Why are so many people here angry?

[Adeptus Aspartem]

I am probably asking the eternal question: Why are people angry on the Internet? Specifically, this site.

Some say that it's anonymity that is causing this, the lack of identification of a person. However, there is Facebook, where majority of people have their faces as avatars and are using their actual names, yet there are many posts which are ridiculously impolite. And then there is Reddit, where people use nicknames and don't have any visual connection to their person via avatar, yet so far, after few months of being a member of Reddit, I am yet to read something purposfully hurtful even on biggest subreddits.

Some say that it can be because of lack of control, but mods here seem to be incredibly active.

I am at loss.

I never was the most active forum user, always more of a lurker that ocasionally types something, but today I am even less willing to type anything, to communicate with people here. No matter the thread, if it is big enough, it always gets derailed by people being disrespectful towards others, or people who mistakenly though that someone tried to offend them and lauch a counter attack, or by those who simply can't stop arguing because they always must be "winners" of a discussion, or, the most common thing I see, by -isms. And it is always so... Wrathful.

It wasn't always like this. What has happened?

I just want to return to the days of huge threads, where most people were polite, on topic and more than anything willing to help and have fun.

I've the same issue. On the internet in general too. I stopped counting the times i've written a post of decent size just to delete it anyway, because i thought it gets either misconstrued or someone starts arguing semantics and both mostly always in such a tone/way that you'd probably would get slapped across the face in real life.
I also noticed that people often interpret posts just the most hateful/negative way possible, that and tons of projection goin' on, dear lordy lord. Maybe it really comes down to the few active members knowin' each other to well - i wouldn't know i can only remember a few names, i go mostly by avatars (stop switching them!! )

And even while writing this i stopped twice and thought "Not worth the hassle" and wanted to delete it.

 

[Tilly]

Well I'm just learning apparently there was a big deal with ME3. Lol, I joined after that.
Never really saw why that would particularly cause fights with the audience.

 

[Bonecrusher]

I am probably asking the eternal question: Why are people angry on the Internet? Specifically, this site.

I am not angry, I am just sad.

I am disappointed that Transformers, Robocop, TMNT movies "Bay'ed" and turned to unrelated action movies. I am disappointed that X-Men movies (except First Class) were just "Hugh Jackman movies" and nothing more. I am disappointed that neither Spider-Man nor Amazing Spider-Man movies portrayed SM perfectly. I am disappointed that Dredd movie will not have any sequel or a Netflix show. I am disappointed that many classic and great PC games are currently unknown, yet everyone talks about Mario, Zelda, Final Fantasy, more Mario, Halo, more Mario, more Zelda, DuckTales, more Mario, Megaman, Sonic, Final Fantasy and more Mario... I am disappointed we still don't have original Nick Fury in a 70s era TV Show or Movie for the MCU. I am disappointed that MCU Spider-Man is still a high school kid and we still can't have a grown up / university student Peter Parker (Fox Kids cartoon and the Torment storyline portrayed such a Peter). I am disappointed that Almost Human TV Show was a total disappointment and I was expecting a good cyberpunk story. I am disappointed that Constantine and Dresden Files were cancelled in their first season, and we can't have new episodes of them. I am disappointed that Life and Lie To Me were also cancelled and I miss those characters very much. I am dissapointed that Arrow is mostly a soap opera, especially in first and third seasons. I am dissapointed that DC cancelled Young Justice and Marvel cancelled Avengers EMH, yet they are promoting shit-tier series like Ultimate Spider-Man and Teen Titans Go!. I am disappointed that left-wing "progressive" people can't understand they behave like conservative right and therefore regressive. I am disappointed that kebab&pizza shops in Sweden make terrible food and therefore I missed real kebap (not that shit-tier wraps) and some Italian stone oven baked or chain shop (Dominos?) pizza.

