Why Do Marvel Consistently Do Superhero Movies Better Than Other Studios?

KissingSunlight

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This was brought up in the recent Experience Points blog. He didn't have an answer. Quite frankly, I am at a loss too. Considering how badly other studios have treated superhero movies. For example, the recent Fantastic Four director telling it's cast member to not to read the comic books that the movie is based on is pretty telling why that movie failed as bad as it did.

So, why do you think Marvel has been more successful with superhero movies than other studios?
 

KyuubiNoKitsune-Hime

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Probably the biggest reason Marvel has been more successful with the MCU compared to most other studios is down to one thing, respect for the source material. Next to that, I'd have to guess is that put actual effort into their productions, instead of going for things like shallow edginess as a cheap attempt at a cash in. Really good casting where they find talent to at fits the role instead of patent stunt casting for name recognition doesn't hurt either. Also, having access to Disney's money pit sure helps too.
 

ChaoGuy2006

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KyuubiNoKitsune-Hime said:
Probably the biggest reason Marvel has been more successful with the MCU compared to most other studios is down to one thing, respect for the source material. Next to that, I'd have to guess is that put actual effort into their productions, instead of going for things like shallow edginess as a cheap attempt at a cash in. Really good casting where they find talent to at fits the role instead of patent stunt casting for name recognition doesn't hurt either. Also, having access to Disney's money pit sure helps too.
Hammered everything I wanted to say on the head. Though Civil War actually differed from the comic, but apparently (from circles I go to) even comic fans didn't like the storyline??

I think Batman Begins/Dark Knight actually helped Marvel. It gave them an exact guide of how to be different to them.

DC was dark, so Marvel became colorful and witty (maybe too much in the Spiderman reboot).
Though this difference is as old as both comics themselves perhaps. Compare the DC Animated series of the Late 80s/early 90s to what Marvel was doing- one is dark and mature (though not edgy), the other was more whimsical and saccharine.
DC focused on philosophy, politics, justice, and the higher-thoughts (for lack of a better word). Marvel had corny jokes, big explosions, and over-the top fights.

While I feel Marvel entertained it's target audience perfectly with it's films (children of all ages), DC kinda faltered. It was too low brow for high brow people, and regular fans had seen it done better before (seriously- DC Animated universe holds up today. Great stuff!!).

Despite all this, I think DC have actually done better on TV than Marvel. Agents of Shield and Carter are good... But they always feel like they're holding back stuff for the movies (save for season finale's of their shows), while Arrow, Gotham, and The Flash feel like they give everything in every episode building up to a great finale each season- high stakes and genuine excitement.

Honestly, Marvel movies are starting to grate on me. Ultron was good- but not great. And with all the hype, potential, and Disney's warchest I expected great. Apart from movie with Avengers characters in them, their other productions could do worse than expected (though Deadpool might eek out thanks to the characters following/reputation)
With DC, while their movies don't compare to Marvels in entertainment value (Dawn of Justice looks to be shaping up as a multi-character pile up akin to Amazing Spiderman 2) and their more "mature" moments happen so often the film feels like it's draped in the misery you went into the theater to escape from, their TV shows are great series that are leagues above the "side-stories" that Marvel puts on the smaller screen.
 

WolfThomas

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ChaoGuy2006 said:
Despite all this, I think DC have actually done better on TV than Marvel. Agents of Shield and Carter are good... But they always feel like they're holding back stuff for the movies (save for season finale's of their shows), while Arrow, Gotham, and The Flash feel like they give everything in every episode building up to a great finale each season- high stakes and genuine excitement.
I agree about Agent's of SHIELD. But marvel also has Dardevil and Jessica Jones. Which are freakin' great.
 

ChaoGuy2006

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WolfThomas said:
I agree about Agent's of SHIELD. But marvel also has Dardevil and Jessica Jones. Which are freakin' great.
The cursed Netflix/Amazon exclusives! Still gonna avoid spoilers and pay for it one off on DVD/BluRay
 

Johnny Novgorod

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I think the Marvel movies are basically the world's most expensive TV show that just happens to play at the movie theaters. And it hooks most people on the same principle as TV shows: there's always a new episode, characters are endearing to follow, season finales (the Avengers movies) are hyped as fuck, and there's always the promise of bigger and better to come.
 

darkcalling

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I can kinda boil it down to three reasons.

1. Money. Marvel has it, and has access to Disney's at least to some extent so they can afford to throw money at their movies and get the best people to film them and star in them.

2 A connected universe. Marvel is treating their movies and shows just like they do their comics. They're all in the same universe and what happens in one can cause repercussions in others. This helps keep people interested and keeps their buts in the theater seats.

