Your thoughts on 'Driverless cars"

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

In addition, when we are discussing object detection and identification systems and making split second decisions, you have to account for the human decision of whether to sacrifice yourself, your car and other objects to save the life of the child in the street. This actually happened on the street near mine, they chose to hit the car in the driveway and the front of the house over hitting the child on the street. They chose to hit much larger and more dangerous objects to save the life of a toddler on a tricycle. No one besides the driver was injured and due to this decision both the driver and child are alive today.

I am not sure this will ever be possible with our current systems even if they do improve object detection and identification as they lack the human emotion and ability to self sacrifice in order to save others.

You could specify that people beneath a certain size have a higher value if that's what you're concerned about. Computers certainly have the ability to sacrifice themselves for an objective, cruise missiles do it fairly regularly. The system doesn't consider its own survival unless you tell it to - and even then you can tell it to do so only up to a point.

The issue of course is, we do not have a system that can do that nor, will we have one for the foreseeable future. We do not even have a system that can tell the difference between a child and an animal currently.

maybe you aren't aware...but google cars have proven to be quite the defensive driver

"In August 2012, the team announced that they have completed over 300,000 autonomous-driving miles (500,000 km) accident-free, typically have about a dozen cars on the road at any given time, and are starting to test them with single drivers instead of in pairs"

and since then, it's logged in over 700,000 autonomous miles. The cars are legal in 3 different states already for consumers to be licensed to use, AND get this...they are in the midst of legalizing it in texas

http://www.legis.state.tx.us/BillLookup/History.aspx?LegSess=83R&Bill=HB2932

Now I'm not saying these should be used at all on high speed highways or for detailed driving in unique situations, but in your average city these things are damn safer than your average driver, I can't tell you how many close calls I have daily from people just not paying attention or living by their own "set of rules" that completely lacks acknowledgement for other cars on the road, not to mention they would do wonders to lower the amount of drunk driver deaths/killings we have every year.

more just food for thought, they are nowhere near perfect, but there are many benefits from autonomous cars for your average user in the city. Just imagine traffic flow in a busy city like new york if there were these instead of millions of cars all fighting each other inefficiently for where they needed to go.

In your average city user here, you will be expected to drive 65+ Mph. I can see the being useful for slow driving, however. In cities like the DFW metroplex of around 7 million people, where you drive 65mph to get to and from just about anywhere. If you could not drive 65+ mph you would not even be able to travel to most locations due to that being the only way to get there.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas%E2%80%93Fort_Worth_metroplex

I honestly think some sort of pod/ tunnel transportation system in the future would be better than "Driverless cars" due to speed, efficiency and realistic implementation. Instead of "subways" you have individual units taking people where they need to go.
This seems far more doable:
http://blog.shiftboston.org/2011/05/pod-cars-the-future-of-city-trasnportation

jeesh, you have some crazy high speed limits in texas then if that is average in city driving speeds, I should've switched my field specialty and been a transportation engineer down there

While dallas is bloody huge obviously, you guys must really have your shit spread out if you NEED to drive that fast even casually.. I mean for work yeah I have to bloody haul ass because that is what is expected of me, time is money, but in rush hour traffic you're lucky to get above 55 at any given point in time in my city, but that is more due to humans being fucking selfish asshole dipshits rather than it being too busy.

While the pod cars are a nice idea, it would take massive reconstruction on most of america's cities, as very very few cities aren't built around heavy car use, and the pods are too impersonal because they can only take you too/from hot spots, not to and from home when you live out in suburbs and such. Not that I wouldn't mind cleaner and more efficient transportation methods, I just don't think we'll see the switch away from cars anytime soon, it's become too engrained with how easy it is to just hop in your car and go.

I think there are ways to implement the pods by either going above, below or reworking traffic lanes in order to do so since pod lanes do not take up much space, they would be more doable than most solutions offered thus far. If Pods can be made as easy to just " hop in" and be implemented in the suburbs as well, I think that would be the best solution thus far.