 

[Something Amyss]

Knee-jerk reactions. Those are the death of discourse. People stop listening and instead wait for their turn to speak, and that is giving into the knee-jerk reaction rather than giving a discussion time. There's no thinking, just reacting to one or two bits they heard/read before their ears/eyes turned off.
Human beings have the ability to rise up above their base reactions, to think a situation through rather than act on instinct. That should be the defining trait of what separates us from the rest of the animal kingdom but sometimes I wonder if there's more than a few humans that just haven't evolved with that trait.

We have the ability, but we've also evolved with a tendency to cognitive bias that we're not even necessarily aware of. Hell, even being aware of it doesn't necessarily stop you.

There was a guy on YouTube named Harry Ray. Harry did a couple of shows, Monday Mental Mistakes and Friday Fallacies. And the beatuiful thing abot both is that it was very easy for him to illustrate these things in you own mind. Maybe not every week, maybe your brain doesn't make leap X or Y, but as a rule, yeah. One of the weirder feelings you can get is when you know where such a point is going, and your brain goes there anyway.

Though I probably didn't need to go that far. One of the most frustrating things about living with anxiety disorders is being cognisant of it. I feel stupid for dealing with issues I rationally know aren't worth freaking out over, but do anyway.

I mean, the "death of conversation" thing is still accurate, but it's not necessarily that simple to fight the way our brains have evolved. Still, pushing mindfulness is important, and one of the big problems that these issues come down to. It's especially frustrating to try and point out that people are doing the very thing that they're offended by, because we tend to be very good at ignoring our own behaviour. And as close to perfect as I may be, I am no exception.

I know, even having read the entire post, I still felt the need to respond the way I did. I kinda go to soapbox mode with statements like the one I quoted. Even when the person in question wasn't intentionally conveying that message, it's one of those things I feel the need to challenge, because someone will take it seriously. So let's just put it down to my having a weird habitual need to say something against statements like those.

Sorry about that too.

But I think that's a good point that you brought up, especially in regards to the internet and internet forums. Somethings just kinda flick people's internal switches on somethings, then someone goes off a tangent. So if I did anything useful, it was proving that people sometimes tend to go into tangent mode with online text communications.

I'd be lying if I said I wouldn't want to fight that myself. I kind of take issue with being called mentally ill, dangerous, compared to child molesters and rapists and whatnot. but if you did read on and understood his post, it seems like the outcome was even more prone to derail. And yeah, I get it that people get set off and whatnot. Because what Pluvia said is something that pisses me off. Just not at him, because he was saying it as a narrative device. But especially given the moderation issues. And speakingof....

-SNIP-

I know this wasn't the reason I was quoted, but I think it's sort of worth pointing out again that one of the reasons for the passive-aggressive tone around here everyone hates is that the rules are literally gamed for that kind of response. Making the rules harsher will not only pare down the community further, but it will probably lead to more hostility and passive confrontation, not less. There's also the fact that this is a forum that demands discussion value, which always seems to force people to dice a fine line between discussion and argument. We;re asked to consider that our content might be taken the wrong way, might offend someone, etc. These are not rules even conducive to discussing things like minority rights (when majorities tend to be so easily offended)./

I'm not complaining about moderation here, for the record. I'm just pointing out that the tone everyone hates so much is the natural progression. The site demands discussion value but opposes anything remotely resembling conflict. How else are people with conflicting ideologies going to engage?

Well, I mean, we could not. We could all disengage. And then there would be nothing left but forum games. Maybe the occasional appreciation thread.

 

[Belaam]

a) Gamergate caused a very clear rift. The differences were always there but GG made them clear and gave them names.

b) The drastic reduction in members and activity mean that a lot of the people here recognize each other and are at least somewhat familiar with each other's views and perspectives. You see a thread by a regular and you can often take an immediate and accurate guess of what it's going to be about. That might sound like a good thing and in some ways it probably is, but it also means that people enter threads carrying baggage from previous discussions and arguments. Many discussions turn into running duels between old enemies.

