Supreme Court overturns Roe v. Wade; states can ban abortion

TheMysteriousGX

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States with big economies like Florida, Texas and California are all among the top five states Illinois residents are moving to in the largest numbers, U.S. Census data from 2019, the most recent available, show.

But Indiana outpaces them all, possibly because it ranks among the top U.S. states with lowest cost of living.



Again, that was never something I said.
Neat. That stat doesn't account for net migration from Indiana to Illinois which is also substantial, and if we aren't tying it back to the whole "just move away from places that are putting total bans in abortion in place against the population's wishes" point it's a useless diversion.
 

Phoenixmgs

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Neat. That stat doesn't account for net migration from Indiana to Illinois which is also substantial, and if we aren't tying it back to the whole "just move away from places that are putting total bans in abortion in place against the population's wishes" point it's a useless diversion.
Uhh...
You can get about an equivalent place in Illinois for like half the price of Indiana and Indiana's cost of living is still way lower, that's how bad Illinois is. There was people waiting to see places right after me as the realtor and I was leaving places. And they are all Illinoisans. Illinois sucks ass. I went to the Indiana BMV to get my license 15 minutes before they closed on a Saturday and I was in and out whereas in Illinois you get to the DMV at 9am on a Saturday and they say it's already full for the day. I almost failed a background check for work because of fucking Illinois, if I was born 6 days earlier my licence would've been considered invalid by the background check place even though Illinois said it was valid. And I couldn't renew my license in Illinois without driving hours away because one DMV was destroyed in BLM riots (but they were nonviolent) and the other DMV went to appointment only but they weren't taking appointments... I couldn't be happier being out of that hellhole.



When did I ever argue that? And why do you keep insisting I did?
 
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TheMysteriousGX

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Uhh...
You can get about an equivalent place in Illinois for like half the price of Indiana and Indiana's cost of living is still way lower, that's how bad Illinois is. <irrelevancies>

When did I ever argue that? And why do you keep insisting I did?
I'm explicitly *not* insisting that you did, which is the entire fucking problem actually. If 20,000 people a year is a "flood", expecting literally millions of people to swap states due to oppressive governments is hilariously unrealistic. This conversation is part of a much broader topic that you're absolutely refuse to engage with to, I dunno, prove a minor semantic point and to claim that picking up and moving your life is Easy, Actually
 
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TheMysteriousGX

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Anyway, if you're curious how this Indiana shit happened, understand that they aren't exactly Representative in their Representative Democracy

 

Phoenixmgs

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I'm explicitly *not* insisting that you did, which is the entire fucking problem actually. If 20,000 people a year is a "flood", expecting literally millions of people to swap states due to oppressive governments is hilariously unrealistic. This conversation is part of a much broader topic that you're absolutely refuse to engage with to, I dunno, prove a minor semantic point and to claim that picking up and moving your life is Easy, Actually
I only replied to another user saying only spoiled people can move (which is a load of bullshit), that was all. When did I say millions should move? Also, it's easier to travel out of Indiana for an abortion than getting a damn license in Illinois.
 

Buyetyen

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That was never anything I said. I only posted to say having the ability to move or not has nothing to do with being spoiled or not.
Which is not what I said. I'm not going to explain it to you because the odds are better than even you're deliberately bullshitting me. Once again, your mistake was making your dishonesty public knowledge.
 
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Phoenixmgs

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Which is not what I said. I'm not going to explain it to you because the odds are better than even you're deliberately bullshitting me. Once again, your mistake was making your dishonesty public knowledge.
---
That was never anything I said. I only posted to say having the ability to move or not has nothing to do with being spoiled or not.
Serously, if you have the kind of resources available to you where moving to another state is just that easy, you are spoiled AF.
 

Dirty Hipsters

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So what is the "cost" of moving in your world? The cost for moving for me was higher than most because I had to buy a lot of shit that most will move to the new place.
Moving states costs thousands of dollars. Half of Americans can't afford an emergency expenditure of $500 without it affecting their ability to pay for necessities.

Add to that the cost of finding a new job (both real costs, and time costs, especially if you do something niche or specialized), and yeah, just moving on a whim really isn't a reality for a large percentage of the population.

Being able to move whenever you want doesn't make you spoiled, but thinking that anyone can move whenever they want does.
 
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Phoenixmgs

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Silvanus gets it. You're bullshitting me. Movin' on.
Being able to move =/= believing moving is super easy for everyone.
How does that have to do with being spoiled or not?

Moving states costs thousands of dollars. Half of Americans can't afford an emergency expenditure of $500 without it affecting their ability to pay for necessities.

