Zero Punctuation: Call of Duty 4

Helix Falks

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Feb 9, 2008
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SiCaRi0 said:
Murian said:
Helix Falks said:
Yes Helicopters do come low in fact most Attack Helis are Specifical designed to do just that.
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I see your point on the squad AI but I spent most of the game charging headlong into enemy ranks like a true brit yelling "for Queen and country" getting myself perforated at ever opportunity so it was not a problem for me.
Oh, ok then. It just seemed that they'd be making themselves very vulnerable by doing that, seeing as there were loads of rpgs about.
there is NO WAY that helicopters fly that low in real life , the cod4 helis were at 4 metres from the bulding witch is STUPID and suicidal , just one of the milliosns of hollywoods thing that this game has .
I regret to inform you that they do and I have seen them do it with my perfectly functioning eye balls.Attack helicopters are well armoured and can withstand small armes fire and even RPGs but not stingers as they are designed to take out Aircraft.The role of a gunship is to provide close air support to infantry and armour and they can't do that effectively from high altitude.The AH-64 often sits just mere feet from the ground on the opposite side of a hill useing its top mounted radar dome to track enemy Tanks and when they come into range it pops up out of cover destroys the Tank then ducks back down again safe and sound behind the hill.
 

Psuedointellectual

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Jan 2, 2008
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rapidoud said:
no surprise he likes cod4
most fun game out now (popularity doesnt mean fun, lookin at you WoW)
he should do some mehmorpiguhs
mmorpgs

i dont see how the Popularity =/= fun anti WoW argument has anything to do with Croshaw liking COD4, since COD4 is very popular, so that means you arnt saying "Look at this unpopular game that kicks ass but all those blizzfags are too busy with their shitty overpopulized WoW" right?
 

SiCaRi0

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Feb 10, 2008
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Helix Falks said:
I regret to inform you that they do and I have seen them do it with my perfectly functioning eye balls.Attack helicopters are well armoured and can withstand small armes fire and even RPGs but not stingers as they are designed to take out Aircraft.The role of a gunship is to provide close air support to infantry and armour and they can't do that effectively from high altitude.The AH-64 often sits just mere feet from the ground on the opposite side of a hill useing its top mounted radar dome to track enemy Tanks and when they come into range it pops up out of cover destroys the Tank then ducks back down again safe and sound behind the hill.
you said it :"opposite side of a hill " mean about 1 or 2 km away from the target , not at 5 meters from a building and 2 from the floor .

attack helicopter fly low to avoid radar , and relative high to avoid small fire , there is no way that a chopper will fly that low in an urban batlefeild , thats why they asked for a "lazer beacom" and thats why they have all the electronics . if you want a "quick" proof , searcht in youtube videos of apaches and cobras in action , they attack VERY far away .
 

sexiipanda

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Feb 11, 2008
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i might not have anything productive to add to such a list of comments already...

but i did want to say that, like always, yahtzee continues to make me laugh.

with that, i'm off to take hallucinagens--and by that i mean i'm going to play Katamari Damacy and run over things that are smaller than myself.

(Katamari: the game to play when you're too broke to buy drugs)
 

Frederf

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Nov 5, 2007
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TioH said:
Seriously guys. This is a video game we're talking about. There's no way it can be entirely realistic. It's important to balance realism and gameplay so that it doesn't become entirely unmanageable. I see this kind of thing alot though, people with expectations so high that it's unfair to the game. Makes me ;.; that some people just can't enjoy themselves.
What's unmanageable about the MH-60 providing cover fire with their miniguns from 200m instead of 4m? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thjX3nni73M That video, 2:30 in. That's not unachievable realism, that's lazy game design, catering to Hollywoodism, and a complete immersion breaker. One errant pitch of the deck, one easy AK burst into the crew compartment and that MH-60 would be combat ineffective. A lot of the enjoyment from CoD4 should come from the impression that you're whatever real life combat operator and the game isn't a copy of Unreal with convincingly modeled (but not convincingly used) props.

There is realism that's boring to too many players, unsatisfying, and technically troublesome. There's also crass and lowbrow game and art direction.
 