This. I'd add that some of the remaining posters after the exodus of 2014 became extremely prolific and were following people to other threads to harass them about unrelated arguments. I'm generally thick skinned, but this is the only forum I am on where I actually blocked a couple users because I got so sick of their constant ranting on the same couple of issues. And I went from coming here multiple times a day to a few times a month.

 

[Cowabungaa]

Still, pushing mindfulness is important, and one of the big problems that these issues come down to. It's especially frustrating to try and point out that people are doing the very thing that they're offended by, because we tend to be very good at ignoring our own behaviour. And as close to perfect as I may be, I am no exception.

I'd want to put that in a larger perspective. Introspection, as a skill and behavior, is not at all valued 'among the masses'. I notice it in the little things as well, people in general being so very focused on externality, of expressing themselves. It's rare to see someone stop and think why they do something, why they think or feel something and reflect upon it. Maybe it's never been a mainstream skill, limited to a small intellectual elite. Maybe we're only noticing it more nowadays because it's become so easy to express yourself in a greater public discourse.

It's genuinely why I would want some form of philosophical education starting from primary school. To learn how to critically reflect not only on your society but also more importantly on yourself.

 

[P. K. Qu'est Que Ce]

I just got here from GameTrailers, but it doesn't seem angry to me. Certainly it's nothing like Reddit or 4chan, or the average Youtube and Disqus chat. Maybe you're looking for something unrealistic.

 

[Parasondox]

Simple. People, some people, just do not find excitement and joy in the things they use to love and are bitter and cynical about everything else that doesnt even need to involve them.

They are also, often times, just full of shit. You are passionate about something, fantastic. That's a great thing. Someone else is passionate about something else, that's even more fantastic. What isn't fantastic? Being pointlessly angry over the bare minimum. A piece of "nothing" that does not and will not change how the world functions. Then using buzzwords in order to rally people into an "Us vs Them" situation, to try and justify their point of nothingness. And yes the obvious point of anger is to do with... well if I say it, something may lose it, but the Gamergate "controversy" was such pointless stupid nonsense that didn't really achieve much and made people involve, both pro and anti, look ridiculously childish. Even mentioning names, AS and ZQ would cause anger. Anger over what? A point of view? An opinion? A personal matter? Really?

Letting out frustrations is good. I have done it many times. You just need to decide whether it's worth making noise about or its just something that is simply pointless. Not everything needs to make noise.

 

[dyre]

As I've gotten older, I've grown less interested in having a debate with people on the internet. It just seems like a completely masturbatory exercise which really doesn't accomplish much of anything. Think about it, how many times has someone proving you wrong actually changed your world view or vice versa? Exactly. So we do see those posts where people go back and forth arguing about shit about GamerGate or the like. I just chalk it up that being a young person's game, they're idealist thinking if they just present the facts there shouldn't be a question... which is silly cause people don't work like that.

People have a capacity to change, don't get me wrong. But the amount of that change varies person to person, and it's very rare people can change significantly. It's a gift. Because it means not being blinded by one's ego. People worry too much about their image, or not being a hypocrite. That's not very wise.

I don't actually find anything to angry about the place though... but I tend to just look at it as a place where, I'll just through out my worthless 2 cents, see if it spikes a reaction. Usually it doesn't, so I take it as a good sign. Occasionally I've made posts asking questions just to try to better wrap my head around people's world views, there is no right or wrong answer I say. If nothing else, I like to think that's healthy. If I can't hold the same view point, at least I can try to understand it.

The only thing I didn't like was a few months ago... Like sometimes I take on a very flippant tone when I talk about my personal philosophy because I don't want to come across like a smug liberal dickhead. I know that past paragraph, with me talking about viewpoints, I sound like a real hippy. It disgusts the lingering early 20 something Ayn Rand reading young man I once was. Anyway, another user took objection to it, tried telling me in an equally flippant way that I would condone basically someone getting assaulted. THAT rustled the jimmies. Ya know, don't tell me what I believe and furthermore don't place that that kind of label on me. That kinda neo nazi bullshit is disgusting. Just through them on the old ignore list, cause fuck it man. Not everyone is meant to get along. And that's okay, cause we live with these tools that allow us not to have to.

