Why does everybody hate Superman?

[theguru]

I realize that as a newly active forum-goer here that the fact that most of my post so far are on the topic of Superman might make me seem a bit obsessed, but its something that's been on my mind recently.

A lot of people seem to see him as over-powered or invincible, but the grand majority of his enemies are at least as strong as him, one way or another, and with as many weaknesses as he has Ive honestly read more books of his where he is beaten and close to death than most Batman books have. As a modern comic book reader, its just a problem I've honestly never encountered (when done well, of course, but any character can fall into that)

Plenty of others say he's too "perfect" and "un-relatable," but the simple lack of major, glaring flaws doesn't equal perfection, and in all honestly the idea of a nice, kind person trying to find an outlet for their benevolent persona in an increasingly cynical and paranoid world that's "out-grown childish idealism" is infinitely more relatable than characters like Daredevil or Batman.

So is this really just a case of hating characters they don't really understand or is there something I'm missing?

(Also, sorry if my post's - in this thread or beyond - seem meek or uncomfortable, I'm not really used to this place yet and am still trying to get comfortable.)

 

[Casual Shinji]

To me he just completely lacks character.

In a way so does Batman, but Batman has the advantage of having such a rich library of interesting and charismatic super villains to play off of.

Superman doesn't. At least, not to my knowledge.

 

[scorptatious]

Is Superman really that hated? I was always sort of neutral towards him.

 

[Terminate421]

Because he adopted a 30 year old man

(I don't really hate him)

 

[Rylot]

He hasn't had the kinds of games and movies that Batman (at least not recently). I don't really read comics very much, and certainly not Batman or Superman so the other forms of media is all I have to go off of.

 

[Hazy992]

I don't hate him, I just don't like him all that much. He's a boring character

 

[Casual Shinji]

To me he just completely lacks character.

In a way so does Batman, but Batman has the advantage of having such a rich library of interesting and charismatic super villains to play off of.

Superman doesn't. At least, not to my knowledge.

Well, then you have zero expirience with this character.

Superman has at least as much character as Batman since they were both fucking long around. Superman has also a long library of enemies: Bizarro, Darkseid, Brainiac, Doomsday and Lex Luthor just to name a few.

Also: Through better games and movies (or more memorable movies) Batman is much deeper anchored in the popular media. Because of that people think Superman lacks character or any kind of interesting stories. Superman doesn't win his adventures only through his powers. He fights beings stronger than him on a regular basis. Those guys he beats through skill (he is friggin good at what he does) and intelligence (he is not a drooling idiot).

For me? I am not so much a Superman fan but the Flash. And Marvel!

I'm sure I don't.

But then I haven't seen any media depicting him otherwise. I'm not a big Marvel/DC reader, so most of what I experience Superman wise is though movies and TV. And in that regard there's just something that Batman has which Superman doesn't.

 

[Ranorak]

1) He's boringly overpowered to the point that any suspense in the story has to come from either the "rare" kryptonite, magic, or some other weird exception.
Batman can still be knocked-out by me.
Spider-man can still be shot by me.

2) He's boringly good.

3) The reason batman never kills the joker is because, in the end, Batman is just as nuts as his villains, just no-kill-policy
But what stupid reason would Superman have to not lock up Lex for ever?

 

[Dragonclaw]

We have this conversation in the store all the time...

A hero is only as good as his rogues gallery. Deep villains help make deep heroes, so Batman and Spider-Man have the bar set pretty high as super hero books go. Supes has a few, but he is so over-powered by comparison to most that it doesn't make for a compelling read.


Even in the movies, what was the best Superman movie? Most people say the 2nd...why? ZOD! There was really nothing wrong with the rest of the cast and I've always thought Christopher Reeve was the perfect Superman / Clark Kent, but Terrance Stamp's Zod made the movie.

 

[DrRockor]

He's a dull character I think. He's supposed to be flawless and thats boring. I think the same of batman to be honest. The best thing about batman is the villians. Superman doesnt have that going for him

 

[Sean Hollyman]

Huh, I always thought he was a pretty cool guy

 

[Shock and Awe]

Basically because he is boring. He does everything under the sun and has nothing lacking except a particularly nasty allergy to Kryptonite.

