why hating on kony 2012 is inherently wrong

[Pebkio]

My favorite parts are when he didn't punctuate properly, didn't capitalize, and generally didn't follow any proper grammatical structures.

...and destroyed it to such a degree he got high on drugs and ran round the street naked...

Yeah... no. You can give all the reasons in the world ever as to why HIM using drugs and running naked is not HIS fault. But guess what: It's his damned fault for taking drugs and running around naked. So, just because we're disagreeing with you doesn't give you clear and free rights to get high, okay?

if you hated in invisible children you should be fucking ashamed of yourself

Have you read their income statements? Whatever happened in 2010 turned them into corrupt money-collectors. I didn't know that until Kony 2012 was uploaded. Them posting a video about a problem that the personally helped solve back in 2009 generated hate for the corruption they now represent.

On a personal note, you probably had no idea about this group until you saw that video. Acting all high and mighty for something you didn't support back when it was a good program doesn't make you very classy.

 

[For.I.Am.Mad]

I'm not ashamed of myself at all, and I don't think I ever will be.

 

[DarkRyter]

I'll tell you how you can tell if something is right or wrong. It's that little sense of horror in the back of your mind. Ever felt it? It's your conscience.

Jesus Christ, moral relativity is the most retarded thing Humanity ever came up with, and that includes the vuvuzela.

If anything, relativism is the most logical conclusion. It is the acceptance that the concept of "morality" exists only within individual perspectives and has no connection to any sort of empirical truth.

My conscience can say whatever it pleases and I may listen to it however I please. But what makes my conscience valid? Why are emotional impulses correct?

Right and Wrong does exist. Morality is not subjective. People often assume that morality cannot exist as an inherent value because of all the cultural impacts its definition has come to absorb.

But 2 + 2 still equals 4. Just because some people think its ten doesn't make 2 + 2 a subjective math problem.

That's the problem, though. 2 and 4 exist. There is logical equivalence between "2+2" and "4".

There is no logical connection between "corrupt charity" and "bad", nor is there any logical connection between "corrupt charity" and "good".

 

[SacremPyrobolum]

While I do not agree with Invisible Children, I do think that their plan was pretty clever.

Instead of asking people to give them money (they said you could in the video but that is no the crux of it)they just asked to make people aware of him, making on opportunity for people who do not trust charities to contribute.

This way, some people might be compelled to call their Congressman and ask him to bring it up in Congress, because while Congressmen don't care about people, they care about their office.

So no money was spent and something has a real possibility of happening.

Not saying that this pertains to Kony, I just like the idea.

 

[omicron1]

What's inherently wrong is producing Kony merchandise - T-shirts, baubles, watches, etc.

Why?

Everyone knows Kony capitalism is evil.

 

[sean360h]

Have you actually researched invisible children? They give money to militias who rape and loot, are 6 years late, only give away a portion of the money they get. Plus, it actually engrages ugandans. It would be the same if someone in Europe started making "Osama 2002" right after twin towers, distributing bracelets with his name on it. America would lose their shit.

I hate Kony, i'm not like those people who call everyone moralfags when they post about him, but invisible children are practically the worst charity to give to for this.

You good sir explained exactly why i am not going to support Kony 2012 or any of that shit

 

[Suicidejim]

dont bother commenting trying to excuse your behavior or explain to me why destroying this guys life was the correct thing to do because it wasnt and under no circumstance would destroying this guys life be acceptable when all he was trying to do was bring an evil person to justice and you destroyed him for it

Then why make a thread? I didn't support the Kony 2012 campaign because there seemed to be sufficient evidence to suggest that proceeds would have gone towards military operations, and given the uncertain nature of whether more conflict would improve the problem or cause it to become much worse, I was reluctant to hand over my money to fund what amounted to war.

From what I could see, many of the people who 'hated' on Kony (aside from the percentage that did it purely to make a statement about not being on bandwagons, which I agree is certainly shallow) were simply doing so to raise awareness of the issues within the charity. People were giving their support to Invisible Children without full knowledge of where their money might go, and the various political and economic issues that allowed Kony to gain so much support in the first place. This is information people need to consider before handing over money.

The motivation was undoubtedly just, but the methods weren't something I, or many people, were comfortable with.

 

[omicron1]

dont bother commenting trying to excuse your behavior or explain to me why destroying this guys life was the correct thing to do because it wasnt and under no circumstance would destroying this guys life be acceptable when all he was trying to do was bring an evil person to justice and you destroyed him for it

Then why make a thread? I didn't support the Kony 2012 campaign because there seemed to be sufficient evidence to suggest that proceeds would have gone towards military operations, and given the uncertain nature of whether more conflict would improve the problem or cause it to become much worse, I was reluctant to hand over my money to fund what amounted to war.

