When will we see VR Games go beyond the gimmick phase?

[KingsGambit_v1legacy]

I believe Elite: Dangerous works with VR. While I put two dozen hours into the game and thought it was awful in every way, I can imagine VR being quite well woven into the game. You use it in lieu of a monitor and you get to actually look all around inside the cockpit. That's not a gimmick, that's actual immersion. Game is the most boring thing you'll ever play, but you can be bored with a VR headset on.

 

[Epyc Wynn]

Also it's worth noting VR in itself is somewhat of a gimmick. Fully Immersive Virutal Reality (FIVR) is going to be when the virtual reality simulation stimulates all the senses not just the ones related to spatial recognition/nagivation, and current VR can only do the bare minimum which is fairly limiting while some day FIVR is likely going to make VR look like a complete gimmick or at the very least an absolute dinosaur.

 

[Sonicron]

There's just too much of a hassle to deal with if you want VR to work properly. You need a big, expensive platform that'll register and translate your movement, you need a decent physical and virtual interface method, some form of VR goggles/helmet/whatever, a high-end computer (not affordable to many people) to make it all run smoothly, and on top of that you need a wide development base for video games that make use of the technology AND actually knows how to make fun games - all the tech in the world will get you nowhere if devs churn out shit. It's a massive financial burden and risk to all parties involved.

If we ever get to a technological standard across all sectors of society where VR tech is an ordinary and affordable thing , i.e. where there's a broad enough customer base to make VR games development relatively risk-free, then it might truly take off. Mind you, there'd have to be several quantum leaps in technological progess to make it happen... we're talking light-weight headsets with cranial jacks to interface directly with cybernetically augmented users. Real Matrix-style shit.

Yes, I know, an extreme view, but that's the only way I see for this to work as intended.

 

[Aiddon_v1legacy]

When they realize they can't cruise by on tech demos. That is the problem with the VR: it's fascinating tech, but unfortunately no one seems to be able to find a way to truly make it elevate gaming and make it fun. And that's before getting into its prohibitive costs that are a detriment to it becoming widespread.

 

[votemarvel]

To answer the opening question "when they invent the Holo-Deck"

Honestly the Oculus I tried just felt like having something really heavy strapped to my head, with the demos just not making me feel part of their world. Now I confess the full titles may have gotten around that. Reviewers seem to (over) react very well to the games.

I just don't see VR being breakout popular, mainly because of the price, but also they need to get more than sight and sound working properly. It's not enough to know that I am holding something, I need to feel its shape and texture.

 

[Saelune]

I like to compare VR right now to the age of Atari, where everyone and their mother had their own console with tons of wacky variations and such. Eventually though, there was the video game crash, then Nintendo popped up and saved gaming. Now we have only 3 real console companies, as opposed to like, 50. Now, hopefully VR's crash will be less extreme, but once the Nintendo, and then SEGA etc of VR pop up, then the gimmick will be gone.

Just a question of who. Maybe Samsung, maybe Sony. Maybe they aren't even making VR yet.

Also when non-gaming uses for VR become more apparent. Certainly makes a good learning tool, such as for operating vehicles, or surgical procedures.

 

[Epyc Wynn]

... Now that I think about it, if Nintendo got into this market and combined their motion controls with the VR hardware, that could add a whole new level of immersion. Play Station could do that too since they have their PS Movie knock-off controllers and I guess Microsoft could potentially pull of a highly immersive experience with their Kinect recognizing how your body is moving, but I have a hunch that won't be the case since they seem to have cut their ties with the Kinect ever since they unbundled it from the Xbox One and it hasn't received particularly good press or reception in the first place.

 

[Igor-Rowan]

The thing we should be asking is what VR can do, that other media cannot do (or can, but to a less extent)?
* Well, first person horror games are effective, because they add to your experience, by putting you in the shoes of a hopeless person trying to survive.
* Racing games can give extra immersion.
* BUT I think we can all agree that platformers are OUT, because third person platformers are just an upgraded 3D effect and first person platforming is a new level.
That is all I can think of, games that CAN be given extra immersion, with VR, but effective nonetheless.


