Ukraine

[Lykosia]

1. The Russian invasions were More indiscriminate in their targeting

Just read the drone papers to learn how indiscriminate the US is as well. Last drone strike in Afghanistan really showed how the US cares to hit the right target, am I right.

Both are imperialistic nations full of war criminals.

And the reason why the US will never ratify ICC is because pretty much every US president would be prosecuted for war crimes.

 

[Silvanus]

1. The Russian invasions were More indiscriminate in their targeting

2. Russia/the USSR are shithole countries that no one wants to live in or deal with and have worse quality of life on almost every metric with items being out of stock everywhere

3. The US actually build schools in Iraq, and Afghanistan; how many schools did the USSR build in Afghanistan or Russia in Syria

None of this has the faintest relevance to the reply I gave. It's just directionless ranting.

 

[Eacaraxe]

I mean Trump becoming president was absolutely a win for Putin. Both of them openly said so at the time, and continue to do so to this day.

Oh, absolutely no argument here -- but the same can and should be said of GWB, lest we forget the "bromance" with his Russian counterpart that occupied so much media time during his administration. It's not so much a "Trump" thing as it is a "conservative" thing. The bigger distinction there was that neocons cozy up to geopolitical rivals whilst pretending otherwise, and paleocons (as much as Trump was one) are simply content letting geopolitical rivals do whatever so long as US interest isn't directly threatened.

What's of material consequence, is how the issue is framed by the mass media, and the impact that framing has on public perception and policy expectation. Or more specifically in this case, the manufacture of consent for chilled relations with Russia...and it behooves me to mention this is also not just a "Trump" thing, this was well ongoing during Obama's administration as well. It just happened to peak during Trump's administration, thanks exclusively to the Russiagate nonsense.

And now, we're stuck in a media hellscape in which public perception and policy expectation thanks to the past five years' media hostility to Russia, is to respond to Russian aggression in kind, when the US has no basis or capacity to do so. Sabre-rattling and limp-dick sanctions which neither the European Union nor NATO will genuinely support, thanks to aforementioned dependency on Russian fossil fuels, are all that's going to happen. Whether that satiates the vicarious bloodlust of froth-mouthed boomers whose minds perpetually exist in the '80s, is yet to be seen.

 

[Gergar12]

None of this has the faintest relevance to the reply I gave. It's just directionless ranting.

Read my other posts.

Also, many people here single out the US unfairly despite lack of evidence of the US being worse than Russia or China, I have literally had my forum User pictures taken away because it showed an F-35.

I hope you anti-American posters are happy, this is what happens to a country that is threatened by Russia or China, and not under American protection or intervention.

The ratio of posts arguing America is imperialistic to Russia is imperialistic is high.

Also for anyone replying to this, why don't you reply to the full post, not just half of it, or 1/4 of it.

 

[Silvanus]

Also for anyone replying to this, why don't you reply to the full post, not just half of it, or 1/4 of it.

Oh, this I can answer.

Because its extremely tiring.

 

[Lykosia]

Read my other posts.

Also, many people here single out the US unfairly despite lack of evidence of the US being worse than Russia or China, I have literally had my forum User pictures taken away because it showed an F-35.

I hope you anti-American posters are happy, this is what happens to a country that is threatened by Russia or China, and not under American protection or intervention.

The ratio of posts arguing America is imperialistic to Russia is imperialistic is high.

Also for anyone replying to this, why don't you reply to the full post, not just half of it, or 1/4 of it.

Last thing I'm going to add to this. While this is going on, at the same time for years Saudi-Arabia and UAE have been doing exactly the same stuff in Yemen. Maybe even worse, they are doing full genocide there. And they're doing it with weapons the USA has provided them with. Few senators like Bernie Sanders tried to stop these weapon shipments.

USA, Russia and China are the real axis of evil

 

[Gergar12]

Last thing I'm going to add to this. While this is going on, at the same time for years Saudi-Arabia and UAE have been doing exactly the same stuff in Yemen. Maybe even worse, they are doing full genocide there. And they're doing it with weapons the USA has provided them with. Few senators like Bernie Sanders tried to stop these weapon shipments.

USA, Russia and China are the real axis of evil

I would rather live in the US, than Russia or China.

 

[Gergar12]

Oh, this I can answer.

Because its extremely tiring.

Nice excuse for cherry-picking.

 

[Gergar12]

Huh, interesting.