3. Respect for the source material. Marvel knows that a big part of why comics are successful is a balance of drama and weirdness. The same universe contains a billionaire in power armor, multiple gods, a talking raccoon with a gun nearly as big as he is, and more. They aren't afraid to embrace that kind of silliness and break up the action with a joke.

Fantastic Four was given to people with no respect for the license and it failed miserably for it. Spiderman fared better but the reboot seemed unnecessary (i am looking forward to what marvel studios does with him now that they have him back though) and X-Men has always been kinda hit or miss.

I AM looking forward to Deadpool though. The trailers have already gone a long way towards washing Barakapool out of my memory.
 

Dizchu

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The absence of Zack Snyder is to me a good explanation for why MCU films are decent. Seriously, I'm dreading the upcoming "Justice" films.
 

Hawki

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No doubt I'm going to be called a troll, but if we equate "better" with "more successful," then I can answer it:

-Broad, low brow humour that suckers in the majority of its target audience. Broad enough to appeal to all ages (seriously, I work in a library, the amount of Marvel stuff that's sprung up in the kid's section is to the extent where it has its own box), but not offend anyone.

-Playing it safe. You might call this "consistent vision," but it's a vision that's dictated by company suits rather than a writer or director. Even people who like the MCU have noticed this, that there's a 'sameiness' to MCU films. People know what they're getting, and will go to get the same product over and over (compare Avengers to Guardians - "bunch of people who can't work together must band together to save city from invading aliens who's using a McGuffin in said invasion, after which they're all friends and have their own rocket ship"). It's the same reason why I found The Force Awakens offputting, in that it riffs off A New Hope. Apply that to an entire movie series and call it a virtue.

-Duality: As in, the good guys are good, the bad guys are bad. I've gone on about this elsewhere, but I can't name a single MCU villain with any depth (people will cite Loki, all I can say is "daddy issues"), and certainly not any with anything approaching moral ambiguity. Aldrich is the only villain I can mention who's engendered any level of sympathy from me, but this is a blip in the realm of "take over the world" (Red Skull), "destroy the world" (Ronan), or "destroy the universe" (Malekeith). But as I mentioned in point 1, "good guys vs. bad guys" is easy to market.

-Continuity Porn: Another positive for some I guess, but the MCU is, by definition, connected. And when everything's connected, that gives a drive to see things that you wouldn't otherwise watch. Suppose I liked Thor, for instance - well, all intents and purposes is that to see Thor: Ragnarok, not only would I have to see the previous two films (which is a fair request), but at the least, the Avengers film (to understand who Hulk is, since he features in it), and arguably, even The Incredible Hulk itself. That's three films I have to watch to understand a character who, for all intents and purposes, is from an entirely different movie series to the series I'm theoretically watching. Like I said, I accept that this is a plus for some people, but it's part of the reason why I've given up trying to follow the MCU. Guardians I enjoyed, and likely in part to its stand-alone nature, whereas in Iron Man 3 (my favorite), I still would have to have watched The Avengers to understand what "the Battle of New York" was, and why Tony was freaking out. Fine for people who like this thing, not fine for someone who only saw The Avengers by chance, and wouldn't have seen it in preparation for IM3, because I'm sorry, I don't care about the other heroes, I just care about this one.

-Faithfulness of Adaptation: To some, this is a plus, that MCU has produced faithful adaptations of the source material. Fine, I can accept that. I can see that being an inherent pro. That said, I don't think that's an inherent virtue. Plenty of film adaptations (Lord of the Rings, Starship Troopers, The Shining, Howl's Moving Castle, etc.), differ siginificantly from their source material in key areas, if not in their entirety, yet are all lauded. How well a film adopts its source is academic on how it works as a film. To use one of the above examples, as an adaptation, Starship Troopers is terrible, to the extent that it's pretty much anti-book (as in, the opposite of the book it's based on). As a film, by itself, it's a good fun sci-fi/action flick with likable characters and niffy sattire.

So, yeah. Flame away. But as someone who's seen 7 MCU films, liked 3, and can only call 2 good, the pros that people cite have usually been cons, but I can accept that they're what draw people in.
 

votemarvel

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I don't know at what point Hawki (nice name by the way) that continuity became a bad thing. I'm not talking of course about the obsessive "oh the vase was blue and on the right side of the room but in a later flashback was green and on the left", that's just madness.

Rather I am talking about character progression. Tony Stark is a great example. He wouldn't be who he is in Iron Man 3, your favourite, without the events of the other movies he had been in. Personally I thought Iron Man 3 did enough to fill people in of the events needed to understand what was going on with Tony without overpowering the events of the movie itself.
 

