No. If you to ask more or less anyone who actually is invested in that flag, it's about not being shamed by people like you.
Could have put some national flags instead, if you wanted.
If DeSantis wins
- Thread starter CastletonSnob
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Yes, the irony is that I happen to dislike flags - especially national ones - and to be weary of the notion of "pride" (as it often goes above meaning of "not shame").
But seeing this discourse from someone who promotes the most dehumanizing form of shame to anything deviating from his own identity, and from people who impose their ridiculously narrow norms as the holiest god-elected models that mankind should ever aspire to - this really required a specific reminder of the hypocrisy.
I do want that, which is why I say what I do. That shame is built into the rhetoric. The notion of transgenderism has baked into it the idea that self-worth can be tied to semi-arbitrary social concepts of masculinity and femininity. The suggestion that people are "born this way" is itself weaponized homophobia.
A gay man may say "I was born this way, I didn't choose to be", because it allows for the argument against a homophobe where one can ask "could you choose to be gay?" And they're so embarrassed at the notion, they refuse to say yes. It is the reverse position to homophobia but the same premises. The focus on people being born a certain way, the necessity of it being a determined immutable identity, is all underwritten by the premise that anyone who would choose that life ought to be ashamed.
And then the idea of medical transition just takes it to an extreme, where actual healthy bodily functions are disregarded to maintain the facade of psychological determinism.
But actually: if you do something good, feel good about the world being better.
A joyful, colorful existence.
If someone feels the need to tell the world how comfortable they are in their own skin, they aren't comfortable in their own skin.
I'm not even that worried about the actual point, I'm just genuinely curious where the hell that came from.
You know I'm right, but you draw your own self-worth from hating someone like me, so you have to fight it. Got it.
Nobody who doesn't live under a nationwide or even worldwide blanket of acceptance says this shit. Pride is only sinful or hateful to those who were never made to feel ashamed by the rest of the world for just existing. For people who are white, men, cis, christian, and heterosexual pride is given to them by a society that is privileged toward them. They have no need to wave a flag in their honor; the world itself is already doing that. And if you accuse communities who are given no immunity from shame by society as hateful simply for giving themselves pride when no one else does, then you are one narrow-minded piece of shit. And that's me putting it kindly.
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I'm understanding aspects and contexts that your hatred for sexual minorities blind you to. That is, the reappropriation of an identity that assholes keep designating as shameful. "Pride" in that context (as opposed to your religious universalist bigotry) means "not having to feel shame for being this". It's the filling in of a deficit, to equalize it. It's the opposite of the mountain of megalomania from the top of which you intend to model the world at your sole image.
And if there is self-worth to draw from it, it's from not despising people with sexual identities different from mine, it's from being able to share the world, as equals in rights and value, with people whose sexualities and identities feel exotic and counter-intuitive to me. It's about the ability to genuinely assess whether there is something actualy toxic, evil or harmful in it, beyond knee-jerk discomfort, and overcoming this discomfort upon the intellectual realization that there is none. And by the way, if there's humility somewhere, it's also in that kind of approach to the world.
It's the opposite of your self-indulgence in hating, loathing, dehumanizing otherness and setting up yourself and your gut feelings (which, by the way, I more and more suspect you to misinterpret) as a universal model of virtue. This is megalomania, and it's typically shared and reinforced by your sect (under its own flag). If I hate you, it's not because of differences, variety and distances from me. It's because of your hatred for the people I love, and because of your hatred of differences, variety, and distances from you.
And because I'm very aware of the consequences of it. Of the historical and present responsibilities of people like you. You're the world's source of pain and evil. And you'll be until you'll manage to make the world fully homogeneous, modelled around your own little self. Until then, you'll keep fueling violence against them, preventing them to live in all the ways you can, and advocating others to prevent them to.
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Congratulations, you've once more scored a point in the game you're playing all by yourself in your head with just one rule: "I win." Clown.
Or the world keeps telling them they aren't, or shouldn't be.
At this point it's just a game with himself to see how close he can tread the line to hate speech, by finessing his words carefully. Not sure why any of you are still engaging. Especially since he's admitted the act of arguing is a big laugh for him.
No, I don't. Far from everyone would like to perform in drag. Those that do however already are comfortable in performing and reading for children is a form of performance that I don't think is objectionable to most performers.
