What's Your View on Animal Rights?

Tilted_Logic

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SnakeoilSage said:
Being superior to animals means we should be responsible when exploiting them. It doesn't give us the right to be cruel to them.
This, very much this.

I'm probably going to advocate my views poorly, I'm extremely tired but I'll try to bring some semblance of reason to my statements.

I'm a strong advocate for animal rights, and when I was much younger I did join PETA along with a host of other organizations (WSPA, RAN, WWF, etc..). At this point in my life though I'm very much against PETA; not because of what they're trying to accomplish, but the means they're using. Demeaning and threatening people will never encourage them to see your views, you'll only push them further away, and in some cases they'll end up becoming exactly what you're fighting against. While any other day I'd be happy to see an organization garnering so much attention, far too much of it with PETA is negative.

Anyway, enough about PETA. As for specifics, I understand people eat meat, it's just part of life. I wouldn't have a problem with it if the animals that were used had a healthy life, weren't pumped full of drugs or forced to live in repulsive conditions.

It's a touchy subject for me I suppose. We don't have the right to treat animals as disgustingly as we do. And the fact people so easily disengage from the fact the food on their plate was once ever a living creature saddens me thoroughly. I have many reasons behind my beliefs, but for now I'll just surmise it all by saying the way we treat animals now is devastating to their potential; could you imagine what the world would be like in a few hundred/thousand years if we didn't restrict the ability for animals to adapt?
 

Vivi22

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hotsauceman said:
3: Eat little meat, You dont have to scarf down meat all the time, Veggie burgers can be good too.
Meat and the saturated fat we get from it are important parts of the human diet. Vegetarian alternatives are less ideal (being basically void of any fats), and by extension, less efficient options if proper human nutrition is the goal.

My opinion is simple: an animal shouldn't be abused or mistreated, but there is no reason to stop eating them when we are omnivores. We can raise meat ethically, and we can kill/hunt it in ways which minimize suffering. And more importantly, all parts of the animal should be used whenever possible.

I find it funny when people say we shouldn't kill them at all though. Not only does such a statement ignore millions of years of evolution, it implies we should stop doing what comes naturally to not just us, but thousands of other species. We need to eat to thrive and meat is part of our diet. You wouldn't see a Lion choose the life of it's prey over sating it's own hunger. But we like to believe we're more than the animals we consume. To believe such a thing is folly. We may be more intelligent, but we're still animals.
 

Craorach

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PETA are some of the most revolting scum ever to walk the earth.

I believe in Animal Rights. I believe we should treat animals well, I love my pets, for example...

... but to PETA, simply having pets means I'm some kind of monster.

We should treat animals well, we should have rules to protect them, but that does not mean we should deny our nature and live even more unsustainable lives, nor let them run rampant, as the "Alpha Predator" of the entire world we have responsibilities that go with our position.

We should protect animals from cruelty, help them so they do not suffer, farm and breed them intelligently and with a sense of morality. We should not shut them in tiny cages, nor create "pretty" or "posh" breeds that suffer terrible medical conditions because of selective breeding for certain features. When they are sick, we should heal them. When our society or "progress" harms them and their homes severely we should make an effort to change or stop what we do.

But we must also remember that we have, for all time, affected the world in which they live. We should prevent overpopulation caused by us destroying predators and providing massive quantities of scrap food, for example. To not do so is only going to cause more suffering in the long run.

Furthermore, I absolutely support the testing of MEDICAL products on animals before they are tested on human beings. While I do not like the idea, animals are lower on the food chain than humans.. this is nature.. and while the testing of cosmetics and the like is abhorrent because those items have no real value to society, the testing of medical products saves lives and even trickles down into veterinary use.
 

gabe12301

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Raven said:
Nimcha said:
Raven said:
Nimcha said:
I think animal rights are taken care of well enough in the civilised world by now.
A two week old human foetus has more rights than an adult chimpanzee... Think about that for a while...
That's what I meant by "well enough".
So a being that can think, learn, feel emotion, express individuality and possibly comprehend basic language should have less rights than a group of cells with about as much cognitive ability as a pebble?
Are you implying that an undeveloped human is worth less than a damned monkey? What will the monkey possibly contribute to society?
If I had to choose between a chimps life and a pregnant lady's kid that wouldn't even be an option.

but anyway, I don't support killing anything above or on the level of a dog, But It's not above or on the same level as a human. No exceptions.
 