Casual Shinji

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I wouldn't say they do superhero movies better, since Spider-Man 2 and The Incredibles still exist, I think it's as Johnny Novgorod said; They just know how to incorporate an addictive TV formula to their movies. Because most of the Marvel movies aren't even that good. The Avengers, Captain America 2, and Guardians of the Galaxy are the only ones that I'd call genuine good movies, the rest is either mediocre or terrible. Even the ever praised continuity isn't much to write home about. But what they all have is the promise of bigger things to come, and that's what keeps people (the geeks anyway) hooked.
 

Johnny Novgorod

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votemarvel said:
I don't know at what point Hawki (nice name by the way) that continuity became a bad thing. I'm not talking of course about the obsessive "oh the vase was blue and on the right side of the room but in a later flashback was green and on the left", that's just madness.
What he means I think is that in forcing yourself to make "everything connected", you're handicapping your writers (and audience), turning movies into links that rely perhaps a little too much on being part of chains that do the arching for them. There's quite a few movies that wouldn't stand on their own in a world without other better movies to tentpole them (such as Thor 2). Because you liked the other movies and don't want to fall out of the loop, you end up watching everything just in case.
 

Scarim Coral

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Well for one thing, Marvel isn't so serious with their films per say or rather not super serious like DC.

I mean let take Iron Man and Batman, both are super rich to the point they used their money to fight crime. Batman is treated as a vigilante while people adore Iron Man even when Tony reveal himself. While Bruce went throught the training to fight crime (however law and justice is a different matter), Tony pretty much let his tech do the work.


I always find Marvel somewhat light hearted with their theme and tone per say like Guardian of the Galaxy, Ant Man and Captain America (you never really saw Cap in actual WW2 battle like ley say D Day). I mean Star Lord was snatched away from Earth right after seeing his mother passed away. All he does is doing mercanary/ free lance work while dancing away to his retro music! If DC were at the held, they probably would had made him broody in space while trying to find his way home.
 

Something Amyss

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People keep saying "respect for the source material." They're wrong.

It's a lack of fear of the source material.

Other companies don't "disrespect" the source material, they are afraid that comic book movies won't sell because comics are weird funny books for socially stunted people. They try and downplay the things that make comics popular. Marvel gets accused of disrespecting the source material all the time as well. The big difference is that they work with the source material. They're not ashamed that the source material is goofy and campy.
 

shintakie10

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My two cents.

DC stories really don't translate well to live action.

Look at the DC animated movies. They blow everything out of the water. I'll take the DC animated movies over the MCU any day of the week because they have a ton of substance to them unlike a lot of the MCU movies which are just fun popcorn flicks (looking at you Avengers). They're dark and gritty, sure, but they have heart and character to them.

The problem is they can't transfer that look and feel over to live action. Something always just feels off.

Compare that to MCU stuff where everything already was bright and colorful and the cheesy look of live action superhero movies still makes sense.
 

hermes

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Something Amyss said:
People keep saying "respect for the source material." They're wrong.

It's a lack of fear of the source material.

Other companies don't "disrespect" the source material, they are afraid that comic book movies won't sell because comics are weird funny books for socially stunted people. They try and downplay the things that make comics popular. Marvel gets accused of disrespecting the source material all the time as well. The big difference is that they work with the source material. They're not ashamed that the source material is goofy and campy.
That is basically the same thing. Marvel knows the different characters has different vibes, so it works on making the movies more appropriate to each character: Hulk works as a monsters/fugitive movie, Thor works as a classic narrative modernized, Captain America works as a period piece.

The point is, most other companies don't believe in the source material enough to carry the movie, so they try to turn them into merchandise commercials (see Batman & Robin), jumping points to a franchise (see Amazing Spiderman 2), or reinterpret the character for something he is not (see Man of Steel). They don't respect the individual characters enough, so once they found a working formula (like Snyder/Watchmen or Nolan/Batman) they try to apply it as a template to everything...
 

Something Amyss

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hermes200 said:
That is basically the same thing.
And I just explained why it wasn't in that exact post you quoted. That's the exact sort of thing that leads me to the conclusion someone isn't actually reading what I'm writing or looking for a discussion. And you know, fair enough if you're just trying to monologue. If your goal was anything other, well...I don't even know what there is to converse about if you're going to ignore what I write. So either way, I'll see myself out.
 

hermes

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Something Amyss said:
hermes200 said:
That is basically the same thing.
And I just explained why it wasn't in that exact post you quoted. That's the exact sort of thing that leads me to the conclusion someone isn't actually reading what I'm writing or looking for a discussion. And you know, fair enough if you're just trying to monologue. If your goal was anything other, well...I don't even know what there is to converse about if you're going to ignore what I write. So either way, I'll see myself out.
I read your post, I just don't know if there is enough difference to consider disrespect as an invalid explanation. What would you call "being ashamed of the source material" and "downplay the things that make them popular" if it is not disrespecting it?