Cowabungaa

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What's unmanageable about the MH-60 providing cover fire with their miniguns from 200m instead of 4m? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thjX3nni73M That video, 2:30 in. That's not unachievable realism, that's lazy game design, catering to Hollywoodism, and a complete immersion breaker. One errant pitch of the deck, one easy AK burst into the crew compartment and that MH-60 would be combat ineffective. A lot of the enjoyment from CoD4 should come from the impression that you're whatever real life combat operator and the game isn't a copy of Unreal with convincingly modeled (but not convincingly used) props.

There is realism that's boring to too many players, unsatisfying, and technically troublesome. There's also crass and lowbrow game and art direction.
Why wouldn't it do that? What's so unimaginably unrealistic about it? I see attack helicopters practicing a lot (also F-16's, dog-fights are so cool to watch), and I can tell you that it doesn't sound nor look unrealistic. I wouldn't call it ineffective either, it's a fast way to dispose yourself of a ship's bridge full of baddies. Pretty dangerous for a couple of SAS folks without really proper cover, on lower ground, and in much harder conditions to make aiming even more troubeling. I really don't understand the bitching about realism.
 

ComradeJim270

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Nov 24, 2007
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Let's put it this way... if you can choose to fly above trees and buildings, exposing yourself to any and all enemy AAA fire and SAMs, but limiting vulnerability to RPG and small arms fire (which attack choppers can withstand... easily in the latter case), or you can choose to fly low, obscured by trees and buildings but an easier target for infantry weapons, which would you choose?

The reason you see choppers flying so high in youtube videos and the like is because those helicopters are in Iraq and Afghanistan, where they are fighting enemies armed mostly with small arms and RPGs. Small arms will bounce off of them, for the most part, but RPGs are unguided, so flying higher gives the pilot more time to react. Also, there's not much cover in a desert.

I noticed my brother sniping an Mi-28 pilot in this game, and just had to roll my eyes. I really doubt a 7.62 mm round would penetrate, and even if it did, the thing wouldn't crash because the co-pilot can also control the chopper in an emergency.
 

Forwardassist

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Feb 12, 2008
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ComradeJim270 said:
Let's put it this way... if you can choose to fly above trees and buildings, exposing yourself to any and all enemy AAA fire and SAMs, but limiting vulnerability to RPG and small arms fire (which attack choppers can withstand... easily in the latter case), or you can choose to fly low, obscured by trees and buildings but an easier target for infantry weapons, which would you choose?

The reason you see choppers flying so high in youtube videos and the like is because those helicopters are in Iraq and Afghanistan, where they are fighting enemies armed mostly with small arms and RPGs. Small arms will bounce off of them, for the most part, but RPGs are unguided, so flying higher gives the pilot more time to react. Also, there's not much cover in a desert.
Coming from a military family I can tell you that any military helicopters are not immune to small arms. Western helicopters are light weight and unarmored unlike their Russian counter parts which tend to have armor in vital areas. That is why US helos always stand off a distance on a attack to avoid ground fire. Even then they are vulnerable to ground fire, their is a video on the net of a Apache being taken out by a well aimed RPG from the ground. Several US Army Apaches where brought down by rifle fire in Iraq and Afghanistan. While the Apache is a tough bird it can not withstand a bullet "golden BB" to a vital area. The crew cockpit is unarmored, and so is the engine area. One well placed rifle shot can bring down any heli armored or not.
 

The Q

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Feb 12, 2008
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This is the first "Zero Punctuation" I've ever seen. This means that my life has been empty. Fie.
 

justdan

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Jan 28, 2008
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I was going to tell you how to do your job, but then I experienced this cathedral spire and I must say... uh, curiously snug.
Great review, btw.
 

Helix Falks

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Feb 9, 2008
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SiCaRi0 said:
attack helicopter fly low to avoid radar , and relative high to avoid small fire , there is no way that a chopper will fly that low in an urban batlefeild , thats why they asked for a "lazer beacom" and thats why they have all the electronics . if you want a "quick" proof , searcht in youtube videos of apaches and cobras in action , they attack VERY far away .
You missed my point I agree that in the game there was no need for them to do it. my point is they do and have done and they ask you to laser paint the target so that they can tell it apart from the other buildings they fired at the soldiers inside with the Cannon and lanched Hydra 70s witch are unguided i might add. Also Assassinator pointed out that Pilots are crazy and i can back that up having worked with many sutch crazy people in my time.
 