I feel you 100%. I'm still amazed I had so much time and energy to get riled up over arguments on the internet back when I was in college. Now that I have a job and have to pay rent, my list of "things worth arguing about" has shrunken dramatically.

I think when you get older and have less time / more responsibilities, you necessarily have to prioritize what's actually important to you vs. what's merely a "masturbatory exercise." At least for me, that necessity has given me a great deal of perspective on the things that really matter. And winning arguments on the internet just isn't one of those things!

Though, I'm happy to say I don't recall ever getting particularly angry over an argument, at least. I've always considered letting emotions (and their associated personal attacks) slip into arguments to be...uncivilized.

 

[Barbas]

Well one group of people got really upset that people refused to agree with and support their patron Saint Anita Sarkeesian and her teachings in her efforts to make as much money as she could off well meaning misguided suckers end all rape, sexual harassment and domestic abuse by censoring video games and shaming developers who refused to kiss the ring making games better and easier with less actual challenge and no need to learn or develop your skills beyond moving the stick forward more inclusive.

The same group then got really upset that people refused to accept Zoe Quinn as the worlds best game developer and deserving of $60K plus a year because she made a Twine game once and was born with a vagina.

So having seen tactics used by said people they decided to try and apply a number of labels to people who didn't agree and attempt to argue the most obscure possible things like talking about banning(In the context of starting to do it) things is in no way actually a sign someone in that discussion having a desire to see something banned . . .

Are you posting in the correct thread, on the correct planet? Why would you bring that obsession here? All you're going to do is derail it with another tedious GID argument. Show some decency; either keep it on-topic or leave these people in peace.

 

[TheJebus]

It's because too many people here have turned into an art form the ability of acting extremely passive-aggressively and implying all kinds of insults without actually stating them directly. They are able to dance perfectly along the letter of the rules, while trampling all over the spirit of the rules.
Such people like to push the buttons of others and are (somehow) able to go all the way up to the arbitrary moderation line without actually crossing it, and they hope the person they're riling up crosses that line in their reply and gets moderated for it, at which point the original troublemaker sits back in their echo-chamber usergroup and has a good old laugh.

Basically, it's just a big game.

EDIT: This came across a lot more bitter than I intended. But let me just say that I'm of the opinion that passive-aggressive insults and rudeness are far MORE annoying than actual direct insults. And the way the rules here are written has simply fostered a rather sizable group of extremely insufferable passive-aggressive people.
I'm sure the rules meant well, once upon a time, but now they're to the detriment of the forum, sadly.

This a million times.

Pretty disgusting state of affairs. I'm not even surprised the first post was best post on this topic.

 

[The Lunatic]

People have been complaining about passive aggression of certain users and how it's creating an awful environment for the forums.

Unfortunately, these complaints fell of deaf ears and unsurprisingly, most people got tired of it and didn't stick around.

 

[Redlin5_v1legacy]

Old school forums are like high schools. The drama can be downright intoxicating to some. Also, video games are serious business.

It's actually refreshing when I get flamed in threads that have nothing to do with politics in anyway since it's so rare these days. I had a guy take a shit down my throat for dumbest reason in a Skyrim thread a few months back. In retrospect, it was actually pretty hilarious. I had a forum super hero shut him down, but I can't remember who it was.

Spoiler: Was expecting this from you Fappy

The reason why I see people getting, lets say, passionate online is because forums are geared for replies and some people just can't stop replying. I've seen some truly petty attempts to poke the bear in my brain but I've got that sucker on a short leash and heavily sedated. It is always funny seeing people trying to rile me up using Pokemon against me.