 

[DoPo]

"Why does everybody hate Superman?"

NOT EVERYBODY HATES X IN THIS CASE SUPERMAN. Thank you for the attention. what I hate is the "Why do everybody" threads that go ahead and assume everyone thinks the same way. That drives me up the wall, because most often I don't join up with what everybody apperently does. Which means that it's not everybody. Becuse:

It is the friggin' confirmation bias with a sweeping generalisation thrown at our faces.

People who do this, please stop doing it.

 

[Atmos Duality]

He's the epitome of "boring", as far as superhero characters go, IMO.
The most interesting anything I've seen him in was a war-propaganda cartoon called "11th Hour".

 

[him over there]

"Why does everybody hate Superman?"

NOT EVERYBODY HATES X IN THIS CASE SUPERMAN. Thank you for the attention. what I hate is the "Why do everybody" threads that go ahead and assume everyone thinks the same way. That drives me up the wall, because most often I don't join up with what everybody apperently does. Which means that it's not everybody. Becuse:

It is the friggin' confirmation bias with a sweeping generalisation thrown at our faces.

People who do this, please stop doing it.

Oh god forbid somebody use a colloquial phrase to describe the prevailing opinion of a certain community, especially when they question it showing they don't have faith in the face value generalization in the first place.

 

[theguru]

I think the problem here is people might be looking at him the wrong way. He's not supposed to be relate-able, not in the general sense (though on a thematic level, I can honestly say that I relate), he's someone you look up to. He's intended to be a paragon, more than anything, not just another hero. The crux of his stories, at least the really good ones (Birthright, Lex Luthor: Man of Steel, Whats so Funny About Truth Justice and the American Way), isn't really about him AS A CHARACTER, but more how he fits into the world as that type of person, how the world reacts to him, and if its done well, more introspective elements of how he became that person.

To me, that's the best part of Superman. He isn't some obsessed Knight Templar with trust issues and too much disposable income or a angst-ridden teenager with guilt issues and buckets of self-doubt, he really is a well rounded, nice guy who wants to do good things because they're good things to do. He's unique in that way, and the truly great stories are about him trying to maintain that and find an outlet for that genuine kindness in a growingly cynical, paranoid world that has supposedly "outgrown" things like that, which I really can say that I relate to wholeheartedly.

Also, on the over-powered issue, unless were talking Silver-Age here(and really, name me one Silver-Age hero that wasn't like that)... I have just honestly never encountered this in modern stories. Most all of his villains can kill him same as any other heroes, and the ones that cant usually just suck anyway and aren't worth revisiting or are Lex Luthor, and that's in entirely different case.

Though I will say that Superman does have a pretty shitty rogues gallery. Aside from about 5 or 6 really solid villains, there's not a lot to work with. But then again, you get the right talent behind it and that's a pretty simple problem to fix.

(Sorry about the long windedness, I get the feeling I have more to say about this than most of the people here do and I'm kind of replying to everybody.)

 

[DoPo]

"Why does everybody hate Superman?"

NOT EVERYBODY HATES X IN THIS CASE SUPERMAN. Thank you for the attention. what I hate is the "Why do everybody" threads that go ahead and assume everyone thinks the same way. That drives me up the wall, because most often I don't join up with what everybody apperently does. Which means that it's not everybody. Becuse:

It is the friggin' confirmation bias with a sweeping generalisation thrown at our faces.

People who do this, please stop doing it.

Oh god forbid somebody use a colloquial phrase to describe the prevailing opinion of a certain community, especially when they question it showing they don't have faith in the face value generalization in the first place.

Is it the prevailing opinion? Is it, really? Because I have never found that to be the case. Up to this point it has been "I recently saw several guys who liked/disliked what I myself dislike/like". The closest to "prevalent" is something like "anime" where the matter does get a lot love/hate but also a lot of the opposite. "Everybody" is again not appropriate at all.