Here a few ideas VR could make interesting: a game with another character you NEVER see, imagine a kitchen and I leave a piece of cake on the table, it will stay there as long as I keep staring at it and will vanish as soon as I turn around, I think something like a Gone Home narrative can be told this way; a game that features mirrors, you look at a mirror through the headset and you look at someone that may or may not be you and you'll need its help to solve puzzles as it does mysteriously everything you do; a labyrinth featuring those BRUSSPUP-style illusions where things aren't the way they look depending on the angle you're looking at them; remake Portal, do I need to say anything else?; make a game like Papers Please, where interesting things must be happening offscreen so when I do see them I get to decide how to intervene.
- The thing is thinking outside the box in these situations, how the 'there is this 1080? world around me, but I can only see a fraction of it' helps/hinders the player in some way.

 

[veloper]

VR won't take off until there's VR seats and/or suits that go with the VR helmet.

VR cockpits are currently the only applications that aren't immersion breaking and motion sickness-inducing for many players, but even the VR simulators could really use moving seats, like physical cockpit simulators have, to properly fake the sense of motion.

For walkers, nothing short of simulated force feedback on the legs and physical rotation, will trick the senses into registering a stroll through the park. What we can buy now is a signal from the eyes that conflicts with all other senses.

 

[Jingle Fett]

To each their own of course, but as a recent HTC Vive owner with several of these tech demos, I disagree completely.

I have a 3 screen multi-monitor setup too, and the comparison is laughable at best, the immersion is not even close. VR headsets aren't simply a screen strapped to your head, you're actually viewing everything in 3d and in a multi-monitor setup you simply don't get the same effect.

The other part of it is the fact that in VR you view everything to scale, whereas on a monitor it inevitably gets shrunken down (or blown up if you're on a projector)--seeing everything to scale combined with the 1:1 motion controllers and the ability to walk around and it's just not the same type of experience. If there's one thing the Vive gets right, it's the sensation of really being there.

Also, why settle for a 50 inch TV when you can have your own personal movie theater via Virtual Desktop (and again, when you put the headset on everything is to scale).

Indeed to each their own. Yet I house that view and it's a sad one at that because that's all these gimmicks will amount to. They'll never be pushed to their full potential where we as gamers can then actual enjoy because in terms of content "we" the consumers are deemed to disabled and inadequate to meet that challenge.

Except gamers are actually enjoying these games? I know I am anyways and I've been gaming for a long time. You really have no idea what you're talking about if you really think that's all these gimmicks will amount to. Already there are a bunch of FPS shooter games and while they may look like simple target practice type games, the fact that you're doing it in VR means that even simple trivial actions we take for granted are much more involved and have way more depth. For example, in Call of Duty you pull the trigger to use the iron sights and aim with the stick. In VR there's no such button because you're physically holding the gun and have to do things just like you would with a real gun. You manually hold up the virtual gun to aim down the sights just like a real gun and there's no need for that faux inaccuracy modern shooters have because the simple act of manually aiming your gun by hand is more than enough. You can shoot your gun gangster style, aim behind you and blind fire without looking, you can physically dodge attacks by moving to the side or crouching, and so on. These games might have fewer traditional game mechanics, but it's balanced out by the fact that you're actually doing it yourself and you're actually there (adding way more complexity than it seems).

Mind you I'm not really trying to convince you or change your mind or anything, but I'd highly suggest you actually try these games and tech demos before you write them off. Watching a video isn't at all representative of what the experience is actually like.

 

[Vigormortis]

I like to compare VR right now to the age of Atari, where everyone and their mother had their own console with tons of wacky variations and such. Eventually though, there was the video game crash, then Nintendo popped up and saved gaming. Now we have only 3 real console companies, as opposed to like, 50. Now, hopefully VR's crash will be less extreme, but once the Nintendo, and then SEGA etc of VR pop up, then the gimmick will be gone.

We already have that? Current VR is being backed by Valve, HTC, Facebook, Microsoft, Sony, and Samsung.

Those are hardly small players.

Also when non-gaming uses for VR become more apparent. Certainly makes a good learning tool, such as for operating vehicles, or surgical procedures.

This too is already the case. Several industries outside of gaming have already begun to adopt the tech.