 

[OldNewNewOld]

I don't think the problem is the anger. Anger is everywhere. I've been on sites where people are much "worse" than here. I visit 4chan on a daily basis. I know anger and insults very well.

The problem here is the heavy atmosphere. It's exactly as the first post said. The passive-aggressive creative insults meant to walk on the fine line of the rules is what makes this whole forum seem worse than it actually is.
When I'm on 4chan, I know what to expect. People are more honest there. You will get insulted over stupid things, but you will also see their honest opinions as long as you stay away from the popular boards. And even there you can have a somewhat decent discussion if you just ignore the people who are obviously baiting, trolling or being retarded on purpose. Here you can't even call out the obvious troll. But he can trow at you insult after insult as long as it's passive aggressive to circumvent the rules.
I don't know about you, but I don't mind insults. I just dislike the heavy atmosphere where people aren't allowed to insult each other but then find ways to do it in some elaborate way. It feels wore than when someone on 4chan calls me a ******, ******, retard or whatever new insult they come up with.

Don't get me wrong. I like it here as well. The site is my main source of games news, I love yathzee despite disagreeing with his videos more often than not. I enjoy the forum although I post maybe only 1/4th of all the posts I write. Usually I delete them because I decide it's not worth the discussion. And I know I'm also part of the problem. When I get annoyed by someone I resort to the same passive aggressiveness. Bend the rule until they are just about to be broken and stop. But I still think the "go fuck yourself you fucking mongrel" is far nicer than a wall of text that you can tl.dr. into the same shit.

I don't plan on leaving any time soon, but some more loose rules could help. Some actual insults instead of this pseudo-intellectual "look at how smart I am, so much smarter than you, I can insult you without breaking the rules" bullshit.

 

[P. K. Qu'est Que Ce]

Ok, now I see the angry people.

 

[n0e]

Old school forums are like high schools. The drama can be downright intoxicating to some. Also, video games are serious business.

It's actually refreshing when I get flamed in threads that have nothing to do with politics in anyway since it's so rare these days. I had a guy take a shit down my throat for dumbest reason in a Skyrim thread a few months back. In retrospect, it was actually pretty hilarious. I had a forum super hero shut him down, but I can't remember who it was.

It doesn't even need to be an "old school" forum. Other social sites suffer from the same issue with a few members of their respective communities. It's just that there are some folks who thrive on the drama that they create with the safety anonymity provides them.

Specifically to this site, there are some changes that will be made that, hopefully, help reduce the level of tension and passive aggressive behavior from folks who feel they must respond this way to be heard. Of course, it won't solve the issue that certain members only want to act that way.

 

[Fappy]

Old school forums are like high schools. The drama can be downright intoxicating to some. Also, video games are serious business.

It's actually refreshing when I get flamed in threads that have nothing to do with politics in anyway since it's so rare these days. I had a guy take a shit down my throat for dumbest reason in a Skyrim thread a few months back. In retrospect, it was actually pretty hilarious. I had a forum super hero shut him down, but I can't remember who it was.

It doesn't even need to be an "old school" forum. Other social sites suffer from the same issue with a few members of their respective communities. It's just that there are some folks who thrive on the drama that they create with the safety anonymity provides them.

Specifically to this site, there are some changes that will be made that, hopefully, help reduce the level of tension and passive aggressive behavior from folks who feel they must respond this way to be heard. Of course, it won't solve the issue that certain members only want to act that way.

That's good to hear. Historically, this community has had a lot of issues with passive aggressiveness. The CoC is written in such a way that a clever user can get away with insulting another poster without getting an infraction. I'm honestly not sure what can be done to fix it but I guarantee you'll never stop seeing people complain about it until something changes.

Thankfully for you the community schism of 2014-2015 is more or less over (thanks GG :/). You've already seen that there's a lot of left over bad blood around here, but most of the problem users have long since been banned or left the site. I don't think it'll be as much of an issue later down the line.

