Wo Long Fallen Dynasty Impressions - Seki-Nioh 3

[BrawlMan]

had planned.
Interesting he's talking about how the boss fights are too easy after that first one. He is talking about how parrying windows are generous and I guess that's true, but the angles or animations or whatever are confusing. I dunno how to describe it.

Of course Pat finds it too easy. Him and Woolie eat action games for breakfast, brunch, lunch, linner, and dinner.

The big different with Sekiro is that with Sekiro you can spam parry and in Wo Long you can't. And I guess that's the point. Wo Long punishes you for parrying too early by turning it into a dodge and having the enemy take half your health as a punishment. That is fine in theory but incredibly frustrating when in the context of long, multi-stage boss fights with delayed animations and saving the most erratic, confusing animations for the end.
I think personally, Elden Ring has sucked a lot of the energy I had for this kind of difficulty. But clearly not all of it, since I'm still interested.

Pretty much why I don't bother with Souls style games.

Also note Castle Superbeast's description about "feel"- they're talking about how in Sekiro when the swords clash they really clash, while in Wo Long it's all sort of paper-y. And yeah, it's true, I guess I like the CLASH more. Again- makes it feel like a fight

Yep. Exactly how parrying and DMC5 or Metal Gear Rising have that clang and clash to each of them. MAKES IT FEEL LIKE YOU'RE REALLY GETTING INTO THE FIGHT!!!

 

[hanselthecaretaker]

Right.. I didn't watch it before I played 'cause I wanted to go in fresh but I listened to it yesterday and while he's exaggerating a bit, of course I mostly agree with him.
Well, at least for the beginning of the game as I'm still not past the first boss. I didn't get to play yesterday as I had planned.
Interesting he's talking about how the boss fights are too easy after that first one. He is talking about how parrying windows are generous and I guess that's true, but the angles or animations or whatever are confusing. I dunno how to describe it.

The big different with Sekiro is that with Sekiro you can spam parry and in Wo Long you can't. And I guess that's the point. Wo Long punishes you for parrying too early by turning it into a dodge and having the enemy take half your health as a punishment. That is fine in theory but incredibly frustrating when in the context of long, multi-stage boss fights with delayed animations and saving the most erratic, confusing animations for the end.
I think personally, Elden Ring has sucked a lot of the energy I had for this kind of difficulty. But clearly not all of it, since I'm still interested.

Sekiro punishes excessive parrying by the result being you wasting your time not attacking. This is what makes it feel like an actual fight.

Also note Castle Superbeast's description about "feel"- they're talking about how in Sekiro when the swords clash they really clash, while in Wo Long it's all sort of paper-y. And yeah, it's true, I guess I like the CLASH more. Again- makes it feel like a fight.

*Ding/Dang/Dung* is pretty much what Sekiro’s parries are like, from best to worst. There’s an actual audible cue for how well you’re doing, and it’s also reflected by how much posture damage you take (and likewise give back to the enemy) in the process. So while it’s possible to get through the game with spamming, it’s certainly not optimal play, which I think is the most appealing thing about the challenge and skill ceiling it presents. It allows progression while incrementally improving your skill level, and each enemy presents different timings and opportunities for countering perilous attacks to gain an upper hand.

SL1 runs have always been possible in these games, but I’d consider Sekiro a standout example; probably because it’s designed as more of an action game.

 

[Old_Hunter_77]

Yay I beat the first boss. Doesn't really change my opinion about the game but I do like having a tough sword fighting game to dip into while listening to streams so I'll keep going.
The timing of the delayed critical attacks is really messing me up though. It's almost as bad as the QTE's in Hi-Fi Rush, and the annoying bullshit of Elden Ring boss delayed attacks. I don't like this trend in gaming about messing with timing and erratic delayed attacks and I'm bad at it and I'm really annoyed by it all.

