Will Macs ever be a force in gaming?

[IamLEAM1983]

I doubt Macs will eventually equal PCs as gaming platforms. Part of the reason why is that Macs are so utterly based on providing a certain ease of use and a certain "image" that for every Mac user who has some knowledge of how computers generally work, you have idiots who'll claim that their Mac can "literally run anything". Why? Because the Mac culture is one of ignorant elitism.

The moment this changes and Mac users understand that they're using underpowered or shackled hardware stuck in a pretty white plastic shell, then we *might* start to see game-worthy Macs. For now, it feels like every other game that *does* show up with cross-platform installation is some sort of weak attempt to placate an odd market share that wants to game, but wants to do it on a Mac.

Which is something I just don't understand. PCs will get you more for less, and you'll be able to play all the games you want. With PCs and consoles starting to close the gap in terms of price range, Macs really do feel like the odd man out.

What you're really paying for is the Apple logo and the odd, preconceived notion that you need something with Allan Turing's apple on it to be able to work with multimedia stuff.

Seriously. Why is it that my two friends who work in graphic design have PCs at home but are saddled with Macs that their employer purchased blindly?

 

[steelbom]

My point is the 7970M will no doubt cost bucketloads so it will remain a niche option and thus won't entice developers to make games for the few hundred who can actually play them at good settings.

They need to make a Mac that uses all desktop parts that doesn't fall under the mac pro line (which still uses a 5770 LOOOOOOL) so it's more affordable.

The $1999 model should include the 7970M and the other models should still have good 7000M series graphics such as the 7850M and 7870M.

It's not just that though, we've already had a couple of generations of Macs capable of playing games at a decent frame rate, and as the GPUs continue to improve developers will be more and more interested in developing for the Mac as well.

The iMac is their consumer desktop line so I'm not sure we'll ever see them create a consumer desktop tower. The Mac Pro hasn't been updated in two years, and it may be discontinued this year.

Developers for the superficial "graphics are everything!!!11" crowd, maybe. It's not just about that. Also, the expense is definitely a barrier, considering super graphics upgrades are a lot cheaper than buying a new mac.

There's a lot of people buying Macs already -- about 6 million a quarter. The question is are there enough Macs to make money off their games? Considering the Mac App Store comes installed (and on the dock) in OS X Lion, the current shipping OS, it's a prominent place to make money.

 

[tthor]

Just wondering what peoples opinions on this is.

The App store seems to be a hotbed of activity for indie developers, and I was wondering whether people thought Macs would ever be as good for haming as PCs, because frankly at the moment they suck.

They'd need gaming development to break away from DirectX as the framework for graphically intensive games, and also start selling Macs with customisable hardware at a decent price - which of course will never happen.

If PC gaming is replaced by Mac gaming though and Macs somehow replace Windows computer in the future - I think it could be the worst thing ever.

Unlikely, not impossible.

Apple make consumer products, most gamers are enthusiasts, so there's a problem right there. Also, they aren't even price competitive, and their software isn't mainstream enough, so by the time you spend, 4, 5, 6 grand on a machine that may or may not be the latest greatest stuff, you're then forced to buy Windows, to get an operating system they'll all work on.

And on top of it all, Apple like to think of themselves as snooty, they price things high 'because they can', not 'because they need to make a margin', which goes painfully against the grain of the enthusiast gamer, who likes to find their components individually and pay the lowest bidder possible.

However. Much like cars going from enthusiast product to a more consumer product as time has progressed (without necessarily weakening cars as an overall market, this point can debated), we may find Apple thinking more laterally to at least expand themselves into competing with their fellow PC makers - of course to be competitive right now they'll need to be cheaper/equal price to a PC, minus the cost of Windows 7. Which is the other barrier, they need to get involved somehow in the gaming market to make their software inline/integral with the new and upcoming gaming standards of video cards, software development ect.

So there's so many things for them to do, they may consider entering the gaming market for desktop PCs, but right now when they make $0.70 on a $.99 app, that's a fairly good margin there, the costs needed to get themselves into gaming may be too high for them to bother.

Any competition is good competition from a consumer's point of view, so if they do get involved, that'll be all the better for the rest of us (example iPhone; Android phones).

I was going to say something like this, but I don't think i could've ever put any better than you have~

 

[templar1138a]

*considers the thought of Macs becoming more important to gaming than PCs* .... HA HA HA. HA HA. HA HA. Ha. Ha ha. Huuuuuuh. Hah! You should go on tour.

