US 2024 Presidential Election

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Hades

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That is just not what is happening on Planet Earth. In your delusional world you made up, sure.
So in your fantasy world Trump is an ardent trans atlantic supporter, is a fan of global systems likes the UN and doesn't at all sympathize with the might makes right approach favored by certain other regimes?

Seems you're the one under a delusion.
 

Phoenixmgs

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So in your fantasy world Trump is an ardent trans atlantic supporter, is a fan of global systems likes the UN and doesn't at all sympathize with the might makes right approach favored by certain other regimes?

Seems you're the one under a delusion.
What actual real world conflicts are you claiming Trump is responsible for?
 

Hades

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What actual real world conflicts are you claiming Trump is responsible for?
I didn't particular claim he was though his endlessly slavish behavior towards Russia can at least be said to have emboldened him into prepping for the invasion of Ukraine. And Trump trying to move heaven and earth to reward Russia is going to make future wars inevitable.

What I am blaming him for is trampling all over the transatlantic alliance and post war order in general which is setting the stages for future wars. Therefore men like Rubio cannot claim the world is changing for the worse as if its not due to them that it does. The post world order largely worked. More for the global north than the south to be sure, but still it functioned. Which means Trump wanting to do away with it is inherently craven and dangerous.

In particular Rubio seemed to say the world was changing in regards to Europe as he said it in preparation for his Munich speech. Which again he can't just say as a matter of fact when his regime is orchestrating that change by ungratefulness, scheming and treason.
 
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Phoenixmgs

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I didn't particular claim he was though his endlessly slavish behavior towards Russia can at least be said to have emboldened him into prepping for the invasion of Ukraine. And Trump trying to move heaven and earth to reward Russia is going to make future wars inevitable.

What I am blaming him for is trampling all over the transatlantic alliance and post war order in general which is setting the stages for future wars. Therefore men like Rubio cannot claim the world is changing for the worse as if its not due to them that it does. The post world order largely worked. More for the global north than the south to be sure, but still it functioned. Which means Trump wanting to do away with it is inherently craven and dangerous.

In particular Rubio seemed to say the world was changing in regards to Europe as he said it in preparation for his Munich speech. Which again he can't just say as a matter of fact when his regime is orchestrating that change by ungratefulness, scheming and treason.
Russia trying to get Ukraine (or parts of Ukraine) is now inevitable because of Trump when that has been already happening for like forever?

Wanting Europe to be independent is not trampling over alliances.
This Babylon Bee post is hilarious because of how true it would be:
1771014182356.png

This doesn't address what I said in any way.

These people were imprisoned in maximum security at the US government's request and tortured.
Surely then you have results of the cases mentioned in the following article?
 

Hades

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Wanting Europe to be independent is not trampling over alliances.
They don't want us to be independent. They want us to be powerless vassals they can exploit. Why else would they want to destroy the EU and deal with all the mini states individually. They also want to deprive us of the wealth required to actually pay for said independence. Be it by tarrifs, their plots to bring down the EU or both. Nothing suggests the US actually wants us to be independent from them. Even them wanting our eastern half to be independent from Russia would be questionable.

Russia trying to get Ukraine (or parts of Ukraine) is now inevitable because of Trump when that has been already happening for like forever?
There's a difference of Russia trying, and Russia's attempts getting legalized and legitimized by the White House. And Trump rampaging around the western world and trying to cripple it was likely why Putin even felt safe planning his mass invasion to begin with. Putin gambled on the west being weak and divided, and Trump was a key reason for both those traits he expected to find .
 

Phoenixmgs

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They don't want us to be independent. They want us to be powerless vassals they can exploit. Why else would they want to destroy the EU and deal with all the mini states individually. They also want to deprive us of the wealth required to actually pay for said independence. Be it by tarrifs, their plots to bring down the EU or both. Nothing suggests the US actually wants us to be independent from them. Even them wanting our eastern half to be independent from Russia would be questionable.



There's a difference of Russia trying, and Russia's attempts getting legalized and legitimized by the White House. And Trump rampaging around the western world and trying to cripple it was likely why Putin even felt safe planning his mass invasion to begin with. Putin gambled on the west being weak and divided, and Trump was a key reason for both those traits he expected to find .
You thinking the US has the ability to destroy Europe is quite ridiculous.