Raven's Nest

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AlexNora said:
evolution is a load of bs i have never seen an animal change to another kind of animal there is no recorded history of it. other then Microevolution but that is not the same thing you can breed dogs all you want and you will get a dog every time.it may be a big dog or a little dog but its still a dog that is a fact. (there is some varying degrees in intelligence but they will never build a space ship or get anywhere close to it)
Just because you don't understand something doesn't make it not true... Perhaps go and talk to a biology professor, i'm sure they'd be happy to sit down and explain it. It's really quite a fascinating process you see, if you understood the basic principles of how and why every living organism undergoes the process of evolution you would understand that perhaps the greatest living, walking animal on the planet ever... Is probably the humble cockroach...
 

Keepeas

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I'm one of those people who doesn't think anything should get in the way of good solid scientific research.
If you do want to get in the way...well that's just selfish(usually).

Don't get me wrong, I love animals...but the findings yielded through scientific research justify the means.

Does PETA fight for ugly looking animal rights as well?
Most animal rights activist I've talked to don't give a fuck about anything that isn't furry and cute...hypocritical bastards.
 

let's rock

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Jun 15, 2011
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I believe that if you want to be a vegatarian or not wear fur, go ahead, but don't act like I have to do exactly the same
 

Ledan

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Eggsnham said:
* HAPPY SNIP*
:D :D :D
I wrote my extended essay on this.
Really brief argument: With rights come obligations*. Only moral agents can fulfill obligations. Animals cannot fulfill obligations, e.x. wolves will eat rabbits. If animals cannot be upheld to the same moral laws as humans (if it is unethical for a human to kill a rabbit or cat, it must be unethical for a cat to kill a rabbit), who we know are moral agents, then animals cannot be moral agents. Thus animals cannot have rights.

Animal welfare however.... this is only due to how our society changes depending on how we treat domestic animals. We shouldn't hang cats on sticks outside our gardens, because it is detrimental to society. It would upset people. And if people can do that to animals, all they need to do is dehumanize other humans to treat them similarly. If one is not allowed to be cruel to animals, then people have a lesser reason to be as cruel on a regular basis to humans.

If you want a better explained version (where I haven't made as many mistakes/assumptions :p) then I could send you the essay. For educational purposes only!

* The right to life, the obligation to protect the lives of others. etc. The right to education, paying taxes.
 

Powereaver

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Apr 25, 2010
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I think animals and plants should be treated the same way we treat ourselves.. they deserve equal rights being just as much as living being as the rest of us
 
Sep 14, 2009
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Avaholic03 said:
Bottom line for me is that humans come first. Don't fuck with my food sources or tell me to eat soy just because the animals aren't treated well. We're at the top of the food chain, so we'll do whatever we want.

Now, being abusive to your pet or doing stuff like dog fighting...well, then I support animal rights. There's no reason for that stuff. If you hate animals that much, you can always avoid them.
roughly this.



that's what i'm talking about.
 

Raven's Nest

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gabe12301 said:
Are you implying that an undeveloped human is worth less than a damned monkey? What will the monkey possibly contribute to society?
If I had to choose between a chimps life and a pregnant lady's kid that wouldn't even be an option.

but anyway, I don't support killing anything above or on the level of a dog, But It's not above or on the same level as a human. No exceptions.
That's precisely what I am implying. A two week old foetus is incapable of doing anything apart from growing. Yes it has the potential to become a free thinking paragon of society aspiring to the likes of Leonardo da Vinci or Isaac Newton. But thats not really all that likely, and beside the point. Not untill it develops into an adult does it stand a chance of achieving these things.

I can however, also assure you that a chimpanzee will be very unlikley to discover the next law of physics or draw the next mona lisa but as an adult chimpanzee it is much more capable of human-like processes such as thinking, feeling, remembering and mourning than a two week year old clump of stem cells...

The idea of a fully developed sentient being having no right to life when we will offer the same right to life to a collection of proteins and amino acids is something I find astonoshing.

Just what exactly has Paris Hilton contributed to the world that would make her more important to the world as a clump of cells, than the effects of an individual primate (or any other animal for that matter) on an entire ecosystem in keeping the Earth's natural environments in check for millenia? Can you answer that?