 

[Phoenixmgs_v1legacy]

I don't think a computer program can actually drive better than me and make better time with regards to city driving. Now, highway driving I think it would do just fine as it's simple and make the highways safer since that's where a lot of driving fatalities happen.

Bring it.

Imagine a road system where every driver has a complete 360 view that it was constantly aware of.

Already done, I have a 360 degree view when driving by using my mirrors.

They aren't limited to 2 eyes and don't have a blind spot.

There is no blind spot if you set up your mirrors properly; I have my side mirrors set up so that I can still see the car along side me in the mirror just as it enters my peripheral vision. I never even turn my head to change lanes because I know where every car is. I'm constantly looking in my mirrors getting snapshots of the traffic behind me much like always peeking at the radar in a shooter and knowing where your teammates and enemies are. You never know when you'll have to immediately change lanes for whatever reason so you have to always know if you can without turning your head, it has saved me getting in a few accidents. And I have a perfect driving record all while cheating on my driving eye test because I'm nearsighted.

 

[gmaverick019_v1legacy]

In addition, when we are discussing object detection and identification systems and making split second decisions, you have to account for the human decision of whether to sacrifice yourself, your car and other objects to save the life of the child in the street. This actually happened on the street near mine, they chose to hit the car in the driveway and the front of the house over hitting the child on the street. They chose to hit much larger and more dangerous objects to save the life of a toddler on a tricycle. No one besides the driver was injured and due to this decision both the driver and child are alive today.

I am not sure this will ever be possible with our current systems even if they do improve object detection and identification as they lack the human emotion and ability to self sacrifice in order to save others.

You could specify that people beneath a certain size have a higher value if that's what you're concerned about. Computers certainly have the ability to sacrifice themselves for an objective, cruise missiles do it fairly regularly. The system doesn't consider its own survival unless you tell it to - and even then you can tell it to do so only up to a point.

The issue of course is, we do not have a system that can do that nor, will we have one for the foreseeable future. We do not even have a system that can tell the difference between a child and an animal currently.

maybe you aren't aware...but google cars have proven to be quite the defensive driver

"In August 2012, the team announced that they have completed over 300,000 autonomous-driving miles (500,000 km) accident-free, typically have about a dozen cars on the road at any given time, and are starting to test them with single drivers instead of in pairs"

and since then, it's logged in over 700,000 autonomous miles. The cars are legal in 3 different states already for consumers to be licensed to use, AND get this...they are in the midst of legalizing it in texas

http://www.legis.state.tx.us/BillLookup/History.aspx?LegSess=83R&Bill=HB2932

Now I'm not saying these should be used at all on high speed highways or for detailed driving in unique situations, but in your average city these things are damn safer than your average driver, I can't tell you how many close calls I have daily from people just not paying attention or living by their own "set of rules" that completely lacks acknowledgement for other cars on the road, not to mention they would do wonders to lower the amount of drunk driver deaths/killings we have every year.

more just food for thought, they are nowhere near perfect, but there are many benefits from autonomous cars for your average user in the city. Just imagine traffic flow in a busy city like new york if there were these instead of millions of cars all fighting each other inefficiently for where they needed to go.

In your average city user here, you will be expected to drive 65+ Mph. I can see the being useful for slow driving, however. In cities like the DFW metroplex of around 7 million people, where you drive 65mph to get to and from just about anywhere. If you could not drive 65+ mph you would not even be able to travel to most locations due to that being the only way to get there.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas%E2%80%93Fort_Worth_metroplex

I honestly think some sort of pod/ tunnel transportation system in the future would be better than "Driverless cars" due to speed, efficiency and realistic implementation. Instead of "subways" you have individual units taking people where they need to go.
This seems far more doable:
http://blog.shiftboston.org/2011/05/pod-cars-the-future-of-city-trasnportation

jeesh, you have some crazy high speed limits in texas then if that is average in city driving speeds, I should've switched my field specialty and been a transportation engineer down there

While dallas is bloody huge obviously, you guys must really have your shit spread out if you NEED to drive that fast even casually.. I mean for work yeah I have to bloody haul ass because that is what is expected of me, time is money, but in rush hour traffic you're lucky to get above 55 at any given point in time in my city, but that is more due to humans being fucking selfish asshole dipshits rather than it being too busy.