... Now that I think about it, if Nintendo got into this market and combined their motion controls with the VR hardware, that could add a whole new level of immersion. Play Station could do that too since they have their PS Movie knock-off controllers and I guess Microsoft could potentially pull of a highly immersive experience with their Kinect recognizing how your body is moving, but I have a hunch that won't be the case since they seem to have cut their ties with the Kinect ever since they unbundled it from the Xbox One and it hasn't received particularly good press or reception in the first place.

I swear it's like this forum thinks that the Rift is the ONLY VR HMD.

You know the Vive already does exactly what you're proposing, right? It has full, room-scale tracking, along with two hand controllers.

I don't get it. I keep hearing people say, "Well, you know, I'd be interested in VR if it did ." And I keep having to say, "The Vive already does that!" It's like they've decided to declare the entire industry doomed, based on their lack of knowledge of what it is, does, or is capable of.

Basically this, Making the tech functional in your basic household environment is gonna be the big hurdle (along with similar lines in cost and wearability). Currently, dropping 700 (average, most are more) on a piece of tech and setting up a "VR playspace" is the sort of thing that falls more into a hardcore hobbyists category then the casual market.

It was easier to setup my "VR playspace" than it was installing my cable box, TV, and sound system. It literally took less than 10 minutes. I didn't have to empty a room, since the VR space scales. And now that I'm familiar with the setup, I can do it in less than 5, even when I take the entire setup to someone else's home.

Now, I'll grant I used tripods for my base stations at first, so I've subtracted the time it takes to mount them on the wall. Still, at most, that would add another 5 mins.

The library is an issue too, but most of your bigger game makers aren't going to jump in the pool with their money until its out of the experimental phase and starts to penetrate markets more.

It's already started penetrating other markets, so that's not an issue. However, yes, you are right. The available library of games is quite small.

Well, except it isn't. Especially when compared to, say, the available libraries for new consoles. There are already over 250 VR games available on Steam alone. There are even more available through the Oculus store and other sources.

I'd also like to point out that some of the 'bigger game makers' have already begun making VR-centric games. Notably: Valve, Epic, Gorilla, and others.

Will we see these games in the very near future? Oh, almost assuredly not. But then, as I've said before on this topic, consumer-grade VR has been on the market barely two months. These things take time, especially with completely new technology.

RTS games will also be amazing, when they arrive.
Imagine looking down onto a big table with all the units running about. You can bend down and see things on their level.

They're already here. Quar and Out of Ammo are just two that are already available on the Vive.

I've yet to try OoA, but Quar is a pretty fun, vaguely WWI themed TBS game.

 

[Vigormortis]

Watching a video isn't at all representative of what the experience is actually like.

I find this is the most aggravating aspect of VR. No matter how much I try to explain to someone what it feels like to use the Vive, no matter how many sample videos I show them of what the games look like, it simply does not convey the actual sensation and experience of using the device yourself.

It's like trying to get someone to understand how it feels to go skydiving or floating in zero-G in orbit. You can explain the experience, you can describe it with as many descriptors as you can think of, but you can't really convey to them what it's really like. It's one of those things you just have to try to fully grasp.

I'd highly suggest you actually try these games and tech demos before you write them off.

Fat chance of that. Most of this board have already made up their minds. No amount of pleading for a fair shake is going to change that. Many still think the current crop of HMDs are still just as bad as the Rift DK1.

:/

 

[Jingle Fett]

Watching a video isn't at all representative of what the experience is actually like.

I find this is the most aggravating aspect of VR. No matter how much I try to explain to someone what it feels like to use the Vive, no matter how many sample videos I show them of what the games look like, it simply does not convey the actual sensation and experience of using the device yourself.

It's like trying to get someone to understand how it feels to go skydiving or floating in zero-G in orbit. You can explain the experience, you can describe it with as many descriptors as you can think of, but you can't really convey to them what it's really like. It's one of those things you just have to try to fully grasp.

I'd highly suggest you actually try these games and tech demos before you write them off.

Fat chance of that. Most of this board have already made up their minds. No amount of pleading for a fair shake is going to change that. Many still think the current crop of HMDs are still just as bad as the Rift DK1.

