What's wrong with fried chicken?

[RJ Dalton]

This is sort of a tangential response to MovieBob's latest video that doesn't actually apply to my comments posted there, but I think it's a fair question slash point to make.
Whether or not you want to agree with Bob's scholar rage (it's definitely a scholarly argument, not a nerdy argument), I genuinely think there's a serious problem today with people taking offense at the drop of a hat.
My case in point is the old stereotype of black people liking fried chicken. I find this to be an utterly ridiculous and ineffectual racial slur because a lot of people like fried chicken; black people, white people, you name it. It's a tasty food, if you don't mind all the grease it gets on your fingers. KFC is a popular restaurant chain and the old idea that fried chicken is a poor man's food, while beef is a rich man's food is really no longer appropriate. Beef (or at least something that professes to be beef) is readily available at every fast food joint, while chicken (that is, real chicken, not the stuff that merely professes to be chicken) is actually less common and often the more expensive item when compared with most foods on their menus, if only by a slight margin.
So why the fuck is it somehow an incredibly bad and offensive thing if a guy says "Obama should go eat fried chicken"?
Let me give you what I see as a reasonable comparison. I've got a jock friend who's (most unfortunately, since this is a rant on stereotypes) not the brightest tool in the shed and he has this tendency to feel a little threatened by me and my intellectual friends. This manifests in the assumption that we're always insulting him. I am not exaggerating when I say that I can go "Babba-booey, yama-blama fuggy blubbers!" completely at random and with no context and he will take offense to it because he assumes I'm insulting him. I know this because I've done so to make this point to him. That is what I think of when I hear about people getting offended over the "black people eat fried chicken" racial slur. Okay yes, the people using the slur actually intend offense, so there is a difference, but the way they are trying to give offense is so utterly and completely stupid. I get more upset that people actual take offense instead of just shrugging it off than I do at the people who use the slur.
So, while it's true that when a man trying to express his distaste for Obama by making a fried chicken joke is probably a bigot, he's also a fucking moron beneath the concern of any rational and intelligent person and we should not justify that stupidity by giving it any attention.
Or, to sum it up in less intellectual and rather boorish terms, walk it off, pansy.
When I was a kid, I was the butt-monkey of every cruel joke and prank in grade school and if I exaggerate, it isn't by much. I got insulted in every way you can possibly imagine, from the childish jabs to the really painful barbs, to milk poured down my pants, and what I've learned from this, which may sound like fortune cookie wisdom, but trust me, it's true, is that people only do it because it bothers you. The only way to make people stop that doesn't involve murder is to ignore it. If you ignore it, you make the person insulting you look stupid and petty and this embarrasses them because suddenly they don't have the power over you they pretended to. At first they get more mean spirited, but eventually, you shame them enough that they just shut up and leave you alone. Based on this, I can pretty safely say that if you want racial slurs to go away, you have to stop treating them like they actually mean anything, because in the long run, they don't and the bullies who use them know that.
Now, admittedly, this isn't going to solve every problem involved in racism. Some other, more deep-seeded problems will need to be addressed in different ways, but before we can effectively address those issues, we need to get beyond the petty stuff and to do that we have got to admit that it's just that and stop paying it any mind.

>_> Boy, I sure hope I asked a question or made a point somewhere in all that.

 

[Lilani]

Fried chicken is a stereotype for black people. It's an easy, go-to insult for anyone looking to make a racist remark. That was his point. The people who use it in a serious context are uneducated bigots. There's nothing inherently wrong with fried chicken or the people that like it. It's the people who are trying to use it as an insult that are the problem.

 

[Calcium]

Yeah, you did kinda answer yourself it seems.

Nothing's wrong with it, it's the people using such phrases to try to offend who are at fault. It's a way of openly voicing hate and/or ignorance. I can't fully agree on the "walk it off" attitude though, as I feel hate and ignorance should be challenged not accepted or ignored.

 

[RJ Dalton]

It's the people who are trying to use it as an insult that are the problem.

Nothing's wrong with it, it's the people using such phrases to try to offend who are at fault. It's a way of openly voicing hate and/or ignorance.

See, now yes, the title of this post is answered, it was really just an attention getting device. NOTICE MEEEEE!!!

Anywho, I have to say that I disagree that the problem is those who use it as an insult, as I was hoping I made clear. I think the problem with most racial slurs is that we give credence to the uneducated by taking offense. The people who use them are bullies, plain and simple. Their attacks are posturing to cover their own insecurities. They want to have power over you and they only way they can think to do it is by getting under your skin, because they aren't intelligent enough to do it any other way. While the issue of hate should be addressed there are certain expressions of hate that should remain beneath comment. They are too stupid and meaningless to be worth making a fuss over and all you are doing by giving it attention is encouraging them to continue, because the attention is what they want.

