Your thoughts on... Nerd/Geek culture of today.

[Superbeast]

snip

You know what, I can't be bothered given your insistence that Will Wheaton is not a nerd/geek - which by the way is also saying I'm not a geek, given I have done far less geeky pursuits than Will has and I also criticise aspects of nerd culture. In fact, given SJWs are a part of geek/nerd culture now for better or worse, you rail on them pretty hard, so by I guess you are hostile toward a community you claim to be a part of now too, just like Wheaton, so you're no longer a geek no matter what your interests are either!

You're also avoiding the substance of the point about the case I brought up to keep focusing on hypothetical procedure rather than actual events.

Clearly this discussion is going to go nowhere and is just going to frustrate the both of us - at the very least it's frustrating the hell out of me. Good day.

 

[Jux]

Which hasn't been demonstrated in the least regarding Wheaton or Day. As Superbeast said, people can say 'Yea, I think Weaton is an asshole, I don't like him' without trying to delegitimize his nerd cred and play gatekeeper.

You suuuuuuuuuuuuure?

Am I sure about what? That that hasn't been demonstrated about Wheaton or Day? In so far as this thread goes, yea.

And technically Weaton is just an actor.

I didn't know 'nerd' and 'geek' were professions. I'm not sure what him being 'just an actor' (seriously, did you even read the stuff Superbeast wrote on Wheaton?) has to do with him being a nerd or geek.

Technically I'm just an operator in a power plant, at least professionally. How I pay my bills though doesn't have much if anything to do with my passions.

If ya want to stop here, by all means, don't feel the need to respond, but I prefer to keep my debates public.

 

[LawAndChaos]

Am I sure about what? That that hasn't been demonstrated about Wheaton or Day? In so far as this thread goes, yea.

*sigh* Alright, fine.

I was mostly just being facetious (I think that's the word).

I mean, I know for a fact Wheaton is a Sarkeesian supporter, insofar as he acknowledges she's good for the game industry and is an influential part of it (and ain't that the truth), but like I said, I'm not really arguing for anything pertaining to Wheaton, but initially I was just pointing out the flawed reasoning behind "all vitriol towards nerds and stuff is just critique" since it seemed like that was the direction the discussion was heading.

I didn't know 'nerd' and 'geek' were professions. I'm not sure what him being 'just an actor' (seriously, did you even read the stuff Superbeast wrote on Wheaton?) has to do with him being a nerd or geek.

I'm not pointing out that nerd and geek were professions. In fact you point it out yourself later in the comment.

Technically I'm just an operator in a power plant, at least professionally. How I pay my bills though doesn't have much if anything to do with my passions.

This is what I was basically saying. I feel that using his career is a poor illustration of his passions. The other "nerd cred" stuff that was listed is all fine and good, since I highly doubt he's getting any monetary gain out of it...maybe.

So apologies if I didn't type it out right. Not good with that whole conveyance thing.

Like I said, I wasn't really arguing anything. Just clarifying that not all vitriol is criticism, which is where the discussion looked like it was heading (and a direction I have seen multiple times where the offense-taking axe-grinders come out and lambast how there are so many problems in [x] and then when everyone else thinks it's not worth having long winded arguments over, the common rebuttal is "oh it's just criticism, there's nothing wrong with that")

If ya want to stop here, by all means, don't feel the need to respond, but I prefer to keep my debates public.

Part of it is just the fact that I've accepted the inevitable, so I'm not too keen on digging the holes, due to the fact that there's nothing in gaming communities nowadays but negativity from everything, and the gradual pressure of prudish Western society leading to a very slow but inevitable decline in entertainment media.

 

[Jux]

...but initially I was just pointing out the flawed reasoning behind "all vitriol towards nerds and stuff is just critique" since it seemed like that was the direction the discussion was heading.

Well that's fine, but that wasn't the argument I was making in the first place. 'All' never factored into my point. My point was, and is, that there are a lot of self appointed gatekeepers of nerd/geek culture and that Zontar accusing Wheaton and Day of bandwagoning is a perfect example of that.