 

[BrawlMan]

It's almost as bad as the QTE's in Hi-Fi Rush, and the annoying bullshit of Elden Ring boss delayed attacks. I don't like this trend in gaming about messing with timing and erratic delayed attacks and I'm bad at it and I'm really annoyed by it all.

That's nothing new. That's always been a problem since the 5th generation days, if we are talking about 3D gaming exclusively. Besides, you only have a few that did it right or don't bother with the delay at all.

 

[CriticalGaming]

Yeah I basically gave up on this game because I just don't feel like the game design fits with the combat design. In a game where defense is based almost entirely on parries, fighting multiple enemies is really fucked up. And from the first real level the game throws groups of dudes at you that you cannot reasonably deal with the way the game expects. What ends up happened is a kiting game until eventually you separate one dude enough to murder him, picking off the guys one by one as much as possible.

So it's a level and enemy design problem that doesn't match up with how they expect the player to fight. Not to mention the emphasis on timing and parries already fucks me up, add to it the extra bullshit and I just can't hang with this game. Which really really is disappointing for me because of how much fun Nioh 1 and 2 are. Even the Final Fantasy game had fun combat. But Wo Long? WoooooStinks.

 

[BrawlMan]

But Wo Long? WoooooStinks.

Do you want some Wang instead?

So far, Wanted: Dead is my biggest disappointment this year, and I didn't even buy it. Plus, I already have three Ninja Gaiden games and Metal Gear Rising. Frim what I've seen, the parries in WD are better by comparison Wo Long, but there's too little content on offer for such a high price. Besides, I already got the No More Heroes games, and different other titles for my low budget hack and slash pallet. WD I'll probably get when the game is at $20.

I know you'll probably be busy with RE4REmake first, but did you ever get the Hi-Fi Rush yet? It has way more satisfying parries and combat.

 

[CriticalGaming]

I know you'll probably be busy with RE4REmake first, but did you ever get the Hi-Fi Rush yet? It has way more satisfying parries and combat.

No I didn't because I don't have an xbox or can use my pc for gaming anymore.

I'm also skipping RE4 for now simply because I already know it's good and I'm busy focusing on the Diablo 4 beta and playing Path of Exile obessively atm.

 

[BrawlMan]

No I didn't because I don't have an xbox or can use my pc for gaming anymore.

I'm also skipping RE4 for now simply because I already know it's good and I'm busy focusing on the Diablo 4 beta and playing Path of Exile obessively atm.

I knew about the PC, but I didn't know you didn't have your Xbox anymore.

 

[CriticalGaming]

I knew about the PC, but I didn't know you didn't have your Xbox anymore.

Gave it away, didn't see any real reason to keep it considering the state of xbox. One decent indie game is no reason to have an entire $500 console.

 

[BrawlMan]

Gave it away, didn't see any real reason to keep it considering the state of xbox. One decent indie game is no reason to have an entire $500 console.

I can see behind that reasoning, but at least they're still the backwards compatibility. The reason why I got my brother's 1X, is because there are certain XBLA games (still exclusive to anything XBOX, but are not on other consoles) or 360 games that run even better on a Series X/S.

 

[CriticalGaming]

I can see behind that reasoning, but at least they're still the backwards compatibility. The reason why I got my brother's 1X, is because there are certain XBLA games (still exclusive to anything XBOX, but are not on other consoles) or 360 games that run even better on a Series X/S.

Also i owe $4k in taxes so unless the escapist is suddenly gonna start buying my games, i am not getting anything new for a couple months.

 

[Old_Hunter_77]

Yeah I basically gave up on this game because I just don't feel like the game design fits with the combat design. In a game where defense is based almost entirely on parries, fighting multiple enemies is really fucked up. And from the first real level the game throws groups of dudes at you that you cannot reasonably deal with the way the game expects. What ends up happened is a kiting game until eventually you separate one dude enough to murder him, picking off the guys one by one as much as possible.

