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Kyrian007

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The top is something that could actually make sense for dreams. Like you might spin a top and it could just spin forever because physics don't exist and your brain just might forget about making it fall over. It's similar to a reality check that someone who is training themselves to do lucid dreams might do, just something that you do all the time to prompt yourself to realize you are dreaming. The problem is that dreams in Inception aren't very much like dreams at all. They have very specific logic and rules, and weird time dilation mechanics that don't actually make any sense whatsoever. They behave more like dives into virtual reality than actual dreams.
I always took it as more of a security issue. They made a point of mentioning that you shouldn't let anyone else know exactly how your totem works, never explain, don't let them handle it. Presumably because if they knew they could manipulate things if you were in their dream, to fool them into thinking their dream was the real world. It was the thing that actually tipped me off that the top wasn't Cobb's totem. They flat out said it was Mal's, they even explained how it worked. Meaning it was useless as a totem. I didn't pick up on the ring being his totem, but when that theory surfaced I thought it made sense. As for the ending, it made sense to me at the time and still does. The camera went to black before the top fell because the top wasn't important... and neither was the wedding ring or any other totem. The film ended there because it didn't matter at that point if it was the real world or a dream, Cobb was accepting that world was real... and nothing was changing his mind.
 

Drathnoxis

I love the smell of card games in the morning
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I always took it as more of a security issue. They made a point of mentioning that you shouldn't let anyone else know exactly how your totem works, never explain, don't let them handle it. Presumably because if they knew they could manipulate things if you were in their dream, to fool them into thinking their dream was the real world. It was the thing that actually tipped me off that the top wasn't Cobb's totem. They flat out said it was Mal's, they even explained how it worked. Meaning it was useless as a totem. I didn't pick up on the ring being his totem, but when that theory surfaced I thought it made sense. As for the ending, it made sense to me at the time and still does. The camera went to black before the top fell because the top wasn't important... and neither was the wedding ring or any other totem. The film ended there because it didn't matter at that point if it was the real world or a dream, Cobb was accepting that world was real... and nothing was changing his mind.
You are right that the way totems are described in the film they are only useful to determine if you are in someone else's dream and wouldn't be useful in your own. They are solely security measures. The top is kind of out of place as it works on a sort of real-world dream logic that the rest of the film doesn't follow. The movie really falls apart when you begin to analyse it, because for the most part it treats dreams as a shared VR simulation and only occasionally adds a bit of real dream logic as window dressing, and the two don't really gel at all.

I don't really see why you think the message of the movie is that it doesn't matter whether he is dreaming or not. The reason the film ended there was because it was a sensational moment that would serve to keep discussion of the movie alive for years. The idea that we would go through the emotional climax of Cobb realizing that hiding in his memories is not living and that the dream versions of people his subconscious serves up are faint imitations of the complexity of a real person only to immediately turn around and decide "actually, never mind, it doesn't matter." is just kind of silly.
 

Dirty Hipsters

This is how we praise the sun!
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As for the "don't eat carnivores" thing that is common but somehow nearly every culture makes an exception when it comes to fish.
A carnivorous fish is one that eats the meat of non-fish animals rather than just one that eats other fish. Most people don't eat carnivorous fish either (sharks, piranhas, barracudas, etc).

Fish that eat other fish are referred to as "piscivores." Most fish though are omnivorous or are herbivores.
 

Drathnoxis

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A carnivorous fish is one that eats the meat of non-fish animals rather than just one that eats other fish. Most people don't eat carnivorous fish either (sharks, piranhas, barracudas, etc).

Fish that eat other fish are referred to as "piscivores." Most fish though are omnivorous or are herbivores.
I've never heard that term so I looked it up on Wikipedia. First line: "A piscivore (/ˈpɪsɪvɔːr/) is a carnivorous animal that primarily eats fish."
 

Kyrian007

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You are right that the way totems are described in the film they are only useful to determine if you are in someone else's dream and wouldn't be useful in your own. They are solely security measures. The top is kind of out of place as it works on a sort of real-world dream logic that the rest of the film doesn't follow. The movie really falls apart when you begin to analyse it, because for the most part it treats dreams as a shared VR simulation and only occasionally adds a bit of real dream logic as window dressing, and the two don't really gel at all.

