Ukraine

Ag3ma

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And that's exact;y what many African nations are currently discovering.
Yes and no.

Firstly, China has never invaded any of these countries, generally subjugated them, launched coups, etc. which is something of a plus. Then, it's the money. China has splurged investment money into them in ways the West has not - partly because analyses suggest these are riskier or low-profit investments Western investors tend to avoid. The issue then comes with what happens if they turn sour: does China play 1) nicely (write them off), 2) reasonably (extensive restructuring offers) or 3) shittily (grab everything it can)?

At the current moment, not much has gone wrong, so it remains to be seen where it ends up.
 

Absent

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China is heavily invested (financially and diplomatically) in establishing strong trade links, especially with resource-rich countries to secure supply lines for its industry. These sorts of links can be maintained with a degree of brute force, but without that, money and favourable perceptions can count for a lot.
I think it works the other way. These trade links make other countries dependant on China, and usually this weights much more on human rights considerations than human rights consideratons do on trade decisions.

Trust me, I'm swiss.
 

Dalisclock

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Now I'm pretty pig ignorant about combined arms, but I recall a conversation between people (I presume) weren't that inferred an A-10 is meant to operate in uncontested airspace as a close air support platform for ground based forces such as infantry and light armour in ground that is still contested. So if there are SAM or other defences in play, something else has to go in and blow them to kingdom come first. I assume this is one of many jobs the F-35 is supposed to do.
Pretty much. The idea being that early in a war you'd used fast, stealthy planes armed with HARM or Anti-Radiation missions to seek out and destroy enemy Air defense Radars and SAM sites to clear the way for more conventional aircraft strikes. The US called these "Wild Weasel" missions but notably they're called SEAD or Supression of enemy air defense.


To go into a little bit more detail, destroying air defense radars is generally just as good as taking out the actual SAM sites because the SAM sites need those radars to work properly(and normally SAM lauchers are linked a mobile radar unit in the same area) Anti-Radiation missiles are designed to home in on those radars and destroy them(and apparently the newer ones still work even if you turn the radars off) but with Drones and satellites you can use rocket artillery like HIMARS or suicide drones like like the Harpy to look for enemy SAM sites and then go kamikaze them.

Drones have apparently been evolving how this is done because if you can send a small unmanned aircraft into enemy territory, either with a missle onboard or with it's own warhead, you have another tool for clearing air defenses without risking pilots.

That being said, clearly it's more complex then this considering both Russia and Ukraine both have working Air Defense systems that prevent the other from bombing with Impunity. Russia notably has been launching missiles from Russian Airspace into Ukraine outside of Ukrainian Air Defense range in order to avoid losing aircraft(though Russia has been caught on camera shooting down some of their own aircraft and at least once and having one of it's own SAMs boomerang back to the launcher in a bit of Irony). Those big attacks on Ukrainian infrastructure are probably the best Russia can do ATM because they just spam missiles at soft targets knowing full well Ukraine doesn't have enough air defense batteries to shoot them all down and can't ever protect everything at once.
 
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Trunkage

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Yes and no.

Firstly, China has never invaded any of these countries, generally subjugated them, launched coups, etc. which is something of a plus. Then, it's the money. China has splurged investment money into them in ways the West has not - partly because analyses suggest these are riskier or low-profit investments Western investors tend to avoid. The issue then comes with what happens if they turn sour: does China play 1) nicely (write them off), 2) reasonably (extensive restructuring offers) or 3) shittily (grab everything it can)?

At the current moment, not much has gone wrong, so it remains to be seen where it ends up.
If we are doing the least worst option, doing Soft Power like what the IMF and China are doing is a much better way to do it

I prefer my designated religious conversion officer to come in the white collar books and discussion points motif than a crusader sword and shield one
 

Ag3ma

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If we are doing the least worst option, doing Soft Power like what the IMF and China are doing is a much better way to do it
In a way, "we" do relatively little these days - Western lending and investment is overwhelmingly private enterprise. China less so, because the state owns the major banks. However, one might note that people in foreign countries aren't so likely to distinguish between Western banks and the West more generally.
 

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Dalisclock

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I haven't been posting these because they're more entertainment/commentary and not quite on the Perun/K&G level of informational discussion.

But fuck it. There's some "Your mom" jokes in there that I'm juvenile enough to laugh at.
 
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TheMysteriousGX

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Conservative thought leader *checks notes* Catturd2 has helpfully lied to his followers, saying that there isn't any war footage or embedded journalists in Ukraine, so now the dumbest people on the internet have started believing the war is a hoax

 
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Dalisclock

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Conservative thought leader *checks notes* Catturd2 has helpfully lied to his followers, saying that there isn't any war footage or embedded journalists in Ukraine, so now the dumbest people on the internet have started believing the war is a hoax

I love how we've gone down the crazy rabbit hole from "Russia is the good guy here" and "Russia is Winning" to "There is no war".

Possibly because the previous positions weren't tenable anymore and now it's just easier to pretend the there is no war.
 

Gordon_4

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I love how we've gone down the crazy rabbit hole from "Russia is the good guy here" and "Russia is Winning" to "There is no war".

Possibly because the previous positions weren't tenable anymore and now it's just easier to pretend the there is no war.
Russia has never been at war with Ukraine
(with apologies to George Orwell)
 
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Thaluikhain

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I love how we've gone down the crazy rabbit hole from "Russia is the good guy here" and "Russia is Winning" to "There is no war".

Possibly because the previous positions weren't tenable anymore and now it's just easier to pretend the there is no war.
Eh, aren't they different steps on that list that Saelune used to post about people defending Trump? Same old.

But yeah, it's weird. Could easily have gone with "Russia is in the right, but Putin is an aberration that doesn't reflect Russia and so doesn't count".
 
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CM156

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I haven't been posting these because they're more entertainment/commentary and not quite on the Perun/K&G level of informational discussion.

But fuck it. There's some "Your mom" jokes in there that I'm juvenile enough to laugh at.
Laserpig is the best gay Scottish military youtuber.
 
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Absent

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Eh, aren't they different steps on that list that Saelune used to post about people defending Trump? Same old.
Same with climate. "No climate change, don't touch my car", "Climate change but natural, don't touch my car", "Climate change due to mankind but now too late to avoid anyway, don't touch my car".