When will we see a NON-attractive woman in a video-game?

[AlphaLackey]

snippy snippy snip like a crab on a beach

Okay, I have to apologize. I should have elaborated on my own point instead of leaping down your throat.

Fair enough. I apologize for clearly overreacting and not paying attention to what I was saying with enough dedication. It's easy for me to lose the distinction and blur the lines between opposing a methodology and arguing with people.

My point was that the stereotypical representation of women and men is misogynistic and sexist. That the seemingly, at least from the outset, de facto stance on gender politics is to cater to men by making men as manly as possible and women trophies. THAT was my point. I thought that's what you were trying to defend.

A number of games are androcentric, no doubt about it. Where we disagree is whether the use of "sexist" and "misogynistic" as equivalents is appropriate. Consider the very same "go out and be the hero space marine and get the woman as your reward". Is it "misogynistic" that the men go out and shoot and get shot and bleed and kill and die in agony with only a woman as a reward, or is it just plain-old "sexist"? I live in a society where no less prominent a feminist as Hilary Clinton went on record as saying that women were the greater victims historically in war because they *didn't* go out and fight, they had to stay home and suffer with the loss of sons and husbands, which seems to not jive with what the horrors of D-Day suggest to me. But that 'male disposability' is being promulgated just as fiercely by such a game as "woman as prize". Yet, if you try and highlight this by pointing out that the sexist stereotyping isn't on the whole entirely, exclusively (or god forbid, even mostly) anti-woman, you get a webcomic thrown at you that compares you to an MRA, urinates on both of you with the most flimsy of logic, and get told you must be a misogynist. Okay, maybe a bit of an exaggeration. It's only rhetorical urine.

The latest Tomb Raider trailer, same idea. It was "misogynistic" that they almost portrayed her sexual assault at the hands of a villain. How many dozens of men will Lara kill with her bare hands in that very same "misogynistic" title?

Is the androcentric nature of such games itself sexism? I say it's just marketing. In a culture where a company will market a line of ballpoint pens to women because they think there's money in those hills, it's gone down to simple demographics. Why market games to men? Because someone believes that's where the money is, not because someone believes women are worthless. There was an article on this website earlier about a Japanese gynocentric video game that was selling very well (cannot think of the name of it). "Plundered Hearts" (a romance-novel stylized interactive fiction game from the makers of Zork) was one of Infocom's best sellers, even though this was a genre already enjoyed disproportionately (relative to demographics of the time) by women.

 

[Andy of Comix Inc]

snippy snippy snip like a crab on a beach

Okay, I have to apologize. I should have elaborated on my own point instead of leaping down your throat.

Fair enough. I apologize for clearly overreacting and not paying attention to what I was saying with enough dedication. It's easy for me to lose the distinction and blur the lines between opposing a methodology and arguing with people.

My point was that the stereotypical representation of women and men is misogynistic and sexist. That the seemingly, at least from the outset, de facto stance on gender politics is to cater to men by making men as manly as possible and women trophies. THAT was my point. I thought that's what you were trying to defend.

A number of games are androcentric, no doubt about it. Where we disagree is whether the use of "sexist" and "misogynistic" as equivalents is appropriate. Consider the very same "go out and be the hero space marine and get the woman as your reward". Is it "misogynistic" that the men go out and shoot and get shot and bleed and kill and die in agony with only a woman as a reward, or is it just plain-old "sexist"?

Oh, I'd say the content is sexist, but the act of catering (seemingly) exclusively to men and fuck how women are represented and see themselves in the game... that is what I'd call misogynistic. The way the industry acts towards women and how the games are written with a kind of "we don't care what women think" mentality... that, at the least, is borderline misogynistic. I don't care for misogynous practices. I find it hard to call the content itself misogynistic. (Is that even possible? For an actual game to exercise misogyny?)

 

[The Lesbian Flower]

Rosa from Condemned: Criminal Origins was pretty frumpy. She looked kind of like the Mexican maid from Family Guy xD

 

[aguspal]

KAt from Halo:Reach. She's more of an average looking woman in my opinion. However, I might be slightly biased due to her genius quote of "give me cover" while I went up against 6 elites on a LASO run.

Now thats freaking averague looking, I thougt it was a man at first.


... I dont have anything else to say that hasnt been covered in this thread already... moving on...


EDTI: Damn, I think I just revived an old thread... not sure if that is good at all...


EDIT 2: Wow, I just realized I might just use the "..." a little too much...lol

 

[OniSuika]

Makoto from Street Fighter 3 and 4

Spoiler

Yoko from Valkyria Chronicles

Spoiler

All I can think off the top of my head not already posted.