer Crabtree in the sitcom 'Allo 'Allo.

Additionally, my favourite bit from Mock the Week's "things you wouldn't expect to hear" round (the subject being War Films), Hugh Dennis says, in a thick German accent, "WHY ARE WE SPEAKING ENGLISH!?" - Brilliant.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxja0YhOUTM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGNVU5ZjlgA

 

[Muspelheim]

It's an audial shorthand for "Ruling, administrative or learned classes". Whether it works or not is dubious, but it's usually either that or the actual language (if possible) which would mean subtitles. And people don't seem very keen on those.

But that is the least problem in historical films, I feel. For instance, I find it more jarring when the men in a film set in a different time acts according to expectations from today. In short, not enough weeping Spartans.

 

[Thaluikhain]

[EDIT: I am currently trying to figure out how the hell to put youtube vids on a post, been on the site 5 years and never done it successfully -.- ]

You take the link, and put the stuff after the "V=" in brackets after "youtube="

Like this:

Spoiler

 

[Mutie]

[EDIT: I am currently trying to figure out how the hell to put youtube vids on a post, been on the site 5 years and never done it successfully -.- ]

You take the link, and put the stuff after the "V=" in brackets after "youtube="

Like this:

Spoiler

Cheers, but still can't get it to work. I have literally 0 brain when it comes to anything remotely code-based. I've set up an advice forum to sort this out.

 

[StarStruckStrumpets]

For a start, there's no such thing as a British accent. The British isles are made of up England, Wales, Scotland and part of Ireland. Even at the very base, that's four different accents. In England, different towns have different accents. Stoke and Crewe have totally different accents and they're about 10 miles apart at most. The "British" accent is a cute fantasy created by the culturally ignorant.

Secondly, you've already answered your own gripes in the OP.

 

[JoJo]

For a start, there's no such thing as a British accent. The British isles are made of up England, Wales, Scotland and part of Ireland. Even at the very base, that's four different accents. In England, different towns have different accents. Stoke and Crewe have totally different accents and they're about 10 miles apart at most. The "British" accent is a cute fantasy created by the culturally ignorant.

Secondly, you've already answered your own gripes in the OP.

For someone being nitpicky you've made a glaring error of your own in this post, the British Isles consists not just of the United Kingdom but also the remaining part of Ireland and other nearby islands like the Isle of Man.

But anyhow, it could still be argued that there is such thing as a British accent, as a wider category containing all of the accents natively found in these isles. Think of it how we British might talk about a US citizen speaking in an 'American accent', while a US native might describe that same person as speaking specifically in a 'New York accent'. The OP simply means the actors are speaking in an accent from Britain, not that all British people speak with that exact same accent.

 

[Random berk]

For a start, there's no such thing as a British accent. The British isles are made of up England, Wales, Scotland and part of Ireland. Even at the very base, that's four different accents. In England, different towns have different accents. Stoke and Crewe have totally different accents and they're about 10 miles apart at most. The "British" accent is a cute fantasy created by the culturally ignorant.

Secondly, you've already answered your own gripes in the OP.

For someone being nitpicky you've made a glaring error of your own in this post, the British Isles consists not just of the United Kingdom but also the remaining part of Ireland and other nearby islands like the Isle of Man.

But anyhow, it could still be argued that there is such thing as a British accent, as a wider category containing all of the accents natively found in these isles. Think of it how we British might talk about a US citizen speaking in an 'American accent', while a US native might describe that same person as speaking specifically in a 'New York accent'. The OP simply means the actors are speaking in an accent from Britain, not that all British people speak with that exact same accent.

By 'the remaining part of Ireland', do you mean the Republic of Ireland? Because the republic is politically independant of Britain, and I've never heard anyone from the south regard themselves as being British in any way. Geographically, that may be true, but in the context of accents, I don't see why you'd regard a Cork or Dublin accent as being British the way you would with a Yorkshire or London accent.