But I've already got most of my PC games on Steam. I don't want another shitty DRM platform taking up space on my PC just so I can play Mass Effect.Gameguy20100 said:
Why do People love Valve so much?
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I got the physical Disk I don't want some shitty DRM platform taking up space just so I can play Tomb RaiderGenocidicles said:
Reasons why Da Orky Man is somewhat fond of Valve:
- Steam sales makes Orky happy.
- They really are very good at making games.
- Steam as DRM is well done, giving me an infinite number of downloads and allowing me to play offline.
- The way they act towards customers is more informal than other companies, which if done right, Orky rather likes.
- Steam sales makes Orky happy.
- They really are very good at making games.
- Steam as DRM is well done, giving me an infinite number of downloads and allowing me to play offline.
- The way they act towards customers is more informal than other companies, which if done right, Orky rather likes.
Gameguy20100 said:
I'm fully aware of the fact i don't "own" my games as such, but i have no concerns of Valve just taking my games away, because they have never done it before, and i see no reason why they would. Neither am i paranoid that the "big cooperate baddies" are going to suddenly revoke all our licensees for no given reason. Hell, even if you cheat your ass off on TF2 or CS or something, And get yourself a full VAC ban Valve still give you access to your games.
So far, when it comes to adding games that are "nothing to do with valve" it has brought only good things. With the example of Skyrim, you get the workshop which makes modding your game a kabillion times easier.
Captcha : moot point
huehuehue
Da Orky Man said:
I always got the impression people love them not because they are great but because so many other major studios are constantly trying to either gouge money or control what people can or can't do with their games. In some ways it is sad that they are praised for being the least shitty and not being assholes. It is like throwing me a party for not murdering everyone as if it wasn't a preset standard.
that guy looks very familer where have I seen him before? *scratches chin in thought*latiasracer said:Da Orky Man said:
Why people like Valve:
- Steam is a convenient tool to buy, install and play games. I suppose you can technically view it as DRM but unlike EA or Blizzard it works all the time. Plus I seriously doubt that one day Valve will take everybody's games away unless the company goes completely bankrupt.
- Their games are extremely well-made, even if some of their multiplayer games are a less accessible than, say, Call of Duty
- They have a good image. One often gets the impression that Valve executives understand gamers and don't just view them as floating piles of money.
- Steam is a convenient tool to buy, install and play games. I suppose you can technically view it as DRM but unlike EA or Blizzard it works all the time. Plus I seriously doubt that one day Valve will take everybody's games away unless the company goes completely bankrupt.
- Their games are extremely well-made, even if some of their multiplayer games are a less accessible than, say, Call of Duty
- They have a good image. One often gets the impression that Valve executives understand gamers and don't just view them as floating piles of money.
I'd more inclined against Valve if most arguments against them weren't fairly retarded:
- Why do i have to install Steam to play non-valve games?
It's not Valve's decision if other developers/publishers want to use the Steam platform.
- I don't own the games, Valves could take them away at any moment!
The same applies to physical games as well. You don't own the software, you own a license to use it and a disk that contains it. If the developers withdraws your license to play your disc-based game, you're breaking copyright law if you install the game from your disk. If Valve withdraws the rights to play the games i've bought, i'll have no problem breaking the copyright by pirating the game, just as you'll have no problem breaking the copyright by installing the game from the disk anyway.
- Sure, Valve have released some good games before, but not in ages! Valve hardly ever releases games!
Google, use it. Nearly all games released by Valve have fairly large followings at worst, and ridiculous levels of critical acclaim at best.
- Steam is DRM!
Game developers have the right to protect their games with DRM. The problems for us consumers arise when the DRM becomes intrusive. Once you're used to Steam being on your system, it's utterly, utterly unobtrusive.
Then there's all the arguments about steam loading up on start-up, or advertisements all over the place, or always-online. There are options in Steam for all of these things.
Steam has it's issues, but as a company Valve are extremely customer friendly, and in a world of EA, Activision and Ubisoft, a lot of gamers will support the publishers/developers that don't seem like they're just out to remove our cash from our wallets through whatever means necessary. They come across as a games company that is involved in the business both because they want to make money and because they like video games, compared to companies like EA, which are essentially run by shareholders only involved in the industry for the former reason.
Add all this to a generally strong library of games and a constant stream of great sales and you've got yourself a fairly popular video games company.
- Why do i have to install Steam to play non-valve games?
It's not Valve's decision if other developers/publishers want to use the Steam platform.
- I don't own the games, Valves could take them away at any moment!
The same applies to physical games as well. You don't own the software, you own a license to use it and a disk that contains it. If the developers withdraws your license to play your disc-based game, you're breaking copyright law if you install the game from your disk. If Valve withdraws the rights to play the games i've bought, i'll have no problem breaking the copyright by pirating the game, just as you'll have no problem breaking the copyright by installing the game from the disk anyway.
- Sure, Valve have released some good games before, but not in ages! Valve hardly ever releases games!
Google, use it. Nearly all games released by Valve have fairly large followings at worst, and ridiculous levels of critical acclaim at best.