 

[Gergar12]

Last thing I'm going to add to this. While this is going on, at the same time for years Saudi-Arabia and UAE have been doing exactly the same stuff in Yemen. Maybe even worse, they are doing full genocide there. And they're doing it with weapons the USA has provided them with. Few senators like Bernie Sanders tried to stop these weapon shipments.

USA, Russia and China are the real axis of evil

Whataboutism.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

I love how Russia/the USSR in the past can invade these countries

Soviet–Afghan War - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Prague Spring - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

.

Hungarian Revolution of 1956 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

But you guys on this forum won't shut up about Chile, Cuba, and Iraq. When was the last time this forum attacked Russia for being imperialists other than right now? Oh but it was a long time ago, I am pretty sure only the US is the bad guy.

But the way in the Afgan-Soviet war the USSR was dropping bomb toys on children, if the US had been as indiscriminate in its fighting as the USSR you lefties would be calling for the Hague until your throats bleed.

I told you Russia was bad.

Uh, pretty sure we thought Crimea was bad. Among other evil social policies. And the prosecution of gay people in Chechnya. Dunno why you think the forum is broadly pro-Russia until just now

 

[Gergar12]

Uh, pretty sure we thought Crimea was bad. Among other evil social policies. And the prosecution of gay people in Chechnya. Dunno why you think the forum is broadly pro-Russia until just now

No, but some of its members are, and the tone I get from the forums is that it's more anti-US than anti-Russia, and that's not justified by the evidence for how both countries conduct war, and for what reason.

Moving on

This legend shot down Su-35s with a Mig-29.

 

[Gordon_4]

No, but some of its members are, and the tone I get from the forums is that it's more anti-US than anti-Russia, and that's not justified by the evidence for how both countries conduct war, and for what reason.

Moving on

This legend shot down Su-35s with a Mig-29.

Holy shit its Viper!

 

[Seanchaidh]

No, but some of its members are, and the tone I get from the forums is that it's more anti-US than anti-Russia, and that's not justified by the evidence for how both countries conduct war, and for what reason.

Ehm.

The obvious historical parallel is to George W. Bush's invasion of Iraq, which was conducted on the other side of the world on fabricated pretenses. It was supposedly a matter of security before it became "well, Saddam was bad anyway". The Ukraine, at least, is plausibly a threatening place for NATO to put military assets. And for whatever absurd reason, NATO insisted on both not committing to defend Ukraine, which is reasonable on its own, and telling Russia that Ukraine could have NATO membership in the future, which is pointless unless war is the goal, probably incorrect, and needlessly provocative.

Even people like Mearsheimer and Kissinger have been blaming the United States for its handling of the Ukraine issue since 2014, Kissinger going so far as to predict that more or less this outcome would happen given the United States acting like it has. Fucking Kissinger thought that the United States needed to tone it down. Someone for whom there is anguish all over the anti-US left whenever hearing about him without an accompanying obituary because of the long list of war crimes by the United States he approved and facilitated.

 

[Gergar12]

Ehm.

The obvious historical parallel is to George W. Bush's invasion of Iraq, which was conducted on the other side of the world on fabricated pretenses. It was supposedly a matter of security before it became "well, Saddam was bad anyway". The Ukraine, at least, is plausibly a threatening place for NATO to put military assets. And for whatever absurd reason, NATO insisted on both not committing to defend Ukraine, which is reasonable on its own, and telling Russia that Ukraine could have NATO membership in the future, which is pointless unless war is the goal, probably incorrect, and needlessly provocative.

Even people like Mearsheimer and Kissinger have been blaming the United States for its handling of the Ukraine issue since 2014, Kissinger going so far as to predict that more or less this outcome would happen given the United States acting like it has. Fucking Kissinger thought that the United States needed to tone it down. Someone for whom there is anguish all over the anti-US left whenever hearing about him without an accompanying obituary because of the long list of war crimes by the United States he approved and facilitated.

You are the main reason I wrote this post, along with a few others.

 

[Seanchaidh]

You are the main reason I wrote this post, along with a few others.

Shhh

Here:

 

[Gergar12]

Russian soldiers don't have optics on their rifles. They aren't going to have a fun time in Ukraine.

Also Google Vaush.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

 

[tstorm823]

Nice excuse for cherry-picking.

That's a bit of an overly negative interpretation. If someone agrees with 90% of your post and only wants to refute 10%, that's probably a good thing for both parties.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

Brain dead American take here, but silver lining to a shitty, desperate situation is the ability to be the rawest mother fucker alive