From what I could see, many of the people who 'hated' on Kony (aside from the percentage that did it purely to make a statement about not being on bandwagons, which I agree is certainly shallow) were simply doing so to raise awareness of the issues within the charity. People were giving their support to Invisible Children without full knowledge of where their money might go, and the various political and economic issues that allowed Kony to gain so much support in the first place. This is information people need to consider before handing over money.

The motivation was undoubtedly just, but the methods weren't something I, or many people, were comfortable with.

Honestly? There are two ways to take care of people like Kony.
One is war.
The other is assassination.
Choose your poison.

 

[Badassassin]

There are still half a million people left homeless in haiti because of the earthquake. But it's okay, it's not trendy to care about them anymore. Hell, right now in Syria people are being killed for protesting, but who cares about them, they don't have a bracelet I can wear.


And how bout this: about only 30% of the income went to helping stop Kony, the rest went to Russell and film equipment, so this guy doesn't deserve any praise. All he did was take advantage of teenagers to be aware of something that PEOPLE ALREADY KNEW ABOUT. The real tragedy is that up until this point, nobody cared. Apparently, someone asked Obama a question about Kony at one of the primary debates in 2008, but NO ONE CARED.

 

[Headdrivehardscrew]

Well, I think Jason Russell is a rather odd fellow.

Joseph Kony's LRA is but one of at least half a dozen armed groups wreaking havoc in that region... there's plenty more going on. It's all a bit more complicated, really. Getting rid of Kony, while not easy all by itself, would, if successful, only really make room for another random homicidal maniac despot leader. Watching "Machine Gun Preacher" felt quite spot-on (for a condensed plot in a two-hour flick), watching "Kony 2012" makes me cringe... it's OK if it makes people 'aware' of Kony, but it completely blends out that even the Ugandan Army isn't really on terms with proper conduct. Also, the party feeling of the congregations and the whole stench of pure ignorance and misjudged self-importance makes it a rather huge, bitter pill to swallow.

It's also way too personal to not put him in the spotlight. He chose to do that, and it seems he wasn't really prepared very well.

I think Russell basically pulled an Al Gore stunt, but unlike Gore, he's not quite ready for the attention, the criticism and scrutiny of both ye Trolls and more informed people. I think it's better for him to go play naked ape man down in the streets than to hurt himself or his wife or his kids, but I really don't see this story ending well, because I don't think we're through making sense of him. We have hundreds of hours of sad movie material, blood and guts from all over Africa, we've got plenty of people over there trying to help and getting eaten up by the multitude of sub-optimal situations; seeing Jason Russell getting emotional and making promises reminds of a number of folks that didn't make it, that didn't change the world, that didn't even make it to the headlines. With his soft-spoken idiocy, he also reminds me of Tim Treadwell.

The moment he brought in Gavin, his little son, he sure made me think, but not the way he meant to. I think what he's doing is stupid, dangerous and wrong.

If it turns out Invisible Children burns through the money even though we are to believe they are non-profit, this thing will not burn, it will explode.

 

[weker]

Okay as I have seen this topic more then enough I will try write down my "rough" points on each topic, you can inquire more deeply if you wish with a reply XD

Kony hasn't been active since 2006 in Uganda. Kony really has been pushed back into the jungle, and more or less only does the occasional terrorist like attack, meaning bigger threats are around.

IC helps the Ugandan army who aren't good either.

IC give about 30% to help the effort the rest goes into their wallets, to call this a charity is too far a stretch. If your looking for a charity go with War Child.

Kony is kinda famous already. Kony is one of the most wanted men in the world on more then a couple of lists, not to mention Obama has sent in a force of around 100 men in October to hunt him down.

Kony 2012 is famous not Kony, tho that's more debatable.

Kony 2012 is pure propaganda, again debatable.

People just want a sense of being a hero when what their actually doing is so pathetically lacking, that I find it disgusting they think what their doing is good, when there is so much more they can do. It's as lazy as you can be when it comes to helping others.

This whole thing will only result in money going towards IC and the money they do give to help is questionable where it will be going. IC money is visible, however it is what they have shown. They still won't allow government organisations to investigate their company, which suggests to me they might have something going on.

Oh more I forgot.

Kony isn't the only bad person there, if he goes someone will replace him, not to mention their are other smaller groups that would replace LRA if it's removed.

 

[The Metalist]

dont bother commenting trying to excuse your behavior or explain to me why destroying this guys life was the correct thing to do because it wasnt and under no circumstance would destroying this guys life be acceptable when all he was trying to do was bring an evil person to justice and you destroyed him for it

Then why make a thread? I didn't support the Kony 2012 campaign because there seemed to be sufficient evidence to suggest that proceeds would have gone towards military operations, and given the uncertain nature of whether more conflict would improve the problem or cause it to become much worse, I was reluctant to hand over my money to fund what amounted to war.

