what the heck did they do to Raven's costume (and Raven in general) in the new DC 52?

[JimB]

"Ugly" is subjective.

Of course. I would have thought that was given.

"Offensively sexualized"? No more so than old Raven:

I didn't say old Raven was a role model for young women everywhere, but still, there are degrees.

EDIT: That said, using Ed Benes art as proof of a character's sexualization is kind of like using a Minnesota state fair as proof that Americans have a weight problem.

 

[JimB]

Even looking at both outfits objectively, they're equally figure hugging and accentuate the same parts of her body, the main difference being that the New 52 version shows less skin.

It could just be me, but I take that smoky gray panel in the middle of the new outfit to be gauze; something meant to show skin while discoloring it.

It'd be hard to say the New 52 version is less sexualised because it's not, but that's not the point, the point is it wouldn't make sense to complain about an outfit being "offensively sexualised" when it's at least equally, if not less, sexualised than the version before it when you're trying to say that's why it's getting complaints.

Wait, you can't say it's less sexualized because it's not less sexualized, but you can't complain about it because it might be less sexualized? Is there a typo in there, or am I missing something?

So saying it's getting complaints because it's boring and offensively sexualised doesn't really make sense.

I did not say it's boring. I don't remember anyone else saying it's boring, either, though I suppose they might have.

 

[SUPA FRANKY]

" Figure Hugging...>" Aren't Superheroes known for wearing tight latex suits...which do exactly that?

And accentuates her boobs? Well that's what happens when you wear latex...and wut.. She's female. Girls have boobs lol.

 

[JimB]

It's figure hugging and accentuates her boobs just like...her old outfit.

That strikes me as saying that because they are both equally tight, this [http://3ms4ve1eb1we30q8w527h1j9f4u.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/SOCHI_OLYMPICS_SPEEDSKATING_WOMEN_214189182-930x600.jpg]
and this [http://www.twistmyrubberarm.com/images/3099-1.jpg] are equally sexualized.

You're missing something. Hence the "that's not the point" part and the rest of the paragraph talking about how it makes no sense to say people are complaining about the new outfit because it happens to be "offensively sexualised" despite being equally, if not less, sexualised than the version before it.

But you said it can't be argued that it's less sexualized, so what's up with the "if not less sexualized" bit? It is confusing me.

That can't be the reason it's getting complaints given the comparison.

Uh...don't know what to tell you except yeah, it can be. And is.

Actually, the wiki says that Slade's dialogue implies he is Slade's son.

It says this:

Jericho (Deathstroke's son from the mainstream DC comics) has appeared in the final episodes, but no reference has been made to Slade's and Jericho's connection in the show.

And this:

Although many people don't know Slade's intentions to fight, it is made clear a couple times. In Birthmark, Slade quotes that it is, "always the quiet ones", and in "Apprentice Part II," he quotes, "Betrayal. Destruction. Revenge." These all may reference his son Joseph, since he can't talk, and the incident leading up to him being unable to talk (and Slade losing his right eye) was because of Slade supposedly betraying his family, which led to the minor destruction of his home (but major destruction to him and his son), which led to Slade wanting to get revenge on unknown people to make it up for his son losing the ability to speak.

May.

Completely unsupported by anything else in the actual cartoon.

 

[NuclearKangaroo]

they added a lot of PLOT and BACKSTORY if you know what i mean


i dont get it, the people who know characters like raven, cyborg, beastboy and starfire, most likely know em thanks to the very popular and very well made teen titans animated series, THE PREVIOUS animated series

what is the point of this kind of extreme transformation? why all the excessive sex appeal? you are just driving away the fans that animated show brought you

 

[JimB]

[stuff]

Whatever, dude. Enjoy your insistence that thinks the cartoon never says are nevertheless the truth.

Don't really know how you came to the conclusion that something which is designed to be practical is the same as something that is designed to accentuate her breasts so much that they completely shape her boobs, as is the case with both of Raven's outfits.

You said that the outfit's tightness and its grip on her tits (the latter of which I ignored because, for better or for worse, all superheroine's outfits mold to their tits like body paint in defiance of any logic or physics) make the outfits equally sexualized. I think that ignores context like diaphanous peekaboo panels in the middle of a swimsuit shaped like the slingshot suspenders Borat wears.

But you said it can't be argued that it's less sexualized, so what's up with the "if not less sexualized" bit? It is confusing me.

No I never.

Uh...I might be overstating it a little bit, but yeah, you kinda did. Copy and paste the phrase "It'd be hard to say the New 52 version is less sexualised because it's not" into your Ctrl + F search, and you're the first one who said it.

 

[PeaceRider]

Well......She IS the daughter of a might demon king....so having a matching appearance instead of sullen goth girl makes more sense then having Starfire become super slutty in appearance.

 

[SUPA FRANKY]

they added a lot of PLOT and BACKSTORY if you know what i mean


i dont get it, the people who know characters like raven, cyborg, beastboy and starfire, most likely know em thanks to the very popular and very well made teen titans animated series, THE PREVIOUS animated series

what is the point of this kind of extreme transformation? why all the excessive sex appeal? you are just driving away the fans that animated show brought you

What about her pose is sexualized? I really want to know.

And yea, it be cool if they matched her apperance with the cartoon, but hey, New 52 is a revamp.

 

[NuclearKangaroo]

they added a lot of PLOT and BACKSTORY if you know what i mean


i dont get it, the people who know characters like raven, cyborg, beastboy and starfire, most likely know em thanks to the very popular and very well made teen titans animated series, THE PREVIOUS animated series

what is the point of this kind of extreme transformation? why all the excessive sex appeal? you are just driving away the fans that animated show brought you

What about her pose is sexualized? I really want to know.