Frederf

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Nov 5, 2007
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GenHellspawn said:
If it was covering it from 200 meters, wouldn't it be, umm, IMPOSSIBLE to take down?
I think that would be the point eh? I'm talking about the "Blackhawk" helicopter (close enough) that gets within ping-pong ball throwing distance to the bridge of the ship in order to shoot up the baddies in there. The helicopter is the one that dropped off the SAS guys and is providing door gunner support.

If you actually LOOK at the video and you DON'T SEE A PROBLEM then there's little point in continuing this conversation. I mean if you watch a video of a car run a red light and hit a bus full of kids and tell me "I don't see anything wrong in that video" then we lack a logical launching pad to reach my point. If it's not obviously unreal that the pilot of the helicopter flew to within hand-shaking distance in order to provide fire support, then I don't know what will convince you.
 

Jivewriter

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Feb 13, 2008
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Okay lets get something simple here people about COD 4 vs Realisom

For those of you deployed to battle, you should know that COD4 and real life have nothing to do with each other. The very situation the Marines put themselves in is militarily unsound and situational futile but lets keep the senario away from facts.

Helicopters: While helicopters can fight low level close air support, the pilot has the responciblity to keep his aircraft and his crew member alive. If he is taking fire off the side from the ground and few RPGs fly his way, he's going for evasive manuvers while his gunner takes on the enemy. He wouldn't just sit there, turing around over the hotzone waiting to take hits. Most common tactic would be he goes circling around the area and strafe it going over to reduce getting hit. He's also if you look in the game maybe ten stories up. That is about a hundred feet. It would be four times that and still be effective. In Black Hawk down those Blackhawks were only five hundred and one was a thousand. Lucky hits. The reason why that is not the case in this game? Because people would ***** and moan if they were just to put up with getting shot up by a heli. Although I believe if I have an air strike and I have planes coming in, they should take a shot with a Sidewinder off the wing to take out that chopper as they are going past.

Combat (Marines): Urban combat is not working if guys are dropping dead left and right if you stopped moving in a game and watched the AI go at it. There are no calls for medics, there is no orders shouting where to lay down fire from your commanders nor are you yelling them down to the corporals and privates, there are no orders being given down from the chain of command. There is no real tactical movements you can take like say in Rainbow Six Vegas or Advanced Warfighter so you can't take cover. This is a high paced shooter, not realism.

Combat (SAS): This is a little more to the stealth based kind of thing so it sticks a little closer to what combat is. You can't take a lot of chances, things are very tight knit, sniping is a must here. The ideas they are behind the scenes trying to fix all this mess is probably closer to the truth as one would belive. Still, its a bit of a strech the situations they get handed but if it was realistic, it wouldn't be half as good.

Enemies: ALrighy, these are fanatics and lets see what that means. These are not religious fanatics, just soldiers with probably a little crazy mixed in. They stagger when shot, they blind fire, they throw grenades sometimes, even last stand and the like. However they are too loose with their lives to be really challenging but its good enough because while I know they could make it realistic, it would be far too frustrating to stand for most gamers. If you want realism, play Advanced Warfighter on the PC if you want 'they make a mistake they die and vice versa you die' gameplay.

Weapons: Don't misunderstand this but everyone of these weapons are deadly in two shots or less. The shock alone from one round hitting you is enough to knock you out depending on where it hits. Why am I, if I am an American solider using an RPG-7 that is forty years old when the standard US model is a 40mm LAW or an AT-4 that fires a lot more strait and hits a hell of a lot harder. Plus as a little bit of a quirk here for multiplayer, what does a silencer, a grenade launcher or an aimdot have to do with eachother that I can only have one? Thats right, they don't. While some would say it gives others an unfair advantage, I would sacrifice one of my perks to have a second gun attachment, like kill perk number two if I had a grenade launcher and a silencer on my gun like the single player.