Unless every human turns out to be an eco-warrior there doesn't seem to be much point in them all being alive as far as the Earth is concerned.
 

loc978

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Vivi22 said:
hotsauceman said:
3: Eat little meat, You dont have to scarf down meat all the time, Veggie burgers can be good too.
Meat and the saturated fat we get from it are important parts of the human diet. Vegetarian alternatives are less ideal (being basically void of any fats), and by extension, less efficient options if proper human nutrition is the goal.
My opinion is simple: an animal shouldn't be abused or mistreated, but there is no reason to stop eating them when we are omnivores. We can raise meat ethically, and we can kill/hunt it in ways which minimize suffering. And more importantly, all parts of the animal should be used whenever possible.

I find it funny when people say we shouldn't kill them at all though. Not only does such a statement ignore millions of years of evolution, it implies we should stop doing what comes naturally to not just us, but thousands of other species. We need to eat to thrive and meat is part of our diet. You wouldn't see a Lion choose the life of it's prey over sating it's own hunger. But we like to believe we're more than the animals we consume. To believe such a thing is folly. We may be more intelligent, but we're still animals.
While it's true most vegetarian "alternative meats" are much less nourishing than meat... That's simply because the bulk of them are made of heavily processed wheat and soy. There are perfectly healthy vegetarian alternatives to our horrific diet of processed grains and beans (and equally as nourishing as meat). They're usually nuts or drupes [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drupe], actually. Some of the statistically longest-lived humans on the planet have a diet that consists of over 75% plant matter... so, to Vivi: no, veggie burgers aren't good too. Coconuts are, though.

But does all of that make it our responsibility to stop eating meat? No. Should we eat less of it as a species? I'm not sure... but I do know people in North America should tone it down a lot (and I'm a hunter myself).

As for animal rights, Korolev covered it best. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.320260-Whats-Your-View-on-Animal-Rights?page=4#13082759] -that post should have been /thread... but most people were probably intimidated by the wall'o'text.
I feel about this the way I feel about many things. If you want to discuss it, educate yourself on the matter. If you can't be bothered to educate yourself, STFU.
...if I could shoot a meaningful look at members of PETA after saying that, I would.
 

Connor Lonske

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I'm not happy with PETA, but there is a point where this all has to stop. I don't like at all how the food production system is run. It's unnatural and artificial. And yeah, the way we treat those cash crop animals(seeing how we don't treat them any better than the plants) is just terrible.

I don't have much choice to eat food made with out the bullshit, literal and metaphorical due to being poor as fuck. I understand that humans are meat eaters and plant eaters, but fuck, we still gave animals a fighting chance back before we became civilized, but now their bred to be eaten at birth. No natural habits for these creatures, their dead on arrival in factories or "farms."

I don't really have much choice in what I eat like most people, so I'm stuck with what I got, but I can say that I'm not happy about it and it should be changed.

And anything done wrong to pet or domesticated animal is just sick. I don't ever codon that, unless it was a complete accident or the animal wasn't extremely harmed. Sick fucks who partake in dog fights should go to jail for the rest of their days if I had a say.
 

Dfskelleton

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I have no problem with using them for livestock or clothing stuff like that, but stuff like dog fighting or abusing the animals, that is unacceptable.
 

OptimisticPessimist

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They're delicious. Ands so are their lefts. Duh-dum tish.

Actually, I'm a massive bleeding heart for animals. Doesn't stop me from enjoying a good rack o' ribs now and again.
 

Death God

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I believe that pets and household animals have certain rights but a wild animal is a wild animal. I'm not saying to go out and kill everything that isn't human but I feel no shame in hunting in moderation. God put wild animals on this earth to eat. A pet can not defend themselves due to their instincts being being muffled in with the way they are bred and need someone to defend them. But a wild animal has instincts and would kill you if threatened. So, yes to pets and domestic animals, no to wild animals. Simple as that.
 

ShadowsofHope

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Nov 1, 2009
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CM156 said:
"The rights of the animal end when my bacon/steak dinner starts." I completely agree, good sir!

SnakeoilSage said:
Being superior to animals means we should be responsible when exploiting them. It doesn't give us the right to be cruel to them.
I also agree with the above. I want my bacon and my hamburgers, but I will rest easier eating their delicious insides knowing they were treated in an ethical manner (about the same respect and care you give to a newborn baby, minus the.. "oogabooga" "aw wittle kiddie!" stupid talk).

Also, PETA. Most ironically named animal "rights" group ever.