 

[him over there]

"Why does everybody hate Superman?"

NOT EVERYBODY HATES X IN THIS CASE SUPERMAN. Thank you for the attention. what I hate is the "Why do everybody" threads that go ahead and assume everyone thinks the same way. That drives me up the wall, because most often I don't join up with what everybody apperently does. Which means that it's not everybody. Becuse:

It is the friggin' confirmation bias with a sweeping generalisation thrown at our faces.

People who do this, please stop doing it.

Oh god forbid somebody use a colloquial phrase to describe the prevailing opinion of a certain community, especially when they question it showing they don't have faith in the face value generalization in the first place.

Is it the prevailing opinion? Is it, really? Because I have never found that to be the case. Up to this point it has been "I recently saw several guys who liked/disliked what I myself dislike/like". The closest to "prevalent" is something like "anime" where the matter does get a lot love/hate but also a lot of the opposite. "Everybody" is again not appropriate at all.

Right, it isn't the prevailing opinion, though OP obviously sees that it is and is challenging that. The thread title is a bit of harmless hyperbole built around colloquialism.

OT: I never really liked super man, not because of anything like relatability but I just felt he wasn't very exciting. I think it's a lot like Dragon Ball Z where even though there are all these powerful people it essentially comes down to Goku to beat the big bad guy. With superman it's even worse though, because he's so powerful that his enemies have to match him. This means that Superman is the single exclusive person capable of saving the day.

 

[Savagezion]

To me he just completely lacks character.

In a way so does Batman, but Batman has the advantage of having such a rich library of interesting and charismatic super villains to play off of.

Superman doesn't. At least, not to my knowledge.

I ain't harping on you here but... these are two excellent source materials to work with.

I hate when people say the only thing interesting about Batman is the bad guys. Claiming that is a bit shortsighted, like claiming CoD is only popular because of regenerating health. It's fine if the villains are your favorite part but Batman isn't shown up by them by any means. Bruce Wayne is a great character study. He is every bit as twisted as his villains. He breaks the law - in the name of justice, he pretends to be Bruce Wayne - not Batman, he will use any means necessary to bring someone to justice - except a gun. The dude is not boring and his villains bring nothing to the table he doesn't already. The dude is possessed by his own legend and embodies revenge the same way joker embodies psychopath or scarecrow embodies fearmonger. This doesn't even touch on the compound character of Gotham City.

Superman is the same way but is usually written poorly. It took them to the year 2000 before exploring the fact that he doesn't like he fits in on our world. He isn't part of it and he is reminded of that fact every day. He feels responsible for us yet doesn't feel as though he belongs. Resentment would surface towards Earthlings, his parents, and just his overall situation. Even his boy scout good deed attitude is a great thing to use as a character study because it is so slanted. "Well, Superman, what is the right choice in a case of Euthenaisa?" Don't use the comic to push a political ideology (which often happens) save that shit for Captain America. Use the comic to try and explore the character and what is right and wrong in a morally grey situation. Have some choices that Superman has to make where he doesn't know what if his decision is right but have him stand by his decision because that is what he would do. However, throw conflict at him and then have him come out with a bad ass speech about the topic that really explores not only why he stands by his decision but why he understands the opposing viewpoint.
They screw up every time they use the mindset "If Superman would do it, it is clearly the right thing to do." That totally robs the character of depth and insight and comes off shallow. Superman is another great character study opportunity, the material isn't flawed. The writers are. His powers are so irrelevant but that is what everyone focuses on. His internal struggle is insanely rich in material but very rarely tapped into.

 

[Kae]

I think the problem is that he's not used well as often as other heroes, specially in non-comic media like games and movies, so therefore he seems lacking because in comparison to other characters his material is lacking, I personally am very neutral about him, but I'm fairly sure that writing an excellent story about him isn't impossible, again Batman can come across as a really boring character too, but he's hit the jackpot recently and has gotten the right material recently, let's just hope that Superman's next movie is awesome.