Now, you want to solve the real problems of hate? The key to that is understanding and you aren't going to do that by metaphorically spanking all the people who tell race jokes. You can say, "Naughty, naughty, that's not funny" and you can even lock them up in prison if you're foolish enough to believe fascism will solve all the world's problems, but that won't stop the problem.
You know what was the greatest tool to dispelling my mistaken notions about Africans? It was the novel "Things Fall Apart" by Chinua Achebe. I recommend, not just because it gives insight into a particular African culture (which is does and is a fair reason to read it), but because it was a good read. Having this being required reading in high schools instead of that half-assed "Killing Mr. Griffin" or the three-quarters-assed "Pigman" will go a long way toward improving understanding and appreciation for diverse cultures.
We also need increased awareness on the people behind the hate movements. Did you know that the leaders of the KKK aren't actually racists anymore? No, they aren't. It's a fucking business to them. They make millions of dollars selling hate music through underground channels (and now through iTunes) along with other racist merchandise, so they work hard to keep the racism alive so they can make money. They don't actually believe the shit they say, it's just their bread and butter. In fact, the leaders of the Neo-Nazis and the leaders of the . . . I can't remember the name off the top of my head, but they're a separatist group advocating a second civil war between blacks and whites and the foundation of a black nation . . . the name is unimportant, but the leadership of these two groups have been shown to be working together through record deals to peddle their hate music to their respective target audiences.
These are the real problems that need to be addressed. The racial slurs belched out by drunken trailer-trash are contemptible, but beneath concern.

 

[dsmops2003]

I love fried chicken. I am white. That is all.

 

[Lilani]

See, now yes, the title of this post is answered, it was really just an attention getting device. NOTICE MEEEEE!!!

Obviously it didn't work as an attention-getting device, as so many of us were satisfied enough with answering the title question that we didn't know nor care about the actual content of the first post

 

[BioHazardMan]

It sounds like you don't understand how stereotypes work more than anything. Of course not all black people are criminals, lazy etc. Of course not all asians are incredibly intelligent and have small members. There's nothing wrong with fried chicken it's delicious.

 

[RJ Dalton]

Obviously it didn't work as an attention-getting device, as so many of us were satisfied enough with answering the title question that we didn't know nor care about the actual content of the first post

That happens sometimes.

 

[Calcium]

It's the people who are trying to use it as an insult that are the problem.

Nothing's wrong with it, it's the people using such phrases to try to offend who are at fault. It's a way of openly voicing hate and/or ignorance. I can't fully agree on the "walk it off" attitude though, as I feel hate and ignorance should be challenged not accepted or ignored.

... While the issue of hate should be addressed there are certain expressions of hate that should remain beneath comment. They are too stupid and meaningless to be worth making a fuss over and all you are doing by giving it attention is encouraging them to continue, because the attention is what they want.

I don't believe it serves anyone to live in a world were it becomes socially acceptable for people to spout hatred unchallenged. I do agree that calling someone out on it doesn't serve to make them any less of an idiot, but I can't imagine ignoring them makes them any less a racist. It's basically a choice between not giving them attention or not speaking up for what you believe in. Essentially a lose-lose.

And just to lighten the mood...

.. metaphorically spanking ...

Bwa-ha-ha!

 

[Ambrose von Carstein]

Fried chikkin is mah favourite, dawg!

 

[RJ Dalton]

It sounds like you don't understand how stereotypes work more than anything. Of course not all black people are criminals, lazy etc. Of course not all asians are incredibly intelligent and have small members. There's nothing wrong with fried chicken it's delicious.

No, I actually understand stereotypes quite well. I'm not stating that stereotyping is okay, what I'm saying is that our response to the majority of it is not appropriate for solving the problem. When they're used as insults to bully people, they should be ignored, because the reaction is what the people who say them want.
The proper way to address the stereotypes that are causing problems (the portrayal of blacks as criminal, for example) is a re-examination and re-representation in the media. Too often, media portrayal of black people is heavily based in stereotypes (even the stuff that is not obviously offensive) because the people making them are thinking of race in terms of demographics, not characterization. They take cheap and easy ways out, which projects an image that influences how people see the world. In that instance, what we need to do first and foremost is stop going to movies that enforce stereotypes, intentionally or otherwise and, at the same time, give encouragement to thos movies that do better by going to them more often. If a movie is going to have a black character, we should expect them to give the character reasonable development, to the same degree that a white character would be given, and not just let them slide by on stereotypes. As long as they think they can make money on it, they'll keep doing whatever comes easiest and falling back on stereotypes and common misconceptions is always easier than genuine characterization.
And we need to actually learn about the sub-culture we're talking about, not just voice our respect for it like saying it made it true.
But that's for the serious problems, like accusations of criminality and drug abuse and so on. Shit like "Black man like fried chicken, DAY-yam!" should just be outright ignored, especially if it's done with specific intent to anger, because that just gives the dumbass bullies what they want.