While the pod cars are a nice idea, it would take massive reconstruction on most of america's cities, as very very few cities aren't built around heavy car use, and the pods are too impersonal because they can only take you too/from hot spots, not to and from home when you live out in suburbs and such. Not that I wouldn't mind cleaner and more efficient transportation methods, I just don't think we'll see the switch away from cars anytime soon, it's become too engrained with how easy it is to just hop in your car and go.

I think there are ways to implement the pods by either going above, below or reworking traffic lanes in order to do so since pod lanes do not take up much space, they would be more doable than most solutions offered thus far. If Pods can be made as easy to just " hop in" and be implemented in the suburbs as well, I think that would be the best solution thus far.

as someone who works in the construction/engineering industry...it is nowhere near "more doable", the amount of money needed and redesign of everything would take a lot of time and effort,say goodbye to every cent you pay in taxes for decades, and you run into the same problems of driverless cars if the pods are that accessible, there would be monorails down every damn street and it would be autonomous based on your destinations, so you're still depending on a computer for travel.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

In addition, when we are discussing object detection and identification systems and making split second decisions, you have to account for the human decision of whether to sacrifice yourself, your car and other objects to save the life of the child in the street. This actually happened on the street near mine, they chose to hit the car in the driveway and the front of the house over hitting the child on the street. They chose to hit much larger and more dangerous objects to save the life of a toddler on a tricycle. No one besides the driver was injured and due to this decision both the driver and child are alive today.

I am not sure this will ever be possible with our current systems even if they do improve object detection and identification as they lack the human emotion and ability to self sacrifice in order to save others.

You could specify that people beneath a certain size have a higher value if that's what you're concerned about. Computers certainly have the ability to sacrifice themselves for an objective, cruise missiles do it fairly regularly. The system doesn't consider its own survival unless you tell it to - and even then you can tell it to do so only up to a point.

The issue of course is, we do not have a system that can do that nor, will we have one for the foreseeable future. We do not even have a system that can tell the difference between a child and an animal currently.

maybe you aren't aware...but google cars have proven to be quite the defensive driver

"In August 2012, the team announced that they have completed over 300,000 autonomous-driving miles (500,000 km) accident-free, typically have about a dozen cars on the road at any given time, and are starting to test them with single drivers instead of in pairs"

and since then, it's logged in over 700,000 autonomous miles. The cars are legal in 3 different states already for consumers to be licensed to use, AND get this...they are in the midst of legalizing it in texas

http://www.legis.state.tx.us/BillLookup/History.aspx?LegSess=83R&Bill=HB2932

Now I'm not saying these should be used at all on high speed highways or for detailed driving in unique situations, but in your average city these things are damn safer than your average driver, I can't tell you how many close calls I have daily from people just not paying attention or living by their own "set of rules" that completely lacks acknowledgement for other cars on the road, not to mention they would do wonders to lower the amount of drunk driver deaths/killings we have every year.

more just food for thought, they are nowhere near perfect, but there are many benefits from autonomous cars for your average user in the city. Just imagine traffic flow in a busy city like new york if there were these instead of millions of cars all fighting each other inefficiently for where they needed to go.

