Ukraine

Hades

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Why is he clearly insane? Nuclear capable nations have often invaded others based on dubious pretexts, that doesn't mean their leaders are insane, and it's not yet led to nuclear weapons being used. This one is a bit riskier than most times, but it's not that unusual.
Could be because this invasion hinges on nothing but imperial vanity. He noticeably didn't seem very well composed when he was raving about how Ukraine wasn't a real country.
 

Hades

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I could make a joke about how this is A terrible chernobyl sequel but no...

WHAT THE FUCK!
Apparently the area between Belarus and Kiev is unappealing to invade through because of the swampy area and chernobyl.

But I see the radiation isn't stopping those go getting Russians from destroying countries that Vladimir doesn't like.
 

tstorm823

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Could be because this invasion hinges on nothing but imperial vanity. He noticeably didn't seem very well composed when he was raving about how Ukraine wasn't a real country.
I'm inclined to think Putin does things with intent. The obvious and unavoidable consequence of his actions is isolation from the West, so it is my assumption that was at least part of his intentions. I do not think it is just imperial vanity, I think both the conflict and the insane ravings (which are mocked by US and pushed heavily as propaganda in Russia) are both part of an effort to disconnect Russia from Europe politically, economically, and socially.
 

SilentPony

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I'm inclined to think Putin does things with intent. The obvious and unavoidable consequence of his actions is isolation from the West, so it is my assumption that was at least part of his intentions. I do not think it is just imperial vanity, I think both the conflict and the insane ravings (which are mocked by US and pushed heavily as propaganda in Russia) are both part of an effort to disconnect Russia from Europe politically, economically, and socially.
I mean Putin knows the West will completely cave. Germany, France, the UK, the US, they don't care about Ukraine. They don't give a shit about Kyiv. All the sanctions are song and dances meant to take up headlines and articles for a few weeks, maybe a few months. Hell even if they make a show of sticking to their sanctions, there's going to be some fine print on page 182, subsection 5b, that gives 3 of the largest corporations in the country leave to make deals and continue banking and trading.
Same reason they allowed China to have the Olympics and Qatar to have the World Cup. Fuck loads of money.
 

Agema

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Strong global leadership can inspire and encourage cooperation over conflict without war even beginning.
Strength and leadership include raw power. Luxembourg will never accomplish anything much on the global stage because it doesn't matter how inspiring and encouraging its leader is, it has no significant power.

Biden is merely the latest president to encounter the harsh realities of the limitations of US power. Every US president since GWB has been staring at the gradual erosion of US predominance in one form or another, most obviously caused by the rise of China. However, numerous other weaknesses have been caused by the USA itself.

1) The Iraq and Afghanistan debacles, which caused significant global dissatisfaction, reduced trust in and the reputation of the USA. That they were in large part failures showed the world the limitations of the USA, heavily increased anti-intervention sentiment in the USA on left and right, which led to further half-hearted operations that increased the sense that the USA was weak.
2) Donald Trump inflicted substantial damage to US reputation with grotesque and ham-fisted foreign policy, particularly amongst US allies. Bluntly, a country is always going to struggle to lead when it's just alienated those it seeks to lead.
3) Internal dissent: political partisanship leaves the US president weak. The president has very little room to manoeuver due to opposition and is routinely undermined in his own country - a leader weak at home will be weak abroad, too.

In particular regarding 2&3, Putin cannot fail to have noticed that many Republicans would de facto rather take the side of Russia than their own president, just so long as the president is a Democrat. Such as Trump releasing press releases on how he wants to have Putin's babies, and barely any Republicans can be found to criticise him except the ones censured by their own party.

In a sense, therefore, Biden really is weak. But he's weak in large part because of institutional factors within his own country, and any US president would almost certainly be in the same position.
 
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Agema

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Same reason they allowed China to have the Olympics and Qatar to have the World Cup. Fuck loads of money.
The IOC and FIFA are nakedly corrupt international businesses run by people whose pre-eminent objective is lining their own pockets, headquartered in a studiously neutral state in order to avoid scrutiny and accountability. They aren't "The West" and "The West" has precious little say over their decisions.
 

SilentPony

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The IOC and FIFA are nakedly corrupt international businesses run by people whose pre-eminent objective is lining their own pockets, headquartered in a studiously neutral state in order to avoid scrutiny and accountability. They aren't "The West" and "The West" has precious little say over their decisions.
True. But what you just described is the UN, NATO, and all government everywhere too. Much as I wish Biden would do something, he's not going to do shit. Or at least nothing serious that will actually help. Its just going to be sanctions aimed to make a billionaire oligarch mobster feel bad, which he won't.
 

