John Bolton's new book...

[Agema]

Some fun details of what was going on in the White House according to John Bolton, during his tenure with the administration.

The quick run-down is a pretty much constant series of attempts by Trump to leverage foreign support for his re-election, and interference in judicial process. Trump asking the Chinese premier to buy more US agricultural produce explicitly to improve his election chances, and encouraging him to build more concentration camps for Chinese Muslims. Interfering to impede US investigations into Chinese and Turkish firms for diplomatic favour, and of course also the Ukraine stuff.

I know it'll probably make sod all difference to how anyone feels about Trump (for or against), but, you'know, at least we can hear some of it.

 

[SilentPony]

I mean its John Bolton. Much as I believe Trump is selling the country for re-election, take what Bolton says with a asteroid of salt.

 

[Aegix Drakan]

I mean its John Bolton. Much as I believe Trump is selling the company for re-election, take what Bolton says with a asteroid of salt.

I have NEVER heard this particular variant of the expression before, and I REALLY want to try to remember this one, because the image is really striking XD

 

[Hades]

Bolton might not exactly be reliable but I have a very easy time believing this. The sympathy for dictators, the infighting, the almost open corruption and the naked self interest have always been a part of the Trump administration. Bolton could be blowing things out of his ass but with his claims lining up with what we always knew about Trump that doesn't seem very likely.

Of course Bolton was fine with all those things when Trump still had a fancy job for him. He knew what to expect when Trump asked him and only started finding it an issue when he was fired.

 

[lil devils x]

Bolton might not exactly be reliable but I have a very easy time believing this. The sympathy for dictators, the infighting, the almost open corruption and the naked self interest have always been a part of the Trump administration. Bolton could be blowing things out of his ass but with his claims lining up with what we always knew about Trump that doesn't seem very likely.

Of course Bolton was fine with all those things when Trump still had a fancy job for him. He knew what to expect when Trump asked him and only started finding it an issue when he was fired.

From what was stated prior to him being fired though, Bolton apparently did have a problem with Trump's behavior long before he was fired, and it was him repeatedly voicing his opposition that was the reason he was fired in the first place. According to testimony, Bolton referred to Trump's extorting the Ukraine as a " Drug Deal" he wanted no part of. What is amusing though is that we have all of Trump's "Best people" later coming out telling everyone all the awful things he does and Trump supporters could care less and/or dismiss them as lies because their "Chosen one" would never lie to them... The most absurd is they actually think that everyone else must be lying rather than Trump just being unfit for the job. It is an entirely new level of willful ignorance.

 

[Buyetyen]

Bolton's problem isn't one of his word lacking value, it's that his ideas about diplomacy and international law are stupid and dumb. So I'm sure the information in his book is accurate. I am of the opinion though that every interviewer needs to ask him, "Why didn't you testify and give us this information then?"

 

[SilentPony]

Bolton's problem isn't one of his word lacking value, it's that his ideas about diplomacy and international law are stupid and dumb. So I'm sure the information in his book is accurate. I am of the opinion though that every interviewer needs to ask him, "Why didn't you testify and give us this information then?"

Oh I doubt Bolton actually thinks what Trump is doing is wrong. Bolton isn't even pro-democracy, he's for full on dictatorship. He's simply salty he isn't in power anymore, and if baby Bolton can't have power, no one can. He'll give Democrats the talking points and debate fodder they want and collect handsome fees from talk shows, appearances and sales, all out of spite because Donny cast him aside while Bolton is 1000% convinced he's the smartest man in the country.

 

[Dirty Hipsters]

Oh I doubt Bolton actually thinks what Trump is doing is wrong. Bolton isn't even pro-democracy, he's for full on dictatorship. He's simply salty he isn't in power anymore, and if baby Bolton can't have power, no one can. He'll give Democrats the talking points and debate fodder they want and collect handsome fees from talk shows, appearances and sales, all out of spite because Donny cast him aside while Bolton is 1000% convinced he's the smartest man in the country.

Let's be real though, the best reason to do anything is out of spite. Spite ************.

 

[SilentPony]

Let's be real though, the best reason to do anything is out of spite. Spite ************.

Personally I prefer to do with out of Sprite, like Grant Hill, but Spite is good too.

 

[meiam]

I mean, Bolton is a well known liberal/socialist propagandist /s

But this will change literally nothing, Trump suporter will either not hear about this or only hear about how fake it is. Trump obviously should in jail for so many things but this won't happen. You know, cause the "both side are the same anyway so I don't vote".

Bolton's problem isn't one of his word lacking value, it's that his ideas about diplomacy and international law are stupid and dumb. So I'm sure the information in his book is accurate. I am of the opinion though that every interviewer needs to ask him, "Why didn't you testify and give us this information then?"

Honestly it wouldn't have mattered. The evidence was already overwhelming, every single person who could believe Trump should have been impeached (and then gone straight to jail) was convinced long ago, everybody else would have just ignored this, since Bolton is a well known liberal/socialist /s.

I really hope when all this is over Barr goes to Jail for treason or something like that, it's insane the contempt he has for the law.

 

[Agema]

I mean its John Bolton. Much as I believe Trump is selling the country for re-election, take what Bolton says with a asteroid of salt.

I don't have much time for John Bolton's politics, but I also have had no particular reason to believe he's particularly dishonest. In fact, I think one of the reasons he may be particularly dislikable is that he speaks his mind without so much concern about people's feelings.

Of course Bolton was fine with all those things when Trump still had a fancy job for him. He knew what to expect when Trump asked him and only started finding it an issue when he was fired.

If I can respond to this in a much more general sense, I think this is unfair to a lot of officials. Agreeing to serve under an abysmal leader can be an act of deep public service and duty: the knowledge that things are going to be bad, but it will be best for the country if some competent people stick around, do their best, minimise the damage and even score some "wins". One could take Fauci: he knows Trump is a clusterfuck, but he just digs in and sticks to his job, says what he needs to say.

To bring it back to Bolton, I don't mean to paint him with a halo, but just to note he might have his virtues. Bolton, for all his cynicism, national aggression and ruthlessness, might have a strong sense of duty to his nation and be genuinely offended by corruption.

* * *

Actually, just to note some other sheer insanity, apparently Trump had this 2019 meeting where he asked Xi Jinping to aid his re-election. Let's be clear on this: Trump is in the middle of waging a furious assault on China over economic matters, and then appeals to the Chinese premier to help his re-election. Uh, really?

I suppose I am not a businessman or politician, and may be naive about a world where people professionally wage ruthless war against each other, but then go back to the golf club and happily chew the fat over a glass of scotch because their conflict is just business. And perhaps that is Trump's experience. But I can't help but feel that will get nowhere against people like Xi Jinping and Vladimir Putin, or any leader that is actually motivated by national interest.

 

[stroopwafel]

Really interested in the book and I'm going to read it but Bolton has been a highly unpleasant warmonger since the Bush days and a stark advocate of interventionism, American exceptionalism and regime change. Even the U.S. military dislikes him for his frugal knowledge and theoretical understanding of military action without having any actual experience himself(like pretty much any morally bankrupt political leader). Bolton also played a really insidious role in the Iraq invasion and he also wanted to convince Trump to go to war with Iran during the Hormuz strait debacle.

So Bolton condemning Trump is a bit like a war criminal condemning a liar and a cheat. Why Trump ever trusted this snake is beyond me.

 

[Hawki]

New book by former Trump adviser contains damning claims

President Trump has responded to leaked excerpts of a new book written by one of his former senior advisers by calling him “wacko” and a “sick puppy.”

www.news.com.au

Little preview if you're interested.

 

[Hades]

So Bolton condemning