As to why one would be connected to the other, well according to Wikipedia, it came about after a queer mother attended library events and thinking them heteronormative. So the motivation is to highlight for children of LGBTQ families that there isn't really anything weird with them. Something children of non-LGBTQ families can stand to learn as well.
Two questions:
1. What are your sexual preferences? (If you don't think that is any of my business or otherwise don't feel comfortable sharing this at a public forum I respect that)
2. Did you chose those preferences?
None of which is allowed to translate to how one considers oneself. All love must be externally directed; no inward esteem.
Ah, a sentence written by someone who has never experienced a society telling them they should be ashamed of what they are.
For someone speaking against pride, you sure do hold yourself in massively high regard; considering your arguments to be pristine and universal, and considering yourself to be the centre of everyone else's world. Everything they do, after all, they do solely to piss you off.
No you don't.
Once again, this is you imposing your own values and prejudices onto everyone else and ascribing motive that isn't there. You make shit up.
Question that I never see an answer for, and won't in this case either because I have him on ignore: If being gay is a choice, why are so many people choosing an option that will make so many people hate them for existing?
1. One specific person, who is a woman.
2. I have certainly done things voluntarily to lock those feelings in. I am not incapable of imagining a relationship with a man.
Have you read the replies to me here?
Well you see, I'm really, really really, really really smart, and my arguments are exceptionally good, it just doesn't make me worth more or less than anyone else. Denying my own talents would be just problematic as being proud of them, as I would then be dismissing opportunities to make the world better.
Not everything everyone does is done solely to piss me off. It's not about me. But to Bedinsis' comment above, the person who started drag queen story hours wanted story hour to be less heteronormative. There are no gender roles in reading to preschoolers, there is no sexuality in reading to preschoolers, the only sense story hour is heteronormative is that nobody is necessarily visibly gay. As we've discussed and you've all assured me, the children don't know any of the sexual connotations, they don't know that's a man, they just see a person in flashy clothing. If being less heteronormative is the point, but the kids won't recognize that, then the most logical conclusion is that the target audience isn't the kids, but the larger society around them.
A) People have different priorities to balance: there are many things people choose to do in spite of the hate they know they will receive.
B) Some choices are behavioral rather than a firm decision made in one's mind: if I think to myself "I'm choosing to lose weight", and then I act in ways that make me heavier, the ultimate truth is that I chose to be heavier. Something can be your choice while not being your planned outcome.
Ah yes, these forum arguments are exactly the same thing as rejection by parents and family, disownment, harassment and assault, unequal legal rights, several world religions condemning your existence, being illegal in dozens of countries, and having your nature be a playground insult.
You are one of the proudest people here with regards to your own arguments. You can deny that you feel that pride, but it oozes out of posts like these.
No gender roles in reading to kids, eh? Sounds to me like you just don't recognise (or care) how heteronormative the stories and culture our kids absorb actually is. Straight relationships are present constantly-- and anything else is exceptionally rare. Men have traditionally masculine jobs, and women traditionally feminine ones, if they have jobs at all rather than staying in the kitchen. And men would never wear dresses. Now why is that? It's not because the things are treated the same.
I mean, you've already opined to us here that kids should only be shown gender-typical behaviours. So you don't have any problem with enforcing heteronormativity. But don't pretend it doesn't even exist. And yeah, some people are fine with presenting things that aren't heteronormative, because kids should be taught its okay to be different.
((On a side note, did you know a long-practiced part of pantomime includes the dame in drag making risqué aside comments to the audience-- ones that the kids won't get, but the adults will? Yep! Something that's not even present in these library events)).
To attain beneficial outcomes.
To believe that a kid chooses to be gay is to believe kids choose to invite onto themselves bullying, harassment and assault, choose to be thrown out of their own homes, choose to endure years of prejudice and repression, choose to be murdered and arrested in dozens of countries, and to drastically reduce their own chances of finding a partner. It's one of the most brainless, foolish positions one can hold. Don't be that monumentally dense.
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When you put it like that it makes it look like you'd have to be thick as pigshit to think it was a choice. Like the two guys from Dumb and Dumber had a baby and trained it wrong on purpose, as a joke.
Being ostracised, bullied and potentially the victim and the years of stress during my teens was actually totally worth it just to stick it to Tstorm.