why believe in "woo"?

[Zerstiren]

I'm trying to reconcile my life, and my perceived shortcomings. I have always had a firm belief in an afterlife, and I also believe I'm a powerful being, in relation to the spiritual realm (think Bleach, but not nearly as absurd).

On the surface, I'm a regular person, with regular problems, normal life scars, and healthy, loving relationships with family and friends. And yet I want to believe I am extraordinary, as though I'm still making up for feeling left out as a kid, or for not having wicked talent in something like music or writing.

I don't know if I can ever bring myself to accept mundane explanations for my existence: I've tried, and not only did it banish the magic of supernatural ideas, but also the magic of wonder and purpose.

Is anyone else as stubborn and immature about facing reality as I am?

 

[ClockworkPenguin]

Seriously? Space-time expanding many powers faster than the speed of light, Shitloads (technical measurement, trust me)of antimatter and matter colliding to release Gigawhoosits of light, Star systems forming and dying and forming to create the elements to create life, which then struggles for billions of years against comets, and ice ages and deserts, becoming aware, developing physical tools to shape the world instead of being shaped, developing language, developing thoughts, so that for the first time the universe has a way of describing itself, and right at the end, it results in you...

That's mundane? You see no wonder or awe in that?

 

[Zerstiren]

Seriously? Space-time expanding many powers faster than the speed of light, Shitloads (technical measurement, trust me)of antimatter and matter colliding to release Gigawhoosits of light, Star systems forming and dying and forming to create the elements to create life, which then struggles for billions of years against comets, and ice ages and deserts, becoming aware, developing physical tools to shape the world instead of being shaped, developing language, developing thoughts, so that for the first time the universe has a way of describing itself, and right at the end, it results in you...

That's mundane? You see no wonder or awe in that?

. . . . no. And I'm not trying to be a contrarian either, because all of those observations are awesome in their own respect. I just naturally gravitate to the belief in supernatural mechanisms making me who I am.

 

[Revnak_v1legacy]

Seriously? Space-time expanding many powers faster than the speed of light, Shitloads (technical measurement, trust me)of antimatter and matter colliding to release Gigawhoosits of light, Star systems forming and dying and forming to create the elements to create life, which then struggles for billions of years against comets, and ice ages and deserts, becoming aware, developing physical tools to shape the world instead of being shaped, developing language, developing thoughts, so that for the first time the universe has a way of describing itself, and right at the end, it results in you...

That's mundane? You see no wonder or awe in that?

So much this. I will add so as not to receive a warning, and because I love making comments about the wonders of existence.

People are among the most magnificent things in existence. Your very ability to imagine that there is something innately magical about you is magnificent in so many ways that I believe we would need a new word to describe just how magnificent it is. People come up with some of the most amazing ideas, entire worlds can exist within our imaginations, and such is only the beginning of what makes you OP, as a person, magnificent. You are capable of looking up at the stars in wonder, not any simple primal drive for the sole sake of survival, but true wonder. You can admire the beauty of the existence that lay before you, and imagine things even more beautiful than that. Things so beautiful that the world cannot even begin to put that into existence. And you think yourself normal, average, boring. You are a pinnacle of existence, more so than any star or planet. Worlds and stars die that we would exist my friend. Do not undervalue yourself.

 

[Soviet Steve]

It must be difficult to be unable to comprehend the physical world, though I hope your divinity in the spirit realm wont come to harm people in the real world.

Also what is woo?

 

[Zerstiren]

It must be difficult to be unable to comprehend the physical world, though I hope your divinity in the spirit realm wont come to harm people in the real world.

Also what is woo?

I won't ever hurt anyone for my beliefs, unless someone handsome and as charming as David Koresh were to dine and drug me.


Woo is a blanket term, for any supernatural/paranormal beliefs, which believers use as a security blanket against determinism and physicalism.

 

[the Dept of Science]

I refuse your classification of the scientific reason behind your existence as anything "mundane".


The supernatural "explanation" has nothing on that. It's just a bunch of handwavey bleh.
Feeling power over a realm which you can't experience doesn't really sound like real power at all. I just suspect that you feel you lack autonomy in your everyday life.