 

[RJ Dalton]

I love fried chicken. I am white. That is all.

And really, that's all that needs to be said.
Except all that other stuff I said. That apparently also needed saying. *shrug*

 

[Samechiel]

I couldn't bring myself to read your giant blocks of text, but I like fried chicken very much.

I'm not sure if that actually contributes to the topic at hand.

It's delicious.

 

[RJ Dalton]

I don't believe it serves anyone to live in a world were it becomes socially acceptable for people to spout hatred unchallenged. I do agree that calling someone out on it doesn't serve to make them any less of an idiot, but I can't imagine ignoring them makes them any less a racist. It's basically a choice between not giving them attention or not speaking up for what you believe in. Essentially a lose-lose.

Ignoring them isn't going to make them less racist, but giving them attention over little things is going to encourage them to keep doing it. It perpetuates the problem. The racial slurs are not the problem, they are a symptom of the problem and trying to stop them is not going to fix anything. If you want to get rid of racism, you have to get at the roots of the problem - IE a lack of understanding and the complex psychological and emotional problems it stems from. Making a fuss over really stupid and really petty jokes and slurs is not going to solve that.
What this is essentially doing is moving the problem into the shadows. You can stop people from saying the stuff all you want, but that won't stop them from believing it if you don't find out what drives them to believe it in the first place and find a way correct that line of thought. There are great efforts made to stop people from saying it (hate speech laws, hate crime laws, censorship of Huck Finn, etc.), but there are relatively few efforts made to help people get over it at the heart of the problem.

And just to lighten the mood...

.. metaphorically spanking ...

Bwa-ha-ha!

What's funny? Did I misspell?

 

[Griphphin]

From my point of view, it's a self-perpetuating cycle of ignorance feeding racism and racism feeding ignorance. It's a dumb thing to say (fried chicken is delicious), but it's more about the sentiment.

 

[Lexodus]

For the same reason that black people think it's insulting to call me a cracker/cracka/however they spell it. All I think is "We've forgotten the cheese, Gromit!"

 

[Calcium]

I don't believe it serves anyone to live in a world were it becomes socially acceptable for people to spout hatred unchallenged. I do agree that calling someone out on it doesn't serve to make them any less of an idiot, but I can't imagine ignoring them makes them any less a racist. It's basically a choice between not giving them attention or not speaking up for what you believe in. Essentially a lose-lose.

Ignoring them isn't going to make them less racist, but giving them attention over little things is going to encourage them to keep doing it. It perpetuates the problem. The racial slurs are not the problem, they are a symptom of the problem and trying to stop them is not going to fix anything. If you want to get rid of racism, you have to get at the roots of the problem - IE a lack of understanding and the complex psychological and emotional problems it stems from. Making a fuss over really stupid and really petty jokes and slurs is not going to solve that.
What this is essentially doing is moving the problem into the shadows. You can stop people from saying the stuff all you want, but that won't stop them from believing it if you don't find out what drives them to believe it in the first place and find a way correct that line of thought. There are great efforts made to stop people from saying it (hate speech laws, hate crime laws, censorship of Huck Finn, etc.), but there are relatively few efforts made to help people get over it at the heart of the problem.

That's just the thing. Solving the problem comes neither from calling them out on it nor ignoring it, it's from tackling the causes of it.

That Floridian pastor (forgot his name) who wanted to burn korans on September 11th. I would have been disgusted if people hadn't spoke out against such ignorance. I know it's on a different scale to the kind of cheap remarks mentioned in this thread, but I feel the idea behind it's the same. As I said though, it's a lose-lose.

And just to lighten the mood...

.. metaphorically spanking ...

Bwa-ha-ha!

What's funny? Did I misspell?

Nope, I'm just incredibly childish.

 

[BlueGlowstick]

I eat fried chicken. I am white. I refuse to eat it from KFC though. :/ they don't cook it well enough.

 

[beniki]

As racial slurs go, liking something that might be the tastiest thing on the planet is pretty mild. I mean, to me, it's along the same lines as saying 'English people like tea.' Which, as I sit here as far from the UK as you can get, sipping out of my Union Jack mug and wishing I could find something other than Lipton, is fairly true.

The problem is when the entire critical point of someone is that they should just go eat fried chicken. It implies that there is no inherent logic behind not liking someone.

Going straight for the racial slur, as mild as it is, is basically showing the person you don't like them based purely on ethnicity.

They still mean something, even if you choose to bury your head in the sand over it.

And now I want some fried chicken. I think I'll have a cup of tea with it too!

...

Damn I wish I had something better than Liptons

 

[messy]

I just quote Dave Chappelle (sp?) on this

"They say black people love fried chicken and watermelon, who doesn't love fried chicken and watermelon I want to meet this people"