 

[GoGoFrenzy]

I actually adore Macs and have one as well as my PC. The mac OS is simply flawless. But I just don't see it happening.

A lot of games studios (like Bungie) started on Macs way back when. But I have heard that Steve Jobs may have been to blame cause he actually wanted no resources wasted on gaming early on. And During that time pc gaming settled into Windows. Not sure if having one platform dominate is good or bad but it sure made things easier. Now that Steam is bi platform... maybe it won't matter that much in the future?

 

[gmaverick019_v1legacy]

which imac are you using then? just curious.

that's an issue with swtor or your driver issues, that has zero to do with windows, as i have yet to see that problem encountered ever on a windows computer (my own let alone my friends who play TOR)

yes that is true, it's been heard enough times thanks to apples commercials for the past decade, but most people are highly vulnerable to trojans as the average user has no fucking clue what they are doing, googling it would bring up thousands of news articles showing just that.

couple hundred? my rig is 800 including everything minus my gaming keyboard and mouse, which i have the free ones i got in my closet with the bundle, regardless of that the hardware stomps any mac remotely close to the same price or hardware. and once again your giving a highly opinionated answer as if it is fact, twice in the same little spot there.

2.5 GHz, Intel QuadCore i5
AMD Radeon HD 6750M 512 MB
8 Gigs of RAM.

I got the extra RAM for free. So my total cost was $1199, thats $400 more than your rig, which included a 21" inch LCD display, which is friggin gorgeous. What are your specs? Also, did your $800 system include your copy of Windows 7? Cause thats another $200-300 you need to add to the price, on a custom build.

I also have a minor advantage over a lot of Mac users that I am Certified ACMT and can repair my own Mac, even under warranty, which is another reason I use them over Windows PCs.

I used to build my own windows PCs back in the day. I switched for OSX awhile ago, its "different" sure, but its not inherently worse once you learn everything you can do with it. People think they have no control in an OSX environment, but this isn't true, in fact you have MORE control, you just have to learn how to do it.

phenom II x4 3.4 ghz
Radeon HD 5770 1 GB x2 in crossfire
16 gigs of 1600 ddr3 ram
600w power supply
(also a 21" LED/LCD display, "gorgeous" as you put it, got mine for 100 as I don't pay for overpriced anything.)

and yeah, it did inlude it in the price actually, and 200-300? no one buys the ultimate version ON RETAIL for that matter, i got professional for 50, fuck paying that.

i used mac's all the way up until i was 14 years old, so i'm pretty sure i'm not biased in the way I prefer windows over OSX, i've been using apple my whole life and was much more "at home" when i switched over to windows at home.

 

[GoGoFrenzy]

The moment this changes and Mac users understand that they're using underpowered or shackled hardware stuck in a pretty white plastic shell, then we *might* start to see game-worthy Macs.

They aren't underpowered or shackled for what they are intended to do. As a matter of fact the mac OS takes less "juice" to run overall. And is faster and crisper than Windows with pretty much zero maintenance. No scandisk, defrags, etc.

What makes them not so hot for gaming is more of a language barrier than a hardware one. (Except for the "pretty white ones" which are the entry level ones and really not comparable to the macbook pros. Nothing really wrong with them--I have a 2006 still going strong--but they have an integrated graphics chip so fuhgetabouddit if you want to game.)

As far as pricing: just the monitor on the 27" iMac is worth the price of the entire thing. Look at the specs. 2560 x 1440 LED. Simply drool worthy.

 

[GoGoFrenzy]

They're decomplexified PC's, prettied up. Ofcourse not.

Exactly what part of a Mac isn't complex? Windows stole the whole GUI thing from Macs, I don't know what does a regular Windows user need to know that is so much more complex.

Well they didn't have cut and paste until last year and you had to pay to get it.

WHAT?! Who pranked you with this falsehood? lol

 

[bobstone]

They're decomplexified PC's, prettied up. Ofcourse not.

Exactly what part of a Mac isn't complex? Windows stole the whole GUI thing from Macs, I don't know what does a regular Windows user need to know that is so much more complex.

Well they didn't have cut and paste until last year and you had to pay to get it.

