Zero Punctuation: Demon's Souls

[M4rsch]

Yahtzee should do an Extra Punct. on Games being too fucking easy these days. I miss the challenges, might even try this one out. Though one has to differentiate challenges and for example giving all enemies Fucking Far (cry) vision and aimbot and similar.

 

[rdrouyn]

Well considering the game comes with a manual AND considering the game is an RPG, I would hope that most players at least gave it a cursory look-through. I was able to get far into the game without looking at game-faqs but I must admit that doing that made the game much easier. However, you could say that about pretty much any RPG, so we would have to criticize the RPG genre for this point.

EDIT: I didn't learn that dodging was easier for characters with light armor from a guide, I learned from creating a light armor character, which is the reason why RPGs have character classes. Choose the one that suits your style better, etc, etc etc...

An excellent point. But RPGs are typically collect-a-thons that necessitate external help.

Is Demon's Souls that much of an RPG? It looks like more of an action game with RPG elements. That suggests that the game could be played as an action game alone, thus not requiring supplement. It also appears to lack a compelling narrative, typical of the action game.

Should gamefaqs or a manual be required to play a game?

It's really not required but they are quite a few items that you might miss on the first play-through if you arent looking carefully. Also there's the whole thing about world tendency that they never bothered to explain in the game which allows you to get powerful items.

In summation, it helps only to get more powerful stuff but never stops you from beating the game.

And Demon's Souls is an Action-RPG for sure. I mean you do level up, upgrade armor and weapons and talk to npcs.

 

[anthony87]

I've been hearing about the crazy ass difficulty of this game for a few weeks now. I'm gonna have to give it a little looksee.

 

[rdrouyn]

Uh that game does not appeal to me. What kind of a multiplayer game doesn't let you play with other people -_- . Funny review as always, biggest laugh for me was the messages joke with the "mum" part at the end. Does seem a bit too hard for a hack and slash, but maybe that's just not Ben's kind of game so he cant play it that well.

You can play with other people, just that Yahtzee did an unusually terrible review and never found out how to do it.

 

[axleblaze]

Uh that game does not appeal to me. What kind of a multiplayer game doesn't let you play with other people -_- . Funny review as always, biggest laugh for me was the messages joke with the "mum" part at the end. Does seem a bit too hard for a hack and slash, but maybe that's just not Ben's kind of game so he cant play it that well.

Um...it DOES let you play with other people. Yahtzee just gave up before he got the item that let's him do that. Other people can also invade your game and try and kill you.
To be fair, playing with specific people is hard, but it's still doable. This game wanted to have a multiplayer element while still making you feel isolated and alone in a scary world and that's one of the things it does amazingly well.

An excellent point. But RPGs are typically collect-a-thons that necessitate external help.

Is Demon's Souls that much of an RPG? It looks like more of an action game with RPG elements. That suggests that the game could be played as an action game alone, thus not requiring supplement. It also appears to lack a compelling narrative, typical of the action game.

Should gamefaqs or a manual be required to play a game?

First of all. Demon's Souls is an action RPG through and through. The RPG elements are very prevalent and more than something in the background. If anything the game is like Diablo, except you have full control of your character.
Also the ONLY thing that's really important that the game doesn't outright tell you is that if you have over half your equip weight equipped, it slows you down. Almost everything else is told to you in the game (really the only thing I can think of that you need the manual for is the button you press to zoom while arching and how to read the status screen)

 

[greeble]

What kind of a multiplayer game doesn't let you play with other people -_- .

It does let you play with other people. Yahtzee barely played the game.

When you are in body form you can summon other players to help you. (up to two others) And other players can invade to try to kill you. When you are in soul form you can choose to offer to help others or choose to try to invade others. (You don't get the "stones" required to do so right away)

No one should base whether or not to buy a game on Yahtzee's "reviews". They are funny though which is why I come here, to laugh, not get his opinion on games.

 

[Axikal]

Ben, thank you for properly airing every frustration I've had with this game. And yet, I have a deep admiration for the cheapness, and pure assholery that DS offers. I find the comments on here utterly amusing; as most of them are knocking the game off as something horrendous, when it's just a really... really... really hard game. It's a very well-thought out RPG, with sections that require you to do a little thing called: think.

There's little-to-no room for wanton hack-n-slashery here. Think, prepare, and die. And die again. And die again. And then succeed.

 

[BTAwesome]

"...Death isn't the handicap it used to be."
While incredibly hilarious, did you ever watch the show Red Dwarf, Mr.Croshaw?

 

[Axikal]

...Since when did Yahtzee become a pussy? All I've heard every other review was how games are too easy, now comes along a game with medium difficulty and all he can do is describe how impossible and unfair the game is. I thought he was better than this.
I mean, if describing getting your ass kicked in a game constitutes as a review then I could have been a famous game reviewer by now too.
As for the Demon Souls portion, I own it, I've played it, I've beat it. The hardest part in this entire game, is the army of dead babies. I have yet to beat it, and since I'm on my second run through they are even harder....It's a good thing Yahtzee didn't beat the game, otherwise he might have found the "hard" mode that is the real Demon>'s< Souls. As a final issue, I cannot believe Yahtzee got so many facts wrong in this review. The turd monster(the first one) is not a "suposed to lose" battle. I've beat it.

He was referring to the Vanguard from the tutorial, which is near impossible to beat on the VERY FIRST EVER PLAYTHROUGH.

And for the love of crap: HE'S A SATIRIST. Stop. Taking. Him. SERIOUSLY. -facepalm x2-

 

[bluntednz]

Yahtzee - while I normally enjoy your reviews -especially the biting sarcasm - in this instance I have one thing to say.