From what I could see, many of the people who 'hated' on Kony (aside from the percentage that did it purely to make a statement about not being on bandwagons, which I agree is certainly shallow) were simply doing so to raise awareness of the issues within the charity. People were giving their support to Invisible Children without full knowledge of where their money might go, and the various political and economic issues that allowed Kony to gain so much support in the first place. This is information people need to consider before handing over money.

The motivation was undoubtedly just, but the methods weren't something I, or many people, were comfortable with.

Honestly? There are two ways to take care of people like Kony.
One is war.
The other is assassination.
Choose your poison.

You know, its that very statement that makes this whole issue nonsensical. The public, along with I.C, wanted to send soldiers to wage war against a man who uses children for soldiers. It didn't seem to click that this meant that you would have fully trained, armed to the teeth soldiers killing potentially hundreds of children, just to kill one of the many African warlords. I noticed that was ommited from their video as well.

I agree that attacking someone personally over the internet isnt productive, but the "charity" as a whole deserves what it gets in my opinion.

What bothers me is what IC wants is a war, claiming its the right thing to do. Yet there is no right side in war.

 

[DarkRyter]

Well, wrong and right don't really exist.

What? Are you being serious? Someone actually believes this?

I'm just sayin that morality is based entirely in perspective. There is no logical connection between any stance/action/person/etc and "good"/"bad", because "good"/"bad" are entirely conceptual.

 

[DarkRyter]

I'm just sayin that morality is based entirely in perspective. There is no logical connection between any stance/action/person/etc and "good"/"bad", because "good"/"bad" are entirely conceptual.

That's a complete non-sequitur. The fact that it is entirely conceptual has no bearing on whether it exists or not.
Data is entirely conceptual, yet I don't think anyone would say that data does not exist.
Language is also entirely conceptual, but are you going to argue that language does not exist either?

"Conceptual"'s an inappropriate word for what I mean to get across.

I mean to say that, Morality is an idea that is too steeped in individual perspective to have any bearing on objective reality.

 

[Yopaz]

Hating on Kony is nothing more than hating on people thinking they change the world by liking and sharing Facebook comments. You can say all you want that you are making a difference, that you're fighting for a change, in truth you aren't doing anything. We hate on it because people are doing nothing and yet say they're making a difference. You aren't saving the world by using Facebook any more than I am saving the world by saving Peach from Bowser.

 

[SacremPyrobolum]

So no money was spent and something has a real possibility of happening.

Uhm, they spent over four million US dollars in 2011 paying themselves fat paychecks and making fancy irrelevant advertising, programming spambots and what not.

True, but the point of the movement was not to donate money but to instead raise awareness. Some people just also chose to donate money.

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

okay the reason why is that the internet had opportunity to do something good, yes maybe it wasn't something great and better things could be done but we had opportunity to do something really good by bringing some one who killed hundreds of people, made hundreds of children into drug slaves and destroyed thousands of lives to justice

but instead everyone jumped on a huge hater band wagon mostly for small, petty, illegitimate reasons or even down right lies, its true that there are some legitimate reasons to disagree with invisible children but only 1% of hater's ive seen use them and these people couldn't disagree quietly no they went about trying to destroy all of invisible children's support with the same energy and determination were if the same energy and determination were used to support kony 2012 this guy would probably have been bought to justice by now but instead they destroyed the life work of a guy who was trying to do something good and could have succeeded, and destroyed it to such a degree he got high on drugs and ran round the street naked and now people are dancing on his corpse, i hope your happy haters you win congratulations i hope your really proud of yourself and the worst part is that all this grew from an opportunity to do something good.

dont bother commenting trying to excuse your behavior or explain to me why destroying this guys life was the correct thing to do because it wasnt and under no circumstance would destroying this guys life be acceptable when all he was trying to do was bring an evil person to justice and you destroyed him for it

if you hated in invisible children you should be fucking ashamed of yourself

I think you should....

Spoiler: take a look at this

 

[AnarchistFish]

This is some of the most warped reasoning I think I've ever seen on this site.

Not even gonna bother.

Oh well, back to Mass Effect 3 and trying as hard as possible to avoid all the spoilers flying around the place.

 

[Aris Khandr]

Jesus Christ, moral relativity is the most retarded thing Humanity ever came up with, and that includes the vuvuzela.

Dude, vuvuzelas are awesome. If for no other reason than to laugh while people complain about them.

 

[nuba km]

Brooker wins again.

this is damn hilarious what tv show is this from?

10 o'clock live, it is on at 10 o'clock and its live on channel 4 on Wednesdays.

OT: I can't be bothered to get involved with this argument I just wanted to raise awareness of a good tv show.