In your average city user here, you will be expected to drive 65+ Mph. I can see the being useful for slow driving, however. In cities like the DFW metroplex of around 7 million people, where you drive 65mph to get to and from just about anywhere. If you could not drive 65+ mph you would not even be able to travel to most locations due to that being the only way to get there.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas%E2%80%93Fort_Worth_metroplex

I honestly think some sort of pod/ tunnel transportation system in the future would be better than "Driverless cars" due to speed, efficiency and realistic implementation. Instead of "subways" you have individual units taking people where they need to go.
This seems far more doable:
http://blog.shiftboston.org/2011/05/pod-cars-the-future-of-city-trasnportation

jeesh, you have some crazy high speed limits in texas then if that is average in city driving speeds, I should've switched my field specialty and been a transportation engineer down there

While dallas is bloody huge obviously, you guys must really have your shit spread out if you NEED to drive that fast even casually.. I mean for work yeah I have to bloody haul ass because that is what is expected of me, time is money, but in rush hour traffic you're lucky to get above 55 at any given point in time in my city, but that is more due to humans being fucking selfish asshole dipshits rather than it being too busy.

While the pod cars are a nice idea, it would take massive reconstruction on most of america's cities, as very very few cities aren't built around heavy car use, and the pods are too impersonal because they can only take you too/from hot spots, not to and from home when you live out in suburbs and such. Not that I wouldn't mind cleaner and more efficient transportation methods, I just don't think we'll see the switch away from cars anytime soon, it's become too engrained with how easy it is to just hop in your car and go.

I think there are ways to implement the pods by either going above, below or reworking traffic lanes in order to do so since pod lanes do not take up much space, they would be more doable than most solutions offered thus far. If Pods can be made as easy to just " hop in" and be implemented in the suburbs as well, I think that would be the best solution thus far.

as someone who works in the construction/engineering industry...it is nowhere near "more doable", the amount of money needed and redesign of everything would take a lot of time and effort,say goodbye to every cent you pay in taxes for decades, and you run into the same problems of driverless cars if the pods are that accessible, there would be monorails down every damn street and it would be autonomous based on your destinations, so you're still depending on a computer for travel.

AND yet THAT is still more doable than having driver less cars that car drive outside of controlled environments where children can run into the streets. That is my point. Having a pod in a controlled environment tube is MORE doable than putting this on the streets. Building a whole new system for these pods is still more doable than driverless cars.

 

[Jesterscup]

I honestly think some sort of pod/ tunnel transportation system in the future would be better than "Driverless cars" due to speed, efficiency and realistic implementation. Instead of "subways" you have individual units taking people where they need to go.
This seems far more doable:
http://blog.shiftboston.org/2011/05/pod-cars-the-future-of-city-trasnportation

Kinda apologies for my heavy use of sarcasm after quoting you, But I live in the future....

Sure my country is kinda small, but to get from one urban density to another I go via a rail-based system. we even have these in towns, some of them fully automated, some are underground, some on the roads. we also have these things that are like cars, but bigger, they can hold like 70 people, generally get around town faster,and are so much safer, and cleaner.

ok sarcasm aside, I know not having a car isn't an option for everybody, but there are lots of people who would have a nicer life if they didn't drive.

Case in point, I used to travel for around 90 mins each way for a job. a colleague, lived 10 mins further away, drove and took the same time. Overall my journey was slightly cheaper, and I got to relax, work read books, play games. But he 'needed' his car....

The benefit of less people driving, is that public transport gets better, it scales better, less cars mean ever faster journeys, more commuters means more better & faster services, and better investment in the future of these services.

 

[DefunctTheory]

Bring it.

Imagine a road system where every driver has a complete 360 view that it was constantly aware of.

Already done, I have a 360 degree view when driving by using my mirrors.

No, you don't.

You have 360 degrees of vision that your constantly cycling through. And 90% of drivers do a really shitty job of it.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

I honestly think some sort of pod/ tunnel transportation system in the future would be better than "Driverless cars" due to speed, efficiency and realistic implementation. Instead of "subways" you have individual units taking people where they need to go.
This seems far more doable:
http://blog.shiftboston.org/2011/05/pod-cars-the-future-of-city-trasnportation

Kinda apologies for my heavy use of sarcasm after quoting you, But I live in the future....

Sure my country is kinda small, but to get from one urban density to another I go via a rail-based system. we even have these in towns, some of them fully automated, some are underground, some on the roads. we also have these things that are like cars, but bigger, they can hold like 70 people, generally get around town faster,and are so much safer, and cleaner.

ok sarcasm aside, I know not having a car isn't an option for everybody, but there are lots of people who would have a nicer life if they didn't drive.