 

[Atmos Duality]

People are among the most magnificent things in existence. Your very ability to imagine that there is something innately magical about you is magnificent in so many ways that I believe we would need a new word to describe just how magnificent it is. People come up with some of the most amazing ideas, entire worlds can exist within our imaginations, and such is only the beginning of what makes you OP, as a person, magnificent. You are capable of looking up at the stars in wonder, not any simple primal drive for the sole sake of survival, but true wonder. You can admire the beauty of the existence that lay before you, and imagine things even more beautiful than that. Things so beautiful that the world cannot even begin to put that into existence. And you think yourself normal, average, boring. You are a pinnacle of existence, more so than any star or planet. Worlds and stars die that we would exist my friend. Do not undervalue yourself.

^Exactly that. Understanding, not dread, comes from curiosity.

Life is so irrational, so seemingly needless and yet so self-orderly in the infinite chaos of the universe, that we are magnificent indeed.

We are the only things we know of in existence that "need", the only things that judge, evaluate and arrive at seemingly irrational decisions for no discernible reason. From any objective standpoint, we crave the most absurd things to slake our curiosity.

I'm a meteorologist; a man who vainly attempts to take a comparably small amount of chaos and turn it into some sort of order. I study and see physical interactions occur, and when they resolve, that's it. The most overt results remain while the rest imperceptibly spin off into the fuzzy territory of chaos.
The fact that I get excited when storms and imminent destruction approach, alone, proves how absurd life can be. And in that, I am forever amused, and curious.

 

[Zerstiren]

I can see where you're coming from, and admire the principle of finding the humanity in all threads of life. But something, which I cannot put my finger on, urges me to entertain the existence of a soul. It's as though my brain is a film projector, and whenever I think myself as a determined automaton, I stop the projector, and my brain desperately tries to start up again, in order to keep the stream of consciousness going.

I know I sound like a have a huge ego and small imagination, but I'm being honest. Perhaps if I keep revisiting this, I will become more comfortable with the prospect of an entirely discrete universe.

 

[DigitalAtlas]

I'm trying to reconcile my life, and my perceived shortcomings. I have always had a firm belief in an afterlife, and I also believe I'm a powerful being, in relation to the spiritual realm (think Bleach, but not nearly as absurd).

On the surface, I'm a regular person, with regular problems, normal life scars, and healthy, loving relationships with family and friends. And yet I want to believe I am extraordinary, as though I'm still making up for feeling left out as a kid, or for not having wicked talent in something like music or writing.

I don't know if I can ever bring myself to accept mundane explanations for my existence: I've tried, and not only did it banish the magic of supernatural ideas, but also the magic of wonder and purpose.

Is anyone else as stubborn and immature about facing reality as I am?

Don't worry, your cutie mark will appear one day.

 

[Zerstiren]

I refuse your classification of the scientific reason behind your existence as anything "mundane".

The supernatural "explanation" has nothing on that. It's just a bunch of handwavey bleh.
Feeling power over a realm which you can't experience doesn't really sound like real power at all. I just suspect that you feel you lack autonomy in your everyday life.

This is exactly what I'm trying to get to: accept my life for what it is. If I can make some changes for the better, then all the better. But I still feel the need to supplant my blatant, monotonous life with the thought of having an exceptional connection to the universe, to think an exciting, unforeseen destiny is in store for me, or a multitude of diverse lifetimes.

 

[Sean Hollyman]

If I knew what a woo was I'd get back on that

 

[Zerstiren]

If I knew what a woo was I'd get back on that

see post #7

 

[ClockworkPenguin]

I can see where you're coming from, and admire the principle of finding the humanity in all threads of life. But something, which I cannot put my finger on, urges me to entertain the existence of a soul. It's as though my brain is a film projector, and whenever I think myself as a determined automaton, I stop the projector, and my brain desperately tries to start up again, in order to keep the stream of consciousness going.

I know I sound like a have a huge ego and small imagination, but I'm being honest. Perhaps if I keep revisiting this, I will become more comfortable with the prospect of an entirely discrete universe.

Materialism and determinism are not synonymous. You can still 'be' without the need to invoke the soul. The brain has loads and loads of connections, and possible pathways. It is a fantastically complicated system.

People might say that you are just a bunch of chemicals and electric impulses, but that's like saying that a picture is just a lot of blobs of oil and water. Its perfectly possible that our actions are determined, and its a valid viewpoint, but it doesn't follow inevitably from materialism

 

[Revnak_v1legacy]

I can see where you're coming from, and admire the principle of finding the humanity in all threads of life. But something, which I cannot put my finger on, urges me to entertain the existence of a soul. It's as though my brain is a film projector, and whenever I think myself as a determined automaton, I stop the projector, and my brain desperately tries to start up again, in order to keep the stream of consciousness going.