Seanchaidh

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More drivel
I had a more lengthy post typed up, but upon further reflection, this is all I care to respond with:

What an utterly pathetic snipe.

What has it accomplished? Not much, because we're on a fucking Internet forum. What impact do you expect any of our commentary to have?
Then why are you carrying on about it? Are you that starved of justification to feel smug?
 

Agema

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Well apparently Russia also Bombed its own economy.
My feeling is that Russia is run by a bunch of guys who are deliriously happy being big fishes in a medium-sized pond. It doesn't really matter how much we sanction Russia, they are kings of the heap and can extract vast amounts of Russian wealth into their own pockets (and as we have seen, secrete it away in international banks). I think it is possibly hard to underestimate how many powerful people are happier this way than they would be with a much more successful country where they have less personal power. What do they care if they hasten Russia's long-term decline, just so long as they have gilded offices, mistresses and luxury flats until the day they die?

The other thing is that Russia is clearly just going to turn to China. China's ability to bankroll Russia is surely only a fraction of the extent that the West can, but it's probably enough to keep the wolf from the Russian door. Putin sells his country to China, and China is overjoyed to secure Russia's natural resources for its own development.

It's kind of sad. China has recently overtaken Russia in GDP/capita in the last couple of years, but ten years ago, Russia had a GDP/capita more than twice that of China: testament to Russia's failings. China might be shittily authoritarian as well, but it is at least vibrant, active, full of growth and opportunities. Russia is a stagnant country, rotten to the core, whose leaders prefer to maintain their personal privileges than fix things. In the long run, Russia is only fit for further decline and irrelevance.

I feel very sorry for the Ukrainians that Russia is intent of inflicting its own decline on Ukrainians too, and - if it succeeds - that we did not do more to stop it. But as Russia's relative decline grinds on, I think it will end in losing Ukraine long-term anyway.
 
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Hades

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I wouldn't be too optimistic about sanctions. Apparently Russia used the last few years to turn their economy into a fortress economy where they minimize their reliance on other countries and build up vast reserves to stomach sanctions for years.
 

Godzillarich(aka tf2godz)

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I couldn't find too much stuff to confirm this but this statement is really interesting

If this is true is means two things.

1. Ukraine is actually decently fighting back, This may not actually be a simple steamroll Russia thinks it will be. Apparently they just surrender without a fight.

2. It seems like a least a part of the Russian military Soldiers didn't actually know they were going to invade, Their morale may be low because of this. When one side is fighting against a hated Enemy who subjugated them many times before and and the other doesn't even know why they're here that's gonna somewhat mess with your invasion plans.

However, despite all this the deck is still stacked in Russia's favor.

edit: Link to the story
 
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Agema

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True. But what you just described is the UN, NATO, and all government everywhere too. Much as I wish Biden would do something, he's not going to do shit. Or at least nothing serious that will actually help. Its just going to be sanctions aimed to make a billionaire oligarch mobster feel bad, which he won't.
<shrugs>

When a country has got heavily involved in horrendously messy international military interventions, it obviously tends to damage that country's willingness to enter more. Vietnam achieved similar for the USA back in the 70s, and maybe it takes about a generation for enough people to forget. Biden's got the USA as it is, not the USA various people would hope.

If this is true is means two things.
Trust nothing. There's going to be a metric ton of disinformation, because much of this is going to be a battle of morale.

Russia for instance claimed the Ukrainian border forces just ran away. Outside basic reconnaissance and actual border police who aren't there to provide resistance, I don't believe Ukraine will have had any formations on the border.
 
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Silvanus

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Then why are you carrying on about it? Are you that starved of justification to feel smug?
Its an online forum. People discuss things. If that is a surprising motivation for you, feel free to not do exactly the same thing.

Because, of course, until you'd been proven quite so obviously wrong, you'd been carrying on. And on. And on.
 
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crimson5pheonix

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Local Russians don't like Putin, news at 11.

On a side note...

 

Elijin

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Hot take: Things like this are probably going to become more common, as the last decade of batshit crazy political infighting means the US biggest enemy is the US. Countries on the outs are realising that as long as you dont directly attack a large western power, the mighty US military machine is paralyzed by it's own radical division amongst its people and government.

So yeah, as long as you pick on someone little, the US is too caught up in it's own internal shit flinging to do much more than posture.