Wii U too late to capture the Hardcore crowd?

[Casual Shinji]

And playing a game while having to focus on two very distinct screens sounds like a nightmare.

You sound like the kind of person who whines about subtitles in films taking up all of your attention. If used right, the touch-screen on the Wii-U controller won't be an entirely seperate screen, it'll be used for stuff that would otherwise take up space on the main screen. Such examples are the inventory screen in that Zelda thing it's shown with, and stuff like that.

So hopefully you won't need to look down at the screen all the time, just when you need to.

So you're saying the touchscreen will be useful if used for accessing those parts of the game which could previously already accessed by simply pushing a button? What an improvement that will be!

As for the subtitles thing. I'm perfectly fine with them, you know why? Because it's all on the same screen, not a seperate screen that you're holding in your hands. The Nintendo DS also had two screens, but they were formed together like a booklet. The Wii U has you focussing your attention on two screens seperated by atleast 5 feet.

 

[ReservoirAngel]

And playing a game while having to focus on two very distinct screens sounds like a nightmare.

You sound like the kind of person who whines about subtitles in films taking up all of your attention. If used right, the touch-screen on the Wii-U controller won't be an entirely seperate screen, it'll be used for stuff that would otherwise take up space on the main screen. Such examples are the inventory screen in that Zelda thing it's shown with, and stuff like that.

So hopefully you won't need to look down at the screen all the time, just when you need to.

So you're saying the touchscreen will be useful if used for accessing those parts of the game which could previously already accessed by simply pushing a button? What an improvement that will be!

It is an improvement considering that the inventory screens/maps/etc will no doubt have touch screen functionality.

So instead of pausing the game to scroll through menus, it's a quick glance down and a few presses on a screen. Seems like a pretty decent improvement to me. Sure it's not a massive change, but it's the little things that push gaming forwards.

 

[Akihiko]

Well, it's too late for me, that's for sure. What makes me buy a console is the exclusives, and I haven't seen any, other than possibly Ninja Gaiden 3(Wii U is getting a different game) and nintendo franchises(Which I haven't cared about for years now). I still question whether it will be more powerful than a 360/PS3. People are coming out with all these possible specs that are better than the ps3/360, however you have to take into account the Wii U will be powering 2 screens atleast, 3 more if you have friends over. To top it off, I've seen sites here put the console up for £400, I know it probably isn't the official price(As if it was, no ones going to buy it...), but yikes.

 

[captain_Bubblebum]

....I know the iPad is popular, but don't try to merge a touchscreen that size with a traditional controller. Because it's not going to be a relaxed gaming experience when I'm holding something the size of a microwave diner.

And playing a game while having to focus on two very distinct screens sounds like a nightmare.

Nintendo want to open their console up to the functionality available in their DS line-up.

They also have a drawing tablet peripheral for the Wii already, which may have been a stepping stone towards this controller/console design.

I agree with you on your point about not wishing to be brain raped by the requirement of focusing on 2 totally different screens, but developers will never implement it in such a way that you must pay attention to them both at all times. Gameplay testing exists to remove such a shit design anyway.

One of the ways (as it appears to be set up) is to use it as an inventory screen, which is pretty kool. Death to Menus!

It's an extra outlet for developers to get their hands on, and say for instance, in driving games, you could see the rear view mirror on the controller or the race track, or your car's current condition (as opposed to taking up screen estate). Or in a flying shooter, if you shot a heat seeking missile at another aircraft, the controller could display the view of the rocket as it tears through the sky and into your enemy.


If anything, what Nintendo has done is produced some very interesting hardware (let's all just hope that shovelware will fuck off long enough for a good, wide catalogue of games to be available on store shelves).

 

[Casual Shinji]

It is an improvement considering that the inventory screens/maps/etc will no doubt have touch screen functionality.

So instead of pausing the game to scroll through menus, it's a quick glance down and a few presses on a screen. Seems like a pretty decent improvement to me. Sure it's not a massive change, but it's the little things that push gaming forwards.

If this makes me a whiner, so be it, but that seems like a lot of hassle for a simple hotkey function. Especially if it means I have to hold a big square plastic slab in my hands to do it.

It's like this is becoming a new trend in gaming. Just throw together all of the popular game gizmo's and control gimmicks into one system. Then everyone's bound to wanna have it.

This is why I have just as little faith in the PSVita.