Case in point, I used to travel for around 90 mins each way for a job. a colleague, lived 10 mins further away, drove and took the same time. Overall my journey was slightly cheaper, and I got to relax, work read books, play games. But he 'needed' his car....

The benefit of less people driving, is that public transport gets better, it scales better, less cars mean ever faster journeys, more commuters means more better & faster services, and better investment in the future of these services.

I do think many people would have a nicer life if they didn't drive, and I think we need to implement more of pod/ rail systems rather than try and focus on " driverless cars" as much simply because we already have the technology to do the pod systems, and we currently have no way of knowing if we will be able to successfully do the driverless cars in the future or not yet. There are many unknowns with driverless cars but with pods, we already know what we can do.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4uUsI052pRI

 

[Dagda Mor]

They would need to be able to be taken over at any time by the driver. Sure, this sounds great for regular highway commuting, but what if something unexpected happens? The automated car won't handle that well, and it needs a human to take over until the threat has passed.

In any case, yeah, I'd love this. I hate driving, and I'm really bad at it.

 

[Nukekitten]

In order to compare the stats of Texas to European nations, you would have to combine the stats from like 4 European nations to be comparable to the size of Texas. People also commute MUCH farther distances here than they do in Europe, thus require higher speeds just to access work, grocery shopping, and hospitals. The way residential and commercial zoning is restricted here makes for much longer commutes.

I'm not sure how combining the stats would be meaningful, considering that the stats were given as a ratio of deaths to population. I mean I know how you'd combine the populations and move your average, I don't know how it would make much sense as compared to going off of something like per billion vehicle KM or something like that.

By the latter measure Texas comes out at 1.4 deaths per 100,000,000 passenger miles[footnote]http://ftp.dot.state.tx.us/pub/txdot-info/trf/crash_statistics/2013/01-2013.pdf[/footnote]. Germany gets 4.9 per billion KM[footnote]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_traffic-related_death_rate[/footnote]. Which if I've got my maths correct works out at around 0.78 deaths per 100,000,000 passenger miles. Or to put it another way Texas would have around 179% of Germany's deaths on a per KM for KM basis. (Which I think is pretty much average for America as a whole.)

You might still meaningfully protest that people in Texas need to travel further on a more frequent basis and thus more speed in urban areas and thus more deaths. Which is fair, but that seems to me to be more to do with bad design forcing people to drive dangerously than it does an argument that people aren't driving more dangerously.

I see the idea of pod/ rail systems a much more realistic option than the idea of driverless cars due to how much safer and progress we have made on that in comparison.

If people could solve the planning and regulation issues with that so that we could actually have a decent rail system again, that would be lovely. I still take the train for any long journeys because ... well, drive or sit in a carriage being served tea and hot meals while browsing the internet? I think I'll take the train. ^_^

But I think the problems to solve there are going to be on the one hand regulatory for the train system and on the other ... there just isn't a good last mile solution yet. Not one that doesn't require heavy investment in infrastructure anyway.

 

[thewatergamer]

Honestly, I would much rather trust a computer with a wheel than a human, so frankly if this ever becomes a thing that would be pretty awesome.

I do understand the concerns about hacking and or glitches, but the amount of deaths due to that kind of error would #1 be completely on the company that made the car, and #2 be WAY less likely than dying because some idiot decided it would be a brilliant idea to get drunk and drive

So yeah, could have problems ESPECIALLY early on, and I do think their should be some type of manual overide option available in case something happens that the computer isn't programmed to deal with, but overall given the choice between a human and a computer behind a wheel of a car, I'd trust the computer more

 

[Flames66]

In theory, I like the technology, but I will never get one. I suspect they would be linked to easily track-able GPS systems and record destinations entered and that is unacceptable to me. I quite like the idea of self driving public transport though.