So it's a level and enemy design problem that doesn't match up with how they expect the player to fight. Not to mention the emphasis on timing and parries already fucks me up, add to it the extra bullshit and I just can't hang with this game. Which really really is disappointing for me because of how much fun Nioh 1 and 2 are. Even the Final Fantasy game had fun combat. But Wo Long? WoooooStinks.

Same.
My quitting point came when I made it to the next boss, a big gorilla. And when I missed a big parry, it felt unfair and inconsistent. But even worse is when I achieved a big parry, it felt thin and unsatisfying. Comparing again to Sekiro, in that game when I made a big parry, I felt like a God.

And honestly, Elden Ring kind of killed off my desire to bash my head against boss fights. At this point I need more: awesome combat or intriguing/beautiful setting, and this one got neither.

 

[BrawlMan]

Also i owe $4k in taxes so unless the escapist is suddenly gonna start buying my games, i am not getting anything new for a couple months.

You do what's important. There's nothing wrong with that.

 

[BrawlMan]

Check out this hot take.

Wo Long: Fallen Dynasty Excels Over Elden Ring in One Key Way

Elden Ring and Wo Long: Fallen Dynasty are two very different Soulslikes, but while ER is more acclaimed, Wo Long has one advantage.

www.escapistmagazine.com

 

[CriticalGaming]

Check out this hot take.

Wo Long: Fallen Dynasty Excels Over Elden Ring in One Key Way

Elden Ring and Wo Long: Fallen Dynasty are two very different Soulslikes, but while ER is more acclaimed, Wo Long has one advantage.

www.escapistmagazine.com

That is certainly a take to have. I agree about the "meh" in regards to ER's open world. But Wo Long's level design is a bag poop smeered on a wall then turned into a video game level.

 

[BrawlMan]

That is certainly a take to have. I agree about the "meh" in regards to ER's open world. But Wo Long's level design is a bag poop smeered on a wall then turned into a video game level.

I've noticed since the start of the new website, that The Escapist have these weird stances or trying to make certain games (or movies for that matter), either bigger than what they are, or as if there's some grand design, when it's usually not the case. I get having to defend something when it's important, but not everything is going to be better than something that's more popular. Sometimes there's a game or movie that fails hard or messes up.

 

[CriticalGaming]

I've noticed since the start of the new website, that The escapist says had these weird stances or trying to make certain games (or movies for that matter), either bigger than what they are, or as if there's some big Grand design, when it's usually not the case. I get having to defend something when it's important, but not everything is going to be better than something that's more popular. Sometimes there's a game or movie that fails hard or messes up.

I would point to me thread "game Journalists make no sense" but you know....dead horse doesn't need no whipping.

 

[hanselthecaretaker]

Check out this hot take.

Wo Long: Fallen Dynasty Excels Over Elden Ring in One Key Way

Elden Ring and Wo Long: Fallen Dynasty are two very different Soulslikes, but while ER is more acclaimed, Wo Long has one advantage.

www.escapistmagazine.com

So basically the advantage is being able to circumvent the game’s forward progressional difficulty by backtracking to stealth kill enemies for strength boosting. Actually that kinda reminds me of bits of Sekiro too. Like the village that can be farmed for skill points largely with stealth kills, or even the mini bosses that can be given a stealth death blow before even starting the fight. Or grappling into trees or ledges to escape and replan a stealth attack.

In a way I get what he means, because ER is too open to really call anything “back” tracking. “Lateral” tracking maybe, but even then it’s often very easy to abuse the game’s stealth system. Its progression system kinda circumnavigates the issue of difficulty in its own way by being FROM’s only answer to the head bashing forward difficulty of their past games. Basically if the game is too hard at one place, go someplace else to find better stuff or get stronger and then come back to that place later. The point about there being “no reprieve” from hostility in ER is kinda baffling to me, as there’s more places than ever to get away from enemies and just chill.

Basically the article kinda took the long way around in saying they just prefer one type of design over another.