It kinda merits examining critique on an individual basis to determine whether or not it's just vitriol being spewed for the sake of it, or if the critique is based on a real desire to improve the culture. I personally feel the former is dwarfed by the latter, if only because it doesn't make much sense for an outsider with no stake in the culture to care enough to pretend to be on the inside just to spew vitriol.

 

[Zontar]

My point was, and is, that there are a lot of self appointed gatekeepers of nerd/geek culture and that Zontar accusing Wheaton and Day of bandwagoning is a perfect example of that.

Hey, if they're going to claim to be nerds (and in one case, the "Queen" of nerds) they're going to have to do a lot more then find ways of making money to convince me. Especially since both are openly hostile towards nerds when they come face to face with them. Until now, neither has done anything to warrant such belief that they are, in fact, nerds, and quite a bit to make one believe otherwise.

It's also ironic you complain about gatekeeping on my part. Last time I checked one of the biggest problems with nerd culture is the fact there's a (thankfully disorganized and done by incompetents) effort to drive nerds out of nerd culture.

Personally I can't wait for something else to take over consumer culture, because the sooner it happens the sooner these type of people will focus on something else and let nerd culture get back to being the way it was before we got into this odd state where things nerds like are popular but nerds are still social pariahs who get all society's problems blamed on by those who aren't blaming them on immigrants.

 

[Erttheking]

^This.

It's 9 pages of people messily appropriating a culture they're not equipped to understand, so they've just relabeled their existing consumer culture. I guess it's more appealing to think of social issues and obsessive interests in terms of "Nerd", but unless you have the intelligence to back it up, fuck off.

YEAH! If you don't bite the heads off chickens you can't call yourself a geek! And unless your IQ is a specific unspoken digit, you don't get to call yourself a nerd!
Yeah! Arbitrary and completely moronic rules!

If you're not intelligent, and interested in "nerdy" pursuits, you're not a nerd. You can call yourself one, but then, you can call yourself an apricot if you really want to. Both ways, you'll sound absolutely ridiculous. Getting huffy about it doesn't help your case.

Enlighten me. What IQ is required to be a nerd? 120? 130? At what point do you qualify? Is there a test I can take? I'm just wondering, because the gatekeeping rules around nerds seem to change every three seconds.

 

[Erttheking]

^This.

It's 9 pages of people messily appropriating a culture they're not equipped to understand, so they've just relabeled their existing consumer culture. I guess it's more appealing to think of social issues and obsessive interests in terms of "Nerd", but unless you have the intelligence to back it up, fuck off.

YEAH! If you don't bite the heads off chickens you can't call yourself a geek! And unless your IQ is a specific unspoken digit, you don't get to call yourself a nerd!
Yeah! Arbitrary and completely moronic rules!

If you're not intelligent, and interested in "nerdy" pursuits, you're not a nerd. You can call yourself one, but then, you can call yourself an apricot if you really want to. Both ways, you'll sound absolutely ridiculous. Getting huffy about it doesn't help your case.

Enlighten me. What IQ is required to be a nerd? 120? 130? At what point do you qualify? Is there a test I can take? I'm just wondering, because the gatekeeping rules around nerds seem to change every three seconds.

It really helps if you're at least smart enough to know the difference between "gatekeeping" and a definition.

That's not an answer. Please answer my question directly. Or is that the only qualifier.

Also the definition of nerd is "Nerd is a descriptive term, often used pejoratively, indicating that a person is overly intellectual, obsessive, or lacking social skills." So you seemed to have missed a few qualifiers. Plus there's the fact that there's the official definition of words and the unofficial definition of words, and the unofficial definition of nerd is something that varies from person to person. And to be perfectly frank, people were never using the official definition of nerd anyway.

So it doesn't matter. Your definition isn't correct. Oh and let's not pretend "If you're not X you're not Y" isn't gatekeeping. That's a textbook example of it.

 

[Erttheking]

^This.

It's 9 pages of people messily appropriating a culture they're not equipped to understand, so they've just relabeled their existing consumer culture. I guess it's more appealing to think of social issues and obsessive interests in terms of "Nerd", but unless you have the intelligence to back it up, fuck off.

YEAH! If you don't bite the heads off chickens you can't call yourself a geek! And unless your IQ is a specific unspoken digit, you don't get to call yourself a nerd!
Yeah! Arbitrary and completely moronic rules!