 

[Buizel91]

It's never to late to capture the attention of a new audience, if people like the look of it, nothing is stopping them from getting it, considering most gamers have 1 or 2 (maybe more) consoles anyway.

Plus...Pokemon on the WiiU...

Think about it.

 

[ChromeAlchemist]

I think they're developing it, but what can they really do besides "look, it's more powerful!"? If that didn't work this time, will it work and make them profit earlier on next time? I think the DVD and CD really helped them before, but Blu-Ray not so much.

I think Sony and Microsoft are in the same boat regarding this.

Most of the games of the current generation already have enormously bloated budgets that have a hard time in making their money back. If Sony's and Microsoft's next system is just going to be "more powerful", how the hell are those game budgets going to sustain themselves?

They can't. Thread time, I reckon.

 

[Pingieking]

Nintendo captured third parties, and that's what mattered.

This remains to be seen. Can the Wii U maintain a decent attachment rate to make it worth developing for? We won't know definitively until at least 2013.
I agree with the hardcore crowd statement.

I say that because Sony was reportedly in the red for so, so long, and the video games division wasn't the only part of their company doing badly.

I get that the idea of a console successor is like thinking of the sun rising, there's no point because you know it's coming, but if your company is in dire straits (not to say it truly is, but PS3 just making profit, PSN, PSP didn't sell so well, PSVita needs to be catered to right now, etc.) you're not going to want to bring out a new console any time soon.

I think they're developing it, but what can they really do besides "look, it's more powerful!"? If that didn't work this time, will it work and make them profit earlier on next time? I think the DVD and CD really helped them before, but Blu-Ray not so much.

It depends almost completely on the timing of MS. If Sony doesn't push out a next gen system within 12 months of MS, then the Playstation brand will be staring at its death. The PS3 came out a year later than X360, and we saw the difficulties it had trying to carve out its own user base. If Sony tried to repeat that with Nintendo several years ahead of both them and now in direct competition, they will get slaughtered.

Currently PS3 sales are climbing, even with the huge PSN outage sales are still better than last year. The PSP wasn't a success, but it wasn't a failure either. PSVita is slated for late 2011 release, so if they aimed for a late 2014 release for the PS4 that doesn't look unreasonable at all. At most they'll be a year behind MS and two behind Nintendo, and they still give the Vita 3 years to carve out its own space.

As to what the new console will bring? I have no idea. I didn't see BluRay coming, nor did I see Nintendo's moves with Wii and WiiU, and I didn't think that XBL would get so big. So I have no idea what is coming. All I know is that the market will not wait for them to think up something big. Timing is extremely important, and if they don't keep pace with their competitors they'll lose out.

It is an improvement considering that the inventory screens/maps/etc will no doubt have touch screen functionality.

So instead of pausing the game to scroll through menus, it's a quick glance down and a few presses on a screen. Seems like a pretty decent improvement to me. Sure it's not a massive change, but it's the little things that push gaming forwards.

If this makes me a whiner, so be it, but that seems like a lot of hassle for a simple hotkey function. Especially if it means I have to hold a big square plastic slab in my hands to do it.

It's like this is becoming a new trend in gaming. Just throw together all of the popular game gizmo's and control gimmicks into one system. Then everyone's bound to wanna have it.

This is why I have just as little faith in the PSVita.

I agree with this. I love the two sticks on the Vita, but couldn't care less about the touch screens. Mostly the same applies to the WiiU. I think having two screens in very different places might be too busy. Of course, I can't say that with certainty because I've never used it but just judging from my ability to multi-task between a PC and PS3 running at the same time, it might get hectic if the developers aren't careful.

 

[Casual Shinji]

....I know the iPad is popular, but don't try to merge a touchscreen that size with a traditional controller. Because it's not going to be a relaxed gaming experience when I'm holding something the size of a microwave diner.

And playing a game while having to focus on two very distinct screens sounds like a nightmare.

Nintendo want to open their console up to the functionality available in their DS line-up.

They also have a drawing tablet peripheral for the Wii already, which may have been a stepping stone towards this controller/console design.

I agree with you on your point about not wishing to be brain raped by the requirement of focusing on 2 totally different screens, but developers will never implement it in such a way that you must pay attention to them both at all times. Gameplay testing exists to remove such a shit design anyway.

One of the ways (as it appears to be set up) is to use it as an inventory screen, which is pretty kool. Death to Menus!