Harden the **** up. It's not that hard - you just have to approach it tactically. Oh and - dodge does work (if you time it right) - but roll is better.

 

[Dys]

Echoes my experiences with demon's souls perfectly

 

[Lord_Seth]

The 'supposed to lose fight' is an arbitrary, lackluster trope in the context of a videogame; removing choice from a medium defined by it reduces the medium.

I'm going to disagree with that; I actually like hopeless boss fights, as long as they're pulled off right. The purpose of a hopeless boss fight is to either show you how impotent you are or how strong the enemy is, or both. For example, Bowser wiping the floor with you at the start of Paper Mario demonstrates that thanks to the Star Rod, he is too strong for you to defeat until you rescue the Star Spirits. Saturos and Menardi destroying you in Golden Sun serves to show that you're a wimp at that time and sets them up as the most powerful villains of the game. These could be rendered in cut scenes, but it drills home the point better if it's in an actual battle.

Of course, like with many things in video games, it depends on how it's carried off. A good hopeless boss fight makes you want to keep going so that you will eventually be able to actually beat the boss in a rematch later. A bad one just comes across as contrived and annoying.

 

[yzzlthtz]

I feel bad for Yahtzee and all the people he just convinced to not play this game. It is now one of my favorite games of all time, not just because of the ZOMG HARD hype, but because it was legitimately challenging and very little was actually unfair.

Yeah, it may take more time to beat the first couple levels of this game than it would to fall asleep through the entirety of MW2, but you'll really get something out of it. Go ahead and say it's "too hard," you're the only one missing out, because I love this game. Kudos to anyone who stuck with it.

That's the one thing about this review that really disappoints me. It furthers the status quo of games being overproduced and just hard enough but really not actually very hard, especially because the same game has been made like a million times, and people already know how to play ie: MW2. I hate first person shooters, mostly because the majority of them make me motion sick, but also because every other game is a FPS and the game-play is always exactly the same.

Demon's Souls devs were brave enough to actually do something different, and they did it damn well. It deserves far more praise than most games on the market.

 

[Ph33nix]

not very informative about the game imo.

 

[Hazy]

The 'supposed to lose fight' is an arbitrary, lackluster trope in the context of a videogame; removing choice from a medium defined by it reduces the medium.

I disagree, solely on the basis that it can be used, quite effectively mind you, to show that the enemy you're up against is incredibly strong. It's sort of a taste of what's to come in Demon's Souls. It's in the same sense that the game is telling you:
"If you want to live, you may want to brush up on the mechanics, boyo."

But then again, being able to topple enemies twice as strong as the Dragon from the tutorial, is one of the greatest sensations in any game.

 

[Azmael Silverlance]

that was brilliant

Whooa yahtzee pwned with this one. I was truly crying during this ep good stuff man good stuff. Some of the recent eps werent as funny but this one was from you hearth i could hear it

 

[Axikal]

The 'supposed to lose fight' is an arbitrary, lackluster trope in the context of a videogame; removing choice from a medium defined by it reduces the medium.

I'm going to disagree with that; I actually like hopeless boss fights, as long as they're pulled off right. The purpose of a hopeless boss fight is to either show you how impotent you are or how strong the enemy is, or both. For example, Bowser wiping the floor with you at the start of Paper Mario demonstrates that thanks to the Star Rod, he is too strong for you to defeat until you rescue the Star Spirits. Saturos and Menardi destroying you in Golden Sun serves to show that you're a wimp at that time and sets them up as the most powerful villains of the game. These could be rendered in cut scenes, but it drills home the point better if it's in an actual battle.

Of course, like with many things in video games, it depends on how it's carried off. A good hopeless boss fight makes you want to keep going so that you will eventually be able to actually beat the boss in a rematch later. A bad one just comes across as contrived and annoying.

Hear hear. Though, I have to say that for the most part, I just stick to arrows and distance to remove the more obnoxious enemies (Mind Flayers!). Demon's Souls has simply taught me to learn more "indirect" approaches to battles. And my first two fights with invading players? Holy crap. I was about to crap myself when I saw the giant titling appear: "A Black Phantom Has Invaded Your World". Truly a terrifying experience. Very gratifying when I won, too. That's the mark of a damn good game. That feeling of satisfaction.

 

[lyrandar]

Quick thought, shouldn't it be Demons' Souls?

 

[yzzlthtz]

The 'supposed to lose fight' is an arbitrary, lackluster trope in the context of a videogame; removing choice from a medium defined by it reduces the medium.

It is? I can think of so may things that might be "arbitrary lackluster tropes," but "have to lose fights" as part of a tutorial, especially a fight that is actually possible to win, doesn't come to mind. Even if it is as you say, Demon's Souls does it pretty damn well.

Everyone on here who is criticizing demon's souls without actually playing it: why do you waste your life blubbering on pretending to know everything about video games? We all like what we like.

Demon's Souls is a good game. I've spent over 100 hours playing, have beat it like 8 times, have killed almost 200 invaders, and have had a damn fun time with it.

So then all these kids come around to stand behind Yahtzee's sarcastic bantering to throw rocks at the monumental achievement that is Demon's Souls and it looks just like you'd expect to anyone who has actually delved into it : children boasting about throwing rocks at a mountain.

 

[yzzlthtz]

Quick thought, shouldn't it be Demons' Souls?

yes. maybe. i don't know. there is one big demon, maybe it's all his souls. or maybe you're really the demon, and it's all your souls. or maybe it's just one arbitrary demon's souls. whatever. they're japanese.