If you're not intelligent, and interested in "nerdy" pursuits, you're not a nerd. You can call yourself one, but then, you can call yourself an apricot if you really want to. Both ways, you'll sound absolutely ridiculous. Getting huffy about it doesn't help your case.

Enlighten me. What IQ is required to be a nerd? 120? 130? At what point do you qualify? Is there a test I can take? I'm just wondering, because the gatekeeping rules around nerds seem to change every three seconds.

It really helps if you're at least smart enough to know the difference between "gatekeeping" and a definition.

That's not an answer. Please answer my question directly.

This isn't a high school debate, I gave you the answer you deserved. I've read nine pages of people who (to be blunt) are really CLEARLY no one's idea of a "nerd", try to cling to "Nerd/Geek Culture" like it's a real thing.

Nerds are a real thing, and have been for a long time. 'Revenge of The Nerds' though, wasn't about a bunch of people like 99% of you on this site. Not even close. Maybe the social lives have some parallels, but do you think you're part of the brightest group "in the school?" Really?

I've read 9 pages, and it hasn't been bright.

If you're going to be like that and not give answers, why even bother replying to me in the first place? Hey, I don't even like nerd culture that much. I'm sick of everyone having inflexible definitions of nerds. The problem is that you're doing the exact same thing. Same animal, different skin.

Definitions of words change. When I say something is purpled, I do not mean it is being stained with blood. Because that's what it used to mean. Nerd has changed very much. In the same way that a certain N-word was used as an insult, people have been making movements to reclaim the word that was meant as an insult to them. Oh, and you don't know what people on this website are like. You can't get a 100% accurate take on them just via forum posts. What's more, your original definition of nerd was inaccurate in the first place.

See, here's the problem. You're saying that people aren't nerds based a definition that no one really uses anymore. That definition of the word nerd? It's dead. So yeah. I really dislike where nerd culture is now...but we're all nerds. No changing that, no matter how many definitions you put up.

 

[Erttheking]

Snip

I tried to keep it simple and say that the unofficial term was used and couldn't be pinned down. You didn't respond to it. Don't blame me for feeling that a more in depth explanation was needed

Hm...No. Geek culture has a lot of problems with it. But nerd being an object of ridicule? Nope. It hasn't been that way for a long time. The dictionary says otherwise? People don't care what the dictionary says, they assign their own meanings to words. It's why literally is basically it's own antonym now. You can say that nerd only exists to scorn, common use of the word begs to differ, no amount of pulling up definitions will change that.

 

[Terminal Marque]

Snip

I tried to keep it simple and say that the unofficial term was used and couldn't be pinned down. You didn't respond to it. Don't blame me for feeling that a more in depth explanation was needed

Hm...No. Geek culture has a lot of problems with it. But nerd being an object of ridicule? Nope. It hasn't been that way for a long time. The dictionary says otherwise? People don't care what the dictionary says, they assign their own meanings to words. It's why literally is basically it's own antonym now. You can say that nerd only exists to scorn, common use of the word begs to differ, no amount of pulling up definitions will change that.

Nerds aren't an object of ridicule? Rich, successful nerds, sure, but you can just append any noun after "Rich, successful" and get the same result.

Ree: Caitlyn Jenner.

 

[Erttheking]

Snip

I tried to keep it simple and say that the unofficial term was used and couldn't be pinned down. You didn't respond to it. Don't blame me for feeling that a more in depth explanation was needed

Hm...No. Geek culture has a lot of problems with it. But nerd being an object of ridicule? Nope. It hasn't been that way for a long time. The dictionary says otherwise? People don't care what the dictionary says, they assign their own meanings to words. It's why literally is basically it's own antonym now. You can say that nerd only exists to scorn, common use of the word begs to differ, no amount of pulling up definitions will change that.

Nerds aren't an object of ridicule? Rich, successful nerds, sure, but you can just append any noun after "Rich, successful" and get the same result.

Ree: Caitlyn Jenner.

Nowhere where they used to be. And to be perfectly frank I find that nerds do more horrible things to other nerds than people outside the group ever do.