It's an extra outlet for developers to get their hands on, and say for instance, in driving games, you could see the rear view mirror on the controller or the race track, or your car's current condition (as opposed to taking up screen estate). Or in a flying shooter, if you shot a heat seeking missile at another aircraft, the controller could display the view of the rocket as it tears through the sky and into your enemy.


If anything, what Nintendo has done is produced some very interesting hardware (let's all just hope that shovelware will fuck off long enough for a good, wide catalogue of games to be available on store shelves).

As I said before, if the only example of it's optimal capabilities is replacing something that has never been a problem (menus) with some arbitrary touch funtcion, then that's not really blowing my skirt up.

Sure, it could create some new and interesting gameplay mechanics, but do you really see that happening today's bloated and stale gaming industry? Apart from a few first party titles, no developer is going to do anything innovative with this new touch screen.

And even when ignoring the above, that controller looks like it was designed in a half hour. It's like this was the first draft to give the big wigs an idea of what the controller was more or less going to be like, and then they just forwarded it to R&D without in any way optimizing the design. They basically just took a regular controller and crowbarred a touchscreen in there.

 

[Nomanslander]

If it ever had a chance, that name pretty much killed it...-_-

That's what they said about the wii.
Anyway you could name a console "Shit" and it could possibly still sell well.
And OP forgets Nintendo itself is hardcore.

The question wasn't, will the Wii U pee pee gaa ga..sorry XP

The question wasn't if the Wii Oui, je n'est sais joupou doupou doo doo...fuck!...grrrXO!


One more try.


The question wasn't if it would sell, but whether it would attract the hardcore audience, and in that case, I'd say no chance in fucking hell!

 

[C117]

Meh. I'm gonna get it anyway, if only for the exclusives.

 

[masticina]

What hardcore crowd, seriously the Wii has very little left! I only have it for once in a while great game. That is it!

So a Nintendo console that is coming that has the power equal to an Xbox 360. Seriously is that what Nintendo feels will work?

By then Sony and Microsoft have moved ahead again. Nintendo certainly is not in the same race as Sony and Microsoft. By no means! It is like a horse race.. with one donkey. And the donkey is ridden by a clown!

So Hardcore, forget about it! The new Nintendo Console probably will do fine with quirky titles.. but forget hardcore.

 

[Cridhe]

Honestly the Nintendo franchise has original games that I've always loved. I've never owned a Wii, but combining more adult themed games with a new awesome Nintendo-thing... I'm honestly considering trading in my Xbox when my gold membership runs out.


Addendum: I couldn't give a rats ass if the graphics are better on MS and Sony's next-next gen consoles. A good game is a good game, same goes for gaming devices.

 

[lostlambda]

i think its funny how nintendo think that hardcore means violence their entire line up to showcase the hardcore line for Wii U was nothing but violent shooters and hack and slashes

PS. if they want more hardcore fans release advance wars and fire emblem games

 

[ReservoirAngel]

As I said before, if the only example of it's optimal capabilities is replacing something that has never been a problem (menus) with some arbitrary touch funtcion, then that's not really blowing my skirt up.

The whole point of innovative stuff like this is to replace the things that we're so used to we no longer recognise it as a problem. If nobody bothers to shake stuff up, the gaming industry will just stay the same forever, increasing graphics to photo-realism then just stagnating for eternity.

Sure, it could create some new and interesting gameplay mechanics, but do you really see that happening today's bloated and stale gaming industry? Apart from a few first party titles, no developer is going to do anything innovative with this new touch screen.

I refer to my above point. The fact that innovation doesn't happen in today's big, Triple-A mainstream market is precisely why we need Nintendo to burst in with stuff like this for us to play with. That's how things get moving, and Nintendo have always been good at that.

And even when ignoring the above, that controller looks like it was designed in a half hour. It's like this was the first draft to give the big wigs an idea of what the controller was more or less going to be like, and then they just forwarded it to R&D without in any way optimizing the design. They basically just took a regular controller and crowbarred a touchscreen in there.

I really can only argue shallow points with this one, in that apparently it's comfortable, light and easy to use. But from a strictly aesthetic sense one gets from looking at it, it does look like a design in need of a refining touch applied to it.

 

[captain_Bubblebum]

As I said before, if the only example of it's optimal capabilities is replacing something that has never been a problem (menus) with some arbitrary touch funtcion, then that's not really blowing my skirt up.