You do realize to make any kind of deal to end the war, BOTH sides need to agree, right? You think Russia will just stop and sign a deal in which they get nothing? Also, nothing stopping you guys in Europe from just sending troops over to easily win the war and push Russia out, their army is a joke.
 

Hades

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You thinking the US has the ability to destroy Europe is quite ridiculous.
The US has the largest army and nukes. On a purely theoretical level they can destroy just about everyone. And in the case of nukes themselves right along with it. Not that it will happen but the tools being there mean it can never be inherently ridiculous.

But imagine if US support and election interference gets Le Pen, the AFD and other traitors in power and they do a mass exedus of EU states. This would leave Europe de facto powerless to protect their interests since they'd be crippled and divided. And now consider the US has it in their official and disgusting policy papers that they plan to strengthen exactly those parties to foster ''resistance'' against ''Europe's course''.

The US has both the ability and for some demented reason also the desire to cripple Europe.

You do realize to make any kind of deal to end the war, BOTH sides need to agree, right? You think Russia will just stop and sign a deal in which they get nothing? Also, nothing stopping you guys in Europe from just sending troops over to easily win the war and push Russia out, their army is a joke.
Quite frankly the Kremlin should collapse and they indeed should get nothing. What's the use of stopping the war if it makes the next war inevitable? Russia being permitted to gobble up European lands(and murder the people living on it) legitimizes it as a precedent that can be repeated and given some border towns or even the entire Donbas falls far short of Putin's goals he has little cause to stop there.

It simply isn't an acceptable outcome for Europe to have the war end with the barbarians being officially recognized as an existential threat that can go expand into our continent and butcher our citizens. Russia getting anything out of their psychotic endeavor puts the entire continent at risk.
 
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Seanchaidh

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But imagine if US support and election interference gets Le Pen, the AFD and other traitors in power and they do a mass exedus of EU states. This would leave Europe de facto powerless to protect their interests since they'd be crippled and divided. And now consider the US has it in their official and disgusting policy papers that they plan to strengthen exactly those parties to foster ''resistance'' against ''Europe's course''.
Sort of like what the US and assorted organizations pulled in Ukraine in 2014. Now you freaks are buying all of our natural gas.
 

Silvanus

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Surely then you have results of the cases mentioned in the following article?
Why? That case isn't over yet. Last update was Feb 12th, stating that the gov must respond by Feb 20th, and that it may be rendered moot if the agreement with El Salvador expires (which would say nothing of its legality).

To be clear, are you actually disputing what I said? That they were imprisoned at the US government's request? Because nobody involved disputes that, not even the US gov. It's a fact that happened, and that's what you're defending: the imprisonment, not merely the deportation, of people who have never been charged with anything.
 

Hades

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Sort of like what the US and assorted organizations pulled in Ukraine in 2014. Now you freaks are buying all of our natural gas.
The one who pulled something in Ukraine was Putin. He didn't have to openly parade the president as his puppet and thus a traitor. The maiden protestors were not the Le Pen of Ukraine. Yanukovych was the Le Pen of Ukraine.
 
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Dirty Hipsters

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Never argued that. Also, you don't seem to understand immigration and legality so...


That wasn't illegal...


Yup sounds perfectly legal to me...

"Were it otherwise, the Government could simply remove people from the United States without providing any process and then, once they were in a foreign country, deny them any right to return for a hearing or opportunity to present their case from abroad," he wrote.


In March, Trump officials flew the Venezuelan men to the prison, despite a verbal order from Boasberg for the aircraft to turn around. Boasberg subsequently started a contempt investigation, though the dramatic battle between the judicial and executive branches has been paused by an appeals court.


The administration has denied violating his order.


Gelernt said in a statement on Thursday Boasberg had "begun the process of giving these men their right to challenge their removal."


"Remarkably, although the government does not dispute the men were denied due process, it still was not willing to do what was right without a court order," he said.
Additionally:


Yup, great reasons to keep protesting ICE, the fact that they continue brazenly breaking the law.
 
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