- Steam is DRM!
Game developers have the right to protect their games with DRM. The problems for us consumers arise when the DRM becomes intrusive. Once you're used to Steam being on your system, it's utterly, utterly unobtrusive.
Then there's all the arguments about steam loading up on start-up, or advertisements all over the place, or always-online. There are options in Steam for all of these things.
Steam has it's issues, but as a company Valve are extremely customer friendly, and in a world of EA, Activision and Ubisoft, a lot of gamers will support the publishers/developers that don't seem like they're just out to remove our cash from our wallets through whatever means necessary. They come across as a games company that is involved in the business both because they want to make money and because they like video games, compared to companies like EA, which are essentially run by shareholders only involved in the industry for the former reason.
Add all this to a generally strong library of games and a constant stream of great sales and you've got yourself a fairly popular video games company.
It's not just about what they do. It's more about how they do it. It's true that Steam can be considered DRM and TF2 transactions are microtransactions. But like I said, it's not about what, it's about how. Their way of doing business is convinient to their customers. It has customers in mind as actual living beings worthy of respect, not just wallets that need to be emptied. That's why people love Valve. It's one of the very few gaming companies that is completely run by actual gamers, instead of suits with a business degree.
Actually here's the wierd thing. First answer this question for yourself, you dont need to post it, just think about it and then give a honest answer: If you had the choice, would you rather have all your games in one location on a digital distribution platform (with all the potential problems that could lead to) or would you prefer just going to the store, buying a box and owning that box and the game until the end of time?
Steam is essentially a necessary evil at this point. Why you may wonder? Well since it becomes increasingly common that games require either steam or some other digital distribution/DRM method, then there is nothing to be done about it other than not buying whatever game requires it. But yet why is steam more popular than the other alternatives?
Simple, the lesser of many evils (we got more than 2 digital distribution platforms). If you are forced to have one of them, and for the sake of the example i shall use 3, Uplay, Origin and Steam. Which would you pick? You have to have one, so you cant say "neither", but you can pick one out of those 3, which would you take? The answer is probably always going to be steam, why? Because here's what Steam offers that effectively sets it apart from the other 2 choices. Origin sells mainly EA games, Uplay sells mainly Ubisoft games. Steam sells a ton of games, from both those companies and many others.
Just for the sake of convinience, Steam wins because you can buy more games over it than any other service currently available. Add to that daily, mid-week and weekend sales, along with summer and christmas sales which basicly reduce either one, several or the giant catalog of games in price up to 75%. Also Steam/Valve has a habit of treating you fairly for the most part, while it is DRM, it at least offers something in return, namely good sales all year and community features.
Of course there are more services available, say for example GOG. But while they do not "include DRM" so to speak, is that service not also a form of DRM? In the end, do they not also verify that you bought the game from them? Granted, they do not use invasive measures for it, no always-online, starforce or somesuch, but when you get down to it, its all DRM. DRM starts already when you get the reciept from buying a boxed copy. It is proof that you legally purchased the game. So in the end, GOG is about the same as Steam, its a distributor that verifies through your purchase that you purchased it, but does nothing beyond that. Since alot of steam games do not require you to even be active in steam, other than register through it, much the same as GOG does, you cant get a game from them without paying them for it first, which is basicly the same thing.
Its why Steam and GOG are popular, its DRM, but its the least annoying one possible. You dont have to jump through several hoops for them and you arent really at risk of suddenly losing access to all your games. There is a risk but its at least minimal.
Steam is essentially a necessary evil at this point. Why you may wonder? Well since it becomes increasingly common that games require either steam or some other digital distribution/DRM method, then there is nothing to be done about it other than not buying whatever game requires it. But yet why is steam more popular than the other alternatives?
Simple, the lesser of many evils (we got more than 2 digital distribution platforms). If you are forced to have one of them, and for the sake of the example i shall use 3, Uplay, Origin and Steam. Which would you pick? You have to have one, so you cant say "neither", but you can pick one out of those 3, which would you take? The answer is probably always going to be steam, why? Because here's what Steam offers that effectively sets it apart from the other 2 choices. Origin sells mainly EA games, Uplay sells mainly Ubisoft games. Steam sells a ton of games, from both those companies and many others.
Just for the sake of convinience, Steam wins because you can buy more games over it than any other service currently available. Add to that daily, mid-week and weekend sales, along with summer and christmas sales which basicly reduce either one, several or the giant catalog of games in price up to 75%. Also Steam/Valve has a habit of treating you fairly for the most part, while it is DRM, it at least offers something in return, namely good sales all year and community features.
Of course there are more services available, say for example GOG. But while they do not "include DRM" so to speak, is that service not also a form of DRM? In the end, do they not also verify that you bought the game from them? Granted, they do not use invasive measures for it, no always-online, starforce or somesuch, but when you get down to it, its all DRM. DRM starts already when you get the reciept from buying a boxed copy. It is proof that you legally purchased the game. So in the end, GOG is about the same as Steam, its a distributor that verifies through your purchase that you purchased it, but does nothing beyond that. Since alot of steam games do not require you to even be active in steam, other than register through it, much the same as GOG does, you cant get a game from them without paying them for it first, which is basicly the same thing.