:/

Yeah it's really hard to explain. I've looked at the screen while my family has tried out some of the games like The Lab and on screen it really doesn't look like anything special--graphics are meh, gameplay is simple, etc. But it changes completely when you're wearing the headset.
I think that's one of the things that astounded me the most after I first tried the DK1 and DK2 Oculus Rift headsets and had time to think about it afterward--the graphics could be absolute garbage and gameplay non-existent, but because the tracking and 3d depth perception is so perfect, those low poly ugly objects look and more importantly feel more real than even the latest AAA Order: 1886 style graphics fest. It's the weirdest thing, but there you have it.

But because it all feels so real, it also causes you to really react like it's real. One game I haven't tried yet is The Brookhaven Experiment, you should see the reactions people have while playing. Poor girl goes hysterical (you can even see the gun shaking) and even the guy who's played it before still gets shaky and sweaty (skip to 15:15 for footage from his first time, it's great)

Spoiler

 

[Yoshi178]

i can't wait to laugh my ass off when people stop caring about it and eventually realise it really is just one big gimmick XD

 

[Vigormortis]

But because it all feels so real, it also causes you to really react like it's real. One game I haven't tried yet is The Brookhaven Experiment, you should see the reactions people have while playing. Poor girl goes hysterical (you can even see the gun shaking) and even the guy who's played it before still gets shaky and sweaty (skip to 15:15 for footage from his first time, it's great)

Spoiler

My gods she's shaking so badly!

I can't think of a single game that's done that to anyone I've ever known.

If it's cheap enough I may have to pick up this game, if only to see others reactions when they try it.

-edit-
Speaking of, have you seen IGN's recordings of their staff trying the Paranormal Activity VR game? Some of them become visibly distressed.

Spoiler

I'm starting to think VR horror games may be bad for people's mental (and physical) health.

i can't wait to laugh my ass off when people stop caring about it and eventually realise it really is just one big gimmick XD

My, how incredibly petty.

Were you like this each time Nintendo's repeated attempts at 'gimmicks' failed? Did you have some 'logical' excuse as to why they failed each and every time? Or is this because Nintendo is lagging behind? Again.[footnote]Huh. This pettiness thing is kinda fun.[/footnote]

Regardless, gimmicks aren't inherently short-lived. A gimmick is nothing more than a hook to get people to pay attention to your product. And, quite often, gimmicks become a standard. Hell, Nintendo thrives on gimmicks. It's the primary selling point of almost all of their games. Just look to the vast majority of Mario games.

So, saying VR is a "gimmick" rings as a hollow criticism.

Gimmick

1--
a : a mechanical device for secretly and dishonestly controlling gambling apparatus
b : an ingenious or novel mechanical device : gadget

2--
a : an important feature that is not immediately apparent : catch
b : an ingenious and usually new scheme or angle
c : a trick or device used to attract business or attention

Take note how only one of those five definitions is inherently bad.

 

[Xyebane]

You already have some of the space sim games compatible, like Elite. I expect there will be mods or support for FPS-style games as well, I think they would be fun in VR. I hope the next Elder Scrolls has VR support as well, that would be cool.

 

[Vigormortis]

You already have some of the space sim games compatible, like Elite. I expect there will be mods or support for FPS-style games as well, I think they would be fun in VR. I hope the next Elder Scrolls has VR support as well, that would be cool.

Given how amazing something as simple as Vanishing Realms is on the Vive, something as grand as an Elder Scrolls game might be downright awe-inspiring.

 

[Cowabungaa]

Give it a decade, I think. Maybe 15 years.

It'll be niche for a while though. I can't see VR gaming becoming the main form of gaming in anything less than 50 years.

 

[Vigormortis]

Give it a decade, I think. Maybe 15 years.

It'll be niche for a while though. I can't see VR gaming becoming the main form of gaming in anything less than 50 years.

Why does it have to become the "main form"? Why not consider it as just an addition to the wide range of gaming options?

I've said it before and I'll say it again: I don't get this mentality that VR's existence somehow MUST necessitate the end to classic forms of gaming.

The advent of 3D gaming didn't kill off 2D gaming. Why would or should VR kill off standard-display-based gaming?

VR can be appealing to more than a niche market without killing off all other forms of gaming entertainment.

 

[Cowabungaa]

snip

I...never said have? Like literally the word is not even featured in the post.