And yea, it be cool if they matched her apperance with the cartoon, but hey, New 52 is a revamp.

dem tits and dat ass, dunno i feel its too much

i liked the character in the show so im not specially confortable with this redesign

Well......She IS the daughter of a might demon king....so having a matching appearance instead of sullen goth girl makes more sense then having Starfire become super slutty in appearance.

didnt she hate her father tough? atleast in the show, she hated being the daugther of Trigon, she hated the fact that from the moment she was born she was cursed to the cause of the apocalypse

so it makes 0 sense that she'd wear that costume for that reason

 

[pyrokitsune777]

If I'm being honest it's an interesting design for a character that's completely (or only tangentially) unrelated to the original Raven.

I personally enjoyed Raven's outfit in the Teen Titan's TV show. It was reserved but still had a sexual appeal. This costume is just blatant sex appeal with very angular and aggressive attempt to make her look more like a...well...Raven.

I get the feeling that this is but another casualty in the Great DC 52 Purge concealed behind the moniker of a Redesign.

 

[SUPA FRANKY]

they added a lot of PLOT and BACKSTORY if you know what i mean


i dont get it, the people who know characters like raven, cyborg, beastboy and starfire, most likely know em thanks to the very popular and very well made teen titans animated series, THE PREVIOUS animated series

what is the point of this kind of extreme transformation? why all the excessive sex appeal? you are just driving away the fans that animated show brought you

What about her pose is sexualized? I really want to know.

And yea, it be cool if they matched her apperance with the cartoon, but hey, New 52 is a revamp.

dem tits and dat ass, dunno i feel its too much

i liked the character in the show so im not specially confortable with this redesign

Well, latex is what SUper Heroes wear, both Men and Woman.

And Women have tits and an ass....

You'd have a point if she was doing stripper poses and wearing a swimsuit or something, but I don't see how it's sexualized. Her pose screams " I'm reveling in my power" then " LOOK AT MY TITS"

 

[NuclearKangaroo]

they added a lot of PLOT and BACKSTORY if you know what i mean


i dont get it, the people who know characters like raven, cyborg, beastboy and starfire, most likely know em thanks to the very popular and very well made teen titans animated series, THE PREVIOUS animated series

what is the point of this kind of extreme transformation? why all the excessive sex appeal? you are just driving away the fans that animated show brought you

What about her pose is sexualized? I really want to know.

And yea, it be cool if they matched her apperance with the cartoon, but hey, New 52 is a revamp.

dem tits and dat ass, dunno i feel its too much

i liked the character in the show so im not specially confortable with this redesign

Well, latex is what SUper Heroes wear, both Men and Woman.

And Women have tits and an ass....

You'd have a point if she was doing stripper poses and wearing a swimsuit or something, but I don't see how it's sexualized. Her pose screams " I'm reveling in my power" then " LOOK AT MY TITS"

im not compalining because she has tits and ass

im complaining because she has bigger tits and a bigger ass, it looks like pandering from my point of view, tough it seems the raven that existed before the animated series was no better

 

[SUPA FRANKY]

they added a lot of PLOT and BACKSTORY if you know what i mean


i dont get it, the people who know characters like raven, cyborg, beastboy and starfire, most likely know em thanks to the very popular and very well made teen titans animated series, THE PREVIOUS animated series

what is the point of this kind of extreme transformation? why all the excessive sex appeal? you are just driving away the fans that animated show brought you

What about her pose is sexualized? I really want to know.

And yea, it be cool if they matched her apperance with the cartoon, but hey, New 52 is a revamp.

dem tits and dat ass, dunno i feel its too much

i liked the character in the show so im not specially confortable with this redesign

Well, latex is what SUper Heroes wear, both Men and Woman.

And Women have tits and an ass....

You'd have a point if she was doing stripper poses and wearing a swimsuit or something, but I don't see how it's sexualized. Her pose screams " I'm reveling in my power" then " LOOK AT MY TITS"

im not complaining because she has tits and ass

im complaining because she has bigger tits and a bigger ass, it looks like pandering from my point of view, tough it seems the raven that existed before the animated series was no better

Well, when your in preety good shape, your ass and tits look better.

The Starfire poses way back when, I agree was pandering. But there are plenty of strong female characters in DC.

 

[misfit119]

Actually The wiki says that Slade's dialogue implies he is Slade's son. Jericho can't speak. And slade never fully details everything.

The show implies it like they heavily imply Red X is Jason Todd and how he is a stand in for Red Hood.

As a helpful pointer that wiki is a piece of garbage anyways. I'm going to assume you raged when you saw the Teen Titans cartoon existed because it wasn't what you remembered from the comics and it was for kids so it was garbage but most of that wiki's accessory information is crap. Most of the stuff on it that isn't a direct transcription of what happened on the show is just assumptions based on comic book information. Almost all of the answers to various questions left unanswered on the wiki come from the Teen Titans Go! comicbook which has nothing to do with the show as it originally aired, was intended or what actually mattered. It's retcons, pure and simple. So citing that as evidence for your rants means nothing to the topic at hand.

As someone who did watch the show religiously at no point does it ever imply that Jericho is Slade's son or that the two have any relationship whatsoever. In the same vein, Red X is definitely NOT a stand in for Jason Todd considering that Red Hood was the Joker's identity and then become Todd. Is it based off the same ideas? Sure but that's what an alternate continuity is - same ideas, different outcomes. Why this seems to burn you so badly I have no idea but it's a pretty ridiculous sticking point.