I know I sound like a have a huge ego and small imagination, but I'm being honest. Perhaps if I keep revisiting this, I will become more comfortable with the prospect of an entirely discrete universe.

I find it strange that you consider the idea of a meaningful physical universe and a meaningful spiritual universe mutually dependent or exclusive. I believe in both. Our existence bears a meaning that is entirely wonderful, entirely magnificent, but I do believe in a human soul that has a magnificence all its own. Both of these are separate, though mutually supporting, beliefs for me. You can look out at the stars and see a universe that is truly beautiful, with yourself in its center in a certain frame of mind, and you can look into the depths of your soul and the souls of others and you can see the wonder of man, and the magnificence thereof. One does not necessitate or exclude the other, and I firmly believe both are reasonable, acceptable views. Go on and believe both if that is what you want to believe.

 

[Zerstiren]

I find it strange that you consider the idea of a meaningful physical universe and a meaningful physical universe mutually dependent or exclusive. I believe in both. Our existence bears a meaning that is entirely wonderful, entirely magnificent, but I do believe in a human soul that has a magnificence all its own. Both of these are separate, though mutually supporting, beliefs for me. You can look out at the stars and see a universe that is truly beautiful, with yourself in its center in a certain frame of mind, and you can look into the depths of your soul and the souls of others and you can see the wonder of man, and the magnificence thereof. One does not necessitate or exclude the other, and I firmly believe both are reasonable, acceptable views. Go on and believe both if that is what you want to believe.
[/QUOTE]


I assume you meant a "fantastic" universe vs. a "physical" universe. I suppose you're right, and I'm just ramming my head against the same obstacle Steven Hawking faced: religion vs. science. I am a spiritual person, and my beliefs are, for me, not just allegories of morals and ethics. My personal experience of the spiritual isn't based on any mainstream conventions: just my own imagination.

But I do accept the laws of physics, genes, and all the other wonderful, measurable discoveries in science. I guess I just need to stop defending my spiritual beliefs against my need for concrete answers, because I'm only running around in circles, and it doesn't do me any good.

 

[Revnak_v1legacy]

I find it strange that you consider the idea of a meaningful physical universe and a meaningful physical universe mutually dependent or exclusive. I believe in both. Our existence bears a meaning that is entirely wonderful, entirely magnificent, but I do believe in a human soul that has a magnificence all its own. Both of these are separate, though mutually supporting, beliefs for me. You can look out at the stars and see a universe that is truly beautiful, with yourself in its center in a certain frame of mind, and you can look into the depths of your soul and the souls of others and you can see the wonder of man, and the magnificence thereof. One does not necessitate or exclude the other, and I firmly believe both are reasonable, acceptable views. Go on and believe both if that is what you want to believe.
[/QUOTE]


I assume you meant a "fantastic" universe vs. a "physical" universe. I suppose you're right, and I'm just ramming my head against the same obstacle Steven Hawking faced: religion vs. science. I am a spiritual person, and my beliefs are, for me, not just allegories of morals and ethics. My personal experience of the spiritual isn't based on any mainstream conventions: just my own imagination.

But I do accept the laws of physics, genes, and all the other wonderful, measurable discoveries in science. I guess I just need to stop defending my spiritual beliefs against my need for concrete answers, because I'm only running around in circles, and it doesn't do me any good.

There just [I]HAS[/I] to be a soul![/quote]
Rationalism and spiritualism are not mutually exclusive. They have only started being considered such in this modern age due to the entirely false presumption (on both sides) that religion and science are "at war" with one another and always have been, which is an absolutely groundless assumption in the greater scheme of things. They are simply both efforts to answer questions, some of which only one of the two can answer. Many of the greatest rationalists and scientists have also been deeply spiritual individuals, just as some of them haven't been.
[spoiler="This is less relevant this time so I'll spoiler it."][img src="https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-SAjK93tK4KQ/Thz74ETAVSI/AAAAAAAAABk/2lwuQnjPv24/just-be-yourself-you-are-wonderful-109234-500-335.jpg"][/spoiler]