WHAT?! Who pranked you with this falsehood? lol

I think he is talking about the pay update for the ipod touch...


also, how many people here have current versions of both apple and pc?

my desktop will always be pc, and for good reason, you can custom build a pc, people have pointed at the mac pro desktop and called it over priced which it is, but apple does not do price changes just hardware updates, and they have not updated the mac pro in a LONG time. and to compare a pc to an apple that is one foot out of the grave since they have not updated it since July 27, 2010... kinda silly


but with laptops it is another matter

ever since apple has switched to intel hardware I have been buying apple laptops. it ain't the best gaming machine out there by far, but with steam pushing games for osx and the ability to use bootcamp/win7 it handles all my "mobile" gaming needs, and when it is not gaming I get 5+ hours of battery life (honestly its about 7 but that can be a hard number to swallow) now you can link a alienware system or whatever is the new gaming laptop with sli n stuff, but I want a laptop not a desktop replacement, and for that apple does it right imho!

also to people saying it is also overpriced, just like all their stuff, apple updates hardware not lowers price, so when a macbook pro is first released it is quite competitively priced, typically has better battery life then the competition, and imho a better design by far.

to sum up gaming if you are looking at gaming on a mac, do not use their mac pro as an example, use imacs or macbook pro's their desktops ain't so good (for the simple reason that they are all in one computers), their laptops can be quite good.

to sum up price, compare macbooks and imacs at release to similarly configured pc's and you will not find them nearly so over priced as expected.

side note, osx as an OS is lovely if you know linux/unix, ever since they switched to a unix based core I have loved what can be done with a mac, for example if you know what your doing most Linux programs can run on osx( if you don't know what your doing why would you care about running linux programs ) I am not saying it is better then windows 7, but I never switch from my pc to mac and think wow this is clunky, or vice a versa...

 

[doomspore98]

Well, many games on steam are for mac, however microsoft outnumbers them greatly. If you call ipods/iphones/ipads macs then yes. The app market is huge. The question is, are we talking about apple in general or just the mac series.

 

[Z of the Na'vi]

For the love of god can we stop refering to Microsoft as 'PC'.
Both Mac and Microsoft computers have the potential to be PCs.


OT: I don't consider it likely unless someone with a brain gets a hold of Apple.

Interesting to note, my 2009 17" Macbook Pro can run both Snow Leopard, and Windows 7 via Bootcamp. I like to refer to my laptop as a horrible hybrid/mutant of both platforms for my maximum enjoyment of games on both. As for Macs themselves, I've never really seen them being all too big outside of the mobile market, with the exception of Blizzard and Steam titles which are compatible with OSX.

 

[VincentX3]

Will MacDonalds ever be healthy food?

I think that answers your question.

 

[bobstone]

They're decomplexified PC's, prettied up. Ofcourse not.

Exactly what part of a Mac isn't complex? Windows stole the whole GUI thing from Macs, I don't know what does a regular Windows user need to know that is so much more complex.

Well they didn't have cut and paste until last year and you had to pay to get it.

WHAT?! Who pranked you with this falsehood? lol

I think he is talking about the pay update for the ipod touch...

Nope, cut and paste only got introduced with lion, a paid for update.

http://www.macobserver.com/tmo/article/os_x_lion_cut_and_paste_finally/

OSX, ahead of the curve...

Got me there. But you know what, I consider my self to be a bit of a power user in both osx and windows and I never noticed it in osx, I should of I guess but what can I say... To me it was a non issue, besides the article mis leads you there. It seems to be written to make non Mac users point and giggle at osx. You don't have it the same way windows did but it was not like you couldn't copy or move a file if you wanted to. Or that it was hard to do. I mean honestly you think osx users can't choose to copy or move a file? Cut and past is just a way of manipulating file, osx did it differently, if it was an issue it would of been "fixed" much earlier, it's not like reprogramming the entire OS to do it was required.

 

[newwiseman]

They will become more able to play current games but the app store will never be a force of it's own. The sad fact of the store is if you don't luck into the top 100 list your app is never going to be heard of.

 

[bobstone]

Was just my opinion about the site. Not saying you where looking to link a biased site. And yes if it was considered a "fix" you are right, still IMHO it seems like a mostly non issue.