If I had any advice it would be to keep an eye out for User Group drama. Many small communities within this site have imploded due to increased tensions within and between user groups. The snipes you saw derail the Mod chat a few days ago was likely due to leftover drama from a really ugly user group implosion that happened last year (I was at ground zero, as was a former mod). When these wars flare up it usually involves users "spying" on other groups and screen shotting incriminating posts, usually libeling someone outside the group. From what I have seen in the past, it's best to shut that kind of behavior down right away. It tends to spiral out of control quickly around here. Last time I was around for it all sorts of nastiness happened, including some people getting doxxed and such. Lost a lot of users due to that.

Anyway, don't want to tell you how to do your job. Just offering some insight!

 

[vallorn]

Spoiler: You can't just call people angry! That makes me feel angry!

Jokes aside;

Old school forums are like high schools. The drama can be downright intoxicating to some. Also, video games are serious business.

It's actually refreshing when I get flamed in threads that have nothing to do with politics in anyway since it's so rare these days. I had a guy take a shit down my throat for dumbest reason in a Skyrim thread a few months back. In retrospect, it was actually pretty hilarious. I had a forum super hero shut him down, but I can't remember who it was.

It doesn't even need to be an "old school" forum. Other social sites suffer from the same issue with a few members of their respective communities. It's just that there are some folks who thrive on the drama that they create with the safety anonymity provides them.

Specifically to this site, there are some changes that will be made that, hopefully, help reduce the level of tension and passive aggressive behavior from folks who feel they must respond this way to be heard. Of course, it won't solve the issue that certain members only want to act that way.

Glad to hear that some changes are on the way to help with that situation. Good luck with getting that all sorted out smoothly.

 

[Gengisgame]

Most of the time they aren't, people often assume that someone using harsh language is angry when it's simply a tool for emphasis.

This should be under basic internet 101 - remember you aren't talking to someone face to face, you may often assume the person is more frustrated or being more offensive than they actually are because you don't know the tone with which they are saying it. Many people add cursewords to there casual vocabulary irl.

 

[Something Amyss]

I'd want to put that in a larger perspective. Introspection, as a skill and behavior, is not at all valued 'among the masses'. I notice it in the little things as well, people in general being so very focused on externality, of expressing themselves. It's rare to see someone stop and think why they do something, why they think or feel something and reflect upon it. Maybe it's never been a mainstream skill, limited to a small intellectual elite. Maybe we're only noticing it more nowadays because it's become so easy to express yourself in a greater public discourse.

It's genuinely why I would want some form of philosophical education starting from primary school. To learn how to critically reflect not only on your society but also more importantly on yourself.

Not just introspection, either. A lot of this could be solved by critical thinking: is this story I'm angry about valid?

Hell, one thing that amazes me is that I'm on the internet. I can investigate a claim without ever once leaving this chair, or even leaving my browser. And I can come back to the topic at hand and say "actually, X is true," and people--also on the internet--will fire back with "you think you're so smart!"

It doesn't matter if I'm smart or dumb. Research is a tool in my toolkit. It's not a superpower. And it's a little troubling the number of people who seem to view intellect as a bad thing. Or that simply employing it is somehow a sign of superiority.

There's a video series I won't name on here because it will cause a shitstorm, but it makes a rather excellent point about inferred judgment calls. There is a tendency to jump on people who, for example, don't eat meat. The inferred notion here is "they don't eat meat, and I do, so they must think I'm a bad person."

I'm pretty sure the same applies here. And now we're back to reflection. I'm tired and in pain and kind of rambling now.

It's actually refreshing when I get flamed in threads that have nothing to do with politics in anyway since it's so rare these days. I had a guy take a shit down my throat for dumbest reason in a Skyrim thread a few months back. In retrospect, it was actually pretty hilarious. I had a forum super hero shut him down, but I can't remember who it was.

Yeah, well, I am fundamentally and diametrically opposed to everything you believe!

Also, you were much cooler as a cat!

...need some ointment for that burn? >.>