Add to that the cost of finding a new job (both real costs, and time costs, especially if you do something niche or specialized), and yeah, just moving on a whim really isn't a reality for a large percentage of the population.

Being able to move whenever you want doesn't make you spoiled, but thinking that anyone can move whenever they want does.
How does moving states cost thousands of dollars? I bought lots of stuff I didn't have and it didn't cost thousands. Lots of companies exist in many states, you can transfer to a different location. Also, it's not hard to find a job for at least $15/hour to stay afloat.

I said that the things keeping people from moving isn't money, but family and friends.
 

Dirty Hipsters

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How does moving states cost thousands of dollars?

According to the American Moving and Storage Association, the average cost of a long distance move is $4,300, based on an average weight of 7,400 pounds and an average distance of 1,225 miles.
According to a recent U-Haul quote, the cost of renting a 10 ft. moving truck in Miami, FL and driving it to New York, NY costs around $1,700.
For reference, a 10' truck is the smallest moving truck, meant for studio apartments, so most people would need a much bigger truck which increases the cost of the truck itself, and increases the gas expenditure.
 

Phoenixmgs

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For reference, a 10' truck is the smallest moving truck, meant for studio apartments, so most people would need a much bigger truck which increases the cost of the truck itself, and increases the gas expenditure.
Then, they would be spoiled if they could afford to live in NYC. Though seriously, you can sell the place with all your stuff and just rebuy everything for far less. I didn't spend that much and I bought a bed, TV, couch, coffee table, end tables, and tons of odds and ends.

The second is an attitude that (probably) results from a pretty comfortable, lucky position.
Lucky position? I just don't waste money because I don't make that much.
 

Dirty Hipsters

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Then, they would be spoiled if they could afford to live in NYC. Though seriously, you can sell the place with all your stuff and just rebuy everything for far less. I didn't spend that much and I bought a bed, TV, couch, coffee table, end tables, and tons of odds and ends.


Lucky position? I just don't waste money because I don't make that much.
I like how rather than admit the fact that you are 100% wrong you make random deflections. You're cool like that.
 
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Dirty Hipsters

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Why spend more money to move stuff when you can rebuy it and have brand new stuff?
Because things have sentimental value, or people don't want all their furniture to be made out of crappy particle board like yours apparently is.

Seriously though, you need to stop moving your goalposts because nothing you've written has been correct. All you've done is highlight (again) that you don't actually know how much anything costs outside of your own wildly limited anecdotal experience, and that you have very little empathy for the problems of anyone who isn't you.
 

Phoenixmgs

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Because things have sentimental value, or people don't want all their furniture to be made out of crappy particle board like yours apparently is.

Seriously though, you need to stop moving your goalposts because nothing you've written has been correct. All you've done is highlight (again) that you don't actually know how much anything costs outside of your own wildly limited anecdotal experience, and that you have very little empathy for the problems of anyone who isn't you.
You moved the goalposts to a long distance move. I said moving in general isn't that expensive, not moving California to New York. You can buy good stuff for probably $5,000+ as you said it would probably be more costly than the quoted price because it was the smallest truck. Plus, you're selling your old stuff, you're definitely making out.
 

TheMysteriousGX

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Fantastically stupid side discussion that doesn't mean anything aside, can we all agree that mass migration involving tens or hundreds of millions of people isn't gonna happen?

Anyway, long time smart people democrats strategists seem to be determined to fuck this up.
Is it nepotism? Were they in the right fraternities and sororities? Did they just not ever have a real job so their brain fell out?
 
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Agema

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Anyway, long time smart people democrats strategists seem to be determined to fuck this up.
Maybe, maybe not.

In practice, a lot of Americans exist in a sort of grey zone on abortion where they don't like the Democratic position of effectively any access or the Republican position of no access at all. As a result, campaigning on a return to the old Roe v Wade status quo may be a far less compelling vote winner than we might like to think. Consequently, a more moderate position - abortion rights with a shorter timeframe, or guaranteeing access in certain situations (health complications, incest, rape, etc.) might get significantly more traction and as a result be more likely to be enacted.

Furthermore, what the strategists appear to be looking at is using abortion as a wedge to get people to listen to other ideas when they might not otherwise do so: so abortion as a route in to expand people's minds on other issues more favourable to voting Democrat. If they approach abortion as a single issue, if that issue is resolved, everyone goes back to their old ways. Instead, they want to an opportunity to appeal more widely.

This was much discussed in the UK in Corbynite circles: using the current enthusiasm not just for the immediate task of winning an election, but developing a deeper knowledge / belief in left-leaning political philosophy and ideas that might provide a foundation of support for for decades to come.