Its why Steam and GOG are popular, its DRM, but its the least annoying one possible. You dont have to jump through several hoops for them and you arent really at risk of suddenly losing access to all your games. There is a risk but its at least minimal.
They're mellow.
That's all I can really say about Valve. They make nice games and don't come across as giant dicks, salivating at the prospect of fingering money out of your wallet.
That's all I can really say about Valve. They make nice games and don't come across as giant dicks, salivating at the prospect of fingering money out of your wallet.
Unless of course your in Australia, where in which they still charge 80-100 dollars for a video game, even though the Aussie dollar has been above or equal to the American dollar for quite a while. Or how they have yet to even show any signs of going back to the classification board so as that Australians can play Left 4 Dead 2 with full gore (the R18+ rating was passed in February I believe).MarsAtlas said:
So yeah, I don't hate or love Valve, they're just a company that supplies some services/games that I enjoy using. Personally I prefer EA over Valve, but that's just because I enjoy most of their products more so than Valve. Basically I'm saying Valve is an okay company in my eyes, that's my opinion, you're welcome to agree or disagree if you all want to.
How did I know it was you.
Steam doesn't try to install spyware on your computer. Steam has sales in accordance with the prices made possible by digital distribution, unlike some others. Valve's most prominent games, Half Life and Portal, are both original, thought-out, humourous games. Valve also has excellent customer loyalty from their attitude and treatment of players, and have extolled opinions that resonate with the people who hate EA's business practises.
As far as demonising other companies, services, whatever - Steam is DRM in the same way Origin is, except it doesn't do things to your computer you would rather it didn't, Valve has great customer support, and the savings are massive. Microtransactions in TF2 are either hats, which are irrelevant, or weapons which can be acquired normally but regardless are generally balanced. The one thing I don't like in that general area is the crate/key system, but that's about the only thing, which is more tha can be said for plenty of OH I DON'T KNOW SAY EA's games.
Basically Valve treats its customers right and makes its games well. There's nothing irrational about liking Valve.
Steam doesn't try to install spyware on your computer. Steam has sales in accordance with the prices made possible by digital distribution, unlike some others. Valve's most prominent games, Half Life and Portal, are both original, thought-out, humourous games. Valve also has excellent customer loyalty from their attitude and treatment of players, and have extolled opinions that resonate with the people who hate EA's business practises.
As far as demonising other companies, services, whatever - Steam is DRM in the same way Origin is, except it doesn't do things to your computer you would rather it didn't, Valve has great customer support, and the savings are massive. Microtransactions in TF2 are either hats, which are irrelevant, or weapons which can be acquired normally but regardless are generally balanced. The one thing I don't like in that general area is the crate/key system, but that's about the only thing, which is more tha can be said for plenty of OH I DON'T KNOW SAY EA's games.
Basically Valve treats its customers right and makes its games well. There's nothing irrational about liking Valve.
There you have it. You just don't like Valve's output out of personal preference while a given majority apparently does. There doesn't need to be any elaborate reasoning to support this.Gameguy20100 said:
You're basically asking why people like something you don't like. Honestly, that question answers itself.
As always, look to Sarif Industries' security chief for a more involved and thorough explanation. I didn't ask for this, but thanks a bunch.Adam Jensen said:
I've got some bad news for you: Pretty much every company that sells software takes this same stance, and the law basically agrees with them, whether it's right or not.Gameguy20100 said:
I can pretty much guarantee that according to just about every EULA you've ever agreed to and in the eyes of the law you do not own anything more than a license to use every single piece of software you ever bought. That include your physical copies of games. Which means that companies can (and have) shut down services or cut off your access to portions of, or even entire games you bought whether you bought a physical copy or a digital one.
Now if we add this to your other complaints in the OP which were either factually wrong (they haven't released a game in years) or silly (they're selling people game items they want that don't force people to buy them to play the actual game), you don't seem to have much of an actual argument.
Pretty much this, Gamerguy. Even if you buy your games in retail format, you will never factually own them. Even if you skip the PC market for consoles, you'll never actually own the games you'll buy, no matter which console manufacturer you choose to support.Vivi22 said:
If your primary beef is ownership issues; I'm sorry to tell you this but - welcome to 2013. Everything is a commodity, everything is a service that's being graciously extended our way by the content providers, and whatever segment of code you might have that happens to run entirely off-line *still* doesn't belong to you as per copyright law.
The books you buy? Not yours. The MP3s you legally snagged off iTunes? Not yours, either. Your operating system? Unless you're running on Linux or one of its distros, you can be damn sure you don't own your OS.
Considering that, you're better off sticking to one of the lesser evils. That happens to be Valve.
That made me chuckleIamLEAM1983 said:
"distro" is short for a "distribution" which in this case are just different variations. And all of them are Linux. Compared to Windows, Linux distros are sort of analogue to different kinds of Windows - Vista/7/8 or Home Premium/Professional and so on. These are all Windows, it's not "Windows or one of the variations".