 

[Terminal Marque]

Snip

I tried to keep it simple and say that the unofficial term was used and couldn't be pinned down. You didn't respond to it. Don't blame me for feeling that a more in depth explanation was needed

Hm...No. Geek culture has a lot of problems with it. But nerd being an object of ridicule? Nope. It hasn't been that way for a long time. The dictionary says otherwise? People don't care what the dictionary says, they assign their own meanings to words. It's why literally is basically it's own antonym now. You can say that nerd only exists to scorn, common use of the word begs to differ, no amount of pulling up definitions will change that.

Nerds aren't an object of ridicule? Rich, successful nerds, sure, but you can just append any noun after "Rich, successful" and get the same result.

Ree: Caitlyn Jenner.

Nowhere where they used to be. And to be perfectly frank I find that nerds do more horrible things to other nerds than people outside the group ever do.

In two posts you've gone from "But nerd being an object of ridicule? Nope. It hasn't been that way for a long time."

to

"Nowhere where they used to be" and some version of "They're doing it to themselves".

Which do you actually believe to be the case? Then we can get on with why you're wrong.

 

[Erttheking]

Snip

I tried to keep it simple and say that the unofficial term was used and couldn't be pinned down. You didn't respond to it. Don't blame me for feeling that a more in depth explanation was needed

Hm...No. Geek culture has a lot of problems with it. But nerd being an object of ridicule? Nope. It hasn't been that way for a long time. The dictionary says otherwise? People don't care what the dictionary says, they assign their own meanings to words. It's why literally is basically it's own antonym now. You can say that nerd only exists to scorn, common use of the word begs to differ, no amount of pulling up definitions will change that.

Nerds aren't an object of ridicule? Rich, successful nerds, sure, but you can just append any noun after "Rich, successful" and get the same result.

Ree: Caitlyn Jenner.

Nowhere where they used to be. And to be perfectly frank I find that nerds do more horrible things to other nerds than people outside the group ever do.

In two posts you've gone from "But nerd being an object of ridicule? Nope. It hasn't been that way for a long time."

to

"Nowhere where they used to be" and some version of "They're doing it to themselves".

Which do you actually believe to be the case? Then we can get on with why you're wrong.

I made that post nearly a week ago. I didn't exactly remember it. Allow me to clarify. Yes sometimes people still poke fun at nerds. This rarely happens anymore, to the point where I don't really consider it to be a trend to worry about. It's barely a thing. Nerds lashing out at other nerds? Well...let's just say that there's a reason my resentment to the online gaming community grows every day.

Please. Tell me how I'm "wrong" as you so eloquently put it.

 

[Gengisgame]

My point was, and is, that there are a lot of self appointed gatekeepers of nerd/geek culture and that Zontar accusing Wheaton and Day of bandwagoning is a perfect example of that.

Hey, if they're going to claim to be nerds (and in one case, the "Queen" of nerds) they're going to have to do a lot more then find ways of making money to convince me. Especially since both are openly hostile towards nerds when they come face to face with them. Until now, neither has done anything to warrant such belief that they are, in fact, nerds, and quite a bit to make one believe otherwise.

It's also ironic you complain about gatekeeping on my part. Last time I checked one of the biggest problems with nerd culture is the fact there's a (thankfully disorganized and done by incompetents) effort to drive nerds out of nerd culture.

Personally I can't wait for something else to take over consumer culture, because the sooner it happens the sooner these type of people will focus on something else and let nerd culture get back to being the way it was before we got into this odd state where things nerds like are popular but nerds are still social pariahs who get all society's problems blamed on by those who aren't blaming them on immigrants.

Dude above me is on the money, as in of itself Nerd culture is absolutely fine and although an individual nerd is no longer a target for liking games or comics as they once where (according to 80's/90's movies anyway) the group itself is an acceptable target and receives unfair attacks and criticism from without and from within by people who actually believe it's far worse than it actually is.

On these very forums today alone I've had someone attribute incredibly small minority opinions with nerd culture.

Realize that a lot of the hate you may have towards nerd culture is manufactured.

 

[ilikeyou]

The big bang theory hurt geek culture a lot. Suddenly everyone assumed that we were smart and had degrees. No. Some of us are just pathetic losers with borderline autism.