Sure, it could create some new and interesting gameplay mechanics, but do you really see that happening today's bloated and stale gaming industry? Apart from a few first party titles, no developer is going to do anything innovative with this new touch screen.


And even when ignoring the above, that controller looks like it was designed in a half hour. It's like this was the first draft to give the big wigs an idea of what the controller was more or less going to be like, and then they just forwarded it to R&D without in any way optimizing the design. They basically just took a regular controller and crowbarred a touchscreen in there.

Hmmmm.....I totally agree - it looks like a piece of shit. But I have faith that it can/will be used by developers to make some cool stuff. Just as with the Wii remote getting used to make headtracking devices on PCs, this new controller will add an extra toy for developers to play with - and that is where my excitement lies. I just hope it doesn't feel awkward to hold (let alone the weight of the thing), as you stated by your concerns previously in other posts.

 

[Casual Shinji]

As I said before, if the only example of it's optimal capabilities is replacing something that has never been a problem (menus) with some arbitrary touch funtcion, then that's not really blowing my skirt up.

The whole point of innovative stuff like this is to replace the things that we're so used to we no longer recognise it as a problem. If nobody bothers to shake stuff up, the gaming industry will just stay the same forever, increasing graphics to photo-realism then just stagnating for eternity.

But it's not in any way innovating how we interact with the menu, it's simply seperating it from the game to a little screen on our controller. That same menu is still there only this time it requires you to split your focus from what's happening on screen to what you're holding in your hands.

And that brings us back to the design flaw of having two distinct screens in a game console. When I'm playing a game my fingers instinctively reach for the right buttons. I can keep my full attention on what's happening on screen. But by putting a second screen on a controller -even if it is only once every five minutes- you're forcing he player to take their eyes off of the main screen, splitting their attention and breaking the on-screen link (immersion, flow, whatever) with the game.

 

[Dexiro]

What matters is the exclusives that the Wii U has and how existing games play out on the Wii U compared to other consoles.

Of course people aren't going to be switching straight to the new console purely to play some multi-platform games, it's the exclusives that will pull people in first and the multi-platform games that will potentially seal the deal.

 

[Wintermoot]

ever since the DS Nintendo stopped marketing to the "Hardcore" crowd and focused on Retrogamers and casual gamers.

 

[ChromeAlchemist]

It depends almost completely on the timing of MS. If Sony doesn't push out a next gen system within 12 months of MS, then the Playstation brand will be staring at its death. The PS3 came out a year later than X360, and we saw the difficulties it had trying to carve out its own user base. If Sony tried to repeat that with Nintendo several years ahead of both them and now in direct competition, they will get slaughtered.

Currently PS3 sales are climbing, even with the huge PSN outage sales are still better than last year. The PSP wasn't a success, but it wasn't a failure either. PSVita is slated for late 2011 release, so if they aimed for a late 2014 release for the PS4 that doesn't look unreasonable at all. At most they'll be a year behind MS and two behind Nintendo, and they still give the Vita 3 years to carve out its own space.

As to what the new console will bring? I have no idea. I didn't see BluRay coming, nor did I see Nintendo's moves with Wii and WiiU, and I didn't think that XBL would get so big. So I have no idea what is coming. All I know is that the market will not wait for them to think up something big. Timing is extremely important, and if they don't keep pace with their competitors they'll lose out.

The year head start isn't what gave them trouble carving out their user base, it was the price. It was the most expensive console this generation, and so many people voiced their desire for the console, but said they would wait for a price drop (including myself) or for certain titles to make an appearance (Final Fantasy XIII which became multi-platform, Killzone 2, Heavy Rain), but of course by the time the price drop came, many people and their friends had a 360, so for a lot of people it wasn't top priority.

Hell, some people are still saying they're going to wait for the FFVII remake, as if it's coming.

This new console 1) can't be the most expensive of the bunch, and 2) can't have a new disc format. Either one of those will put them 6 feet under. Blu-Ray, for all of it's benefits, isn't phasing out the DVD like people expected. in about 5 or 6 years maybe, but not now. Bringing in another format if the console comes out in the time you're predicting just wouldn't work if you ask me.

It's all dependent on what move Microsoft makes. As for the Wii U, I consider it to be a bridge. For all we know, by 2016 we might have another console from them, a la Xbox.