Back to gaming aspect tho, any Mac is just a pc now a days, so it will run any game that the same hardware on a "windows pc" would run since the only real diffrence is OS, cept with apple I can install both OS's natively where on a "windows pc" you can't legally install osx, so it boils down to hardware costs from apple vs window manufactures/DIY builds. Windows is cheaper to build a desktop any day of the week so it wins their, but apples laptops are really nice and not as over priced as people seem to think. Plus apple laptops until just recently where thinner and better designed the windows ones IMHO, windows laptops have been getting more portable but still can't match the battery life of an osx laptop, so for gaming on the go I would still call apple laptops a viable option.

 

[endtherapture]

Was just my opinion about the site. Not saying you where looking to link a biased site. And yes if it was considered a "fix" you are right, still IMHO it seems like a mostly non issue.

Back to gaming aspect tho, any Mac is just a pc now a days, so it will run any game that the same hardware on a "windows pc" would run since the only real diffrence is OS, cept with apple I can install both OS's natively where on a "windows pc" you can't legally install osx, so it boils down to hardware costs from apple vs window manufactures/DIY builds. Windows is cheaper to build a desktop any day of the week so it wins their, but apples laptops are really nice and not as over priced as people seem to think. Plus apple laptops until just recently where thinner and better designed the windows ones IMHO, windows laptops have been getting more portable but still can't match the battery life of an osx laptop, so for gaming on the go I would still call apple laptops a viable option.

Apples laptops are WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY overpriced.

My mates Macbook cost £850 and can't even run 5 year old games on high settings, but my Acer laptop cost £500, has a bigger screen and can run modern games on the highest settings.

 

[bobstone]

Was just my opinion about the site. Not saying you where looking to link a biased site. And yes if it was considered a "fix" you are right, still IMHO it seems like a mostly non issue.

Back to gaming aspect tho, any Mac is just a pc now a days, so it will run any game that the same hardware on a "windows pc" would run since the only real diffrence is OS, cept with apple I can install both OS's natively where on a "windows pc" you can't legally install osx, so it boils down to hardware costs from apple vs window manufactures/DIY builds. Windows is cheaper to build a desktop any day of the week so it wins their, but apples laptops are really nice and not as over priced as people seem to think. Plus apple laptops until just recently where thinner and better designed the windows ones IMHO, windows laptops have been getting more portable but still can't match the battery life of an osx laptop, so for gaming on the go I would still call apple laptops a viable option.

Apples laptops are WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY overpriced.

My mates Macbook cost £850 and can't even run 5 year old games on high settings, but my Acer laptop cost £500, has a bigger screen and can run modern games on the highest settings.

Mbp's When they are first released are not really overpriced, also MacBooks don't have decent discrete graphics so I wouldt consider them as much for gaming.

When I bought my prior mbp, a dell wih the same options was only 200 cheaper, was made of plastic, and didn't have a 5+ hour battery life. This was right when they released the new mbp, if you waited half a year to a year to buy it, then it was overpriced since apple does not change prices or do small revisions on their laptops. But when a mbp is first updated it is not way overpriced...

Also I am talking state side. I feel for people in Europe where they have the same price figure but diffrent cash, I.e. 850 usd vs 850 pounds. so to me it is 850 usd for that laptop, for you it is 1275 usd equivalent. much more expensive.

and how old are the laptops in question, also I looked at acres models and I can not find any acer with a discrete graphics card under 900 usd, which is still more then 500 pounds, so which laptop did you get and was it used or something?

 

[New Frontiersman]

If Apple became more dominant in the PC market than I don't see why not.

For the love of god can we stop referring to Microsoft as 'PC'.
Both Mac and Microsoft computers have the potential to be PCs.

Also, I agree, I find that really annoying. Both operating systems can be used on PCs; pretending one operating system makes the computer it runs on any different is just annoying.

 

[GoGoFrenzy]

For the love of god can we stop refering to Microsoft as 'PC'.
Both Mac and Microsoft computers have the potential to be PCs.


OT: I don't consider it likely unless someone with a brain gets a hold of Apple.

Interesting to note, my 2009 17" Macbook Pro can run both Snow Leopard, and Windows 7 via Bootcamp. I like to refer to my laptop as a horrible hybrid/mutant of both platforms for my maximum enjoyment of games on both. As for Macs themselves, I've never really seen them being all too big outside of the mobile market, with the exception of Blizzard and Steam titles which are compatible with OSX.

THIS is the best way to game on macs. I honestly don't understand why some mac users wait for a mac version of a game when they can run it perfectly via Bootcamp?