I don't really see why you think the message of the movie is that it doesn't matter whether he is dreaming or not. The reason the film ended there was because it was a sensational moment that would serve to keep discussion of the movie alive for years. The idea that we would go through the emotional climax of Cobb realizing that hiding in his memories is not living and that the dream versions of people his subconscious serves up are faint imitations of the complexity of a real person only to immediately turn around and decide "actually, never mind, it doesn't matter." is just kind of silly.
Absolutely that is the actual reason the movie ended right there. It just dovetailed well with the end of the film. And I think the reason I see the ending differently, I don't see it as a movie with "a message." To me it isn't a parable, it's a story. It doesn't (to me) exist to try and teach me to value living in the "real world." I don't really go into Christopher Nolan films looking for a message. At most there are themes or an overall mood or tone. And I thought Inception's ending had a similar feel to Memento's. A satisfying enough ending, with overtones of lingering melancholy.

I guess I didn't see Cobb as someone heroically overcoming his demons. I saw him as a guy so laser focused on his goals that he was willing to risk everything, ignore every one of his own rules, and even make mistakes that he's already personally seen the folly of making... just to achieve the goal of seeing his kids again. He may have learned the value of being in the real world, but it didn't seem to me like that was a value he ever really lost in the first place. I saw him as more of an Ahab figure, willing to ignore any lessons he may have learned just to get that sweet, sweet white whale of seeing his kids again. But... I'll admit that is maybe just too cynical a look at the story.
 
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Zykon TheLich

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Yesterday the TV showed me how bladder stones were removed in 17th-18th century.

First of all a frighteningly large metal probe with a bend in the middle get inserted into the urethra and all the way up into the bladder, where the surgeon will try to sound out where the stone is by dinking it with the and of the probe.

Then, to avoid going in too near the gut, a 2-4 inch cut is made in the perineum, going up through the base of the penis, prostate and then into the bladder. A large pair of forceps are then inserted into the hole to grab the stone and pull it out.
 
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Chimpzy

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At MIT, if you complete the PE courses archery, fencing, sailing and pistol/rifle, you are entitled to receive the Pirate Certificate.
 

Worgen

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Whatever, just wash your hands.
The story of Ballerina farms having to stop selling Raw Milk, and lying about it.
 

Drathnoxis

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I've been watching a bunch of videos about ecospheres, and suddenly I have a burning desire to build one. A closed, self-sustaining ecosystem on your shelf just sounds so cool. The only problem is I don't like bugs at all and so I'm sure I would immediately be bored and disgusted by it.

 

The Rogue Wolf

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Today I learned that Jimi Hendrix was a paratrooper in the Army 101st Airborne Infantry!

...for a bit more than a year. He chose military service over jail time for a conviction of riding in stolen cars and was assigned to the 101st after basic training, but hated the military lifestyle and was considered a slacker with poor discipline. He received an honorable discharge for what he claimed was a broken ankle received during training, but there were no records corroborating the claim.

His post was where he met Billy Cox, who would end up being the only remaining living musician to have regularly played with Hendrix throughout his musical career.
 
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The Rogue Wolf

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And today I learned that Ed O'Neill (best known as Al Bundy in Married... With Children) played a one-off part as an undercover FBI agent in Miami Vice (having missed out on the part of Sonny Crockett), and also has a black belt in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu.

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"No, ma'am, I think those shoes fit you perfectly fine."
 
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Gordon_4

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And today I learned that Ed O'Neill (best known as Al Bundy in Married... With Children) played a one-off part as an undercover FBI agent in Miami Vice (having missed out on the part of Sonny Crockett), and also has a black belt in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu.

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"No, ma'am, I think those shoes fit you perfectly fine."
Its nuts how many famous - like really famous - people have guest roles in that show.
 

Thaluikhain

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Watching an old (50s ish) documentary about blast furnaces, and they obviously have to have loads of train cars full of stuff sent to them, and to get the iron ore out apparently they separate the car, attach it to a room, and rotate the entire room upside down to drop it out into a conveyor belt. Which isn't down for other things. Seems odd.
 

Ezekiel

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Yeah, I watch him interact with these kids and think, that's not a pedophile. There would have been more reports from the kids at the time, but it only came from the couple of kids with provenly greedy parents. The kids would have been weirder around him on camera.


Learned only a few days ago that he really did have a skin condition that took away his pigment.
 

Mister Mumbler

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Watching an old (50s ish) documentary about blast furnaces, and they obviously have to have loads of train cars full of stuff sent to them, and to get the iron ore out apparently they separate the car, attach it to a room, and rotate the entire room upside down to drop it out into a conveyor belt. Which isn't down for other things. Seems odd.
Just plain easier to rotate a big cylinder with an open top than to try and drop ore through the bottom of the cars and through the small gap between the rails underneath.

1775693451991.png
 

The Rogue Wolf

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Mike Ilitch, founder of the Little Caesar's pizza franchise, without fanfare paid Rosa Parks's rent for the rest of her life after she was attacked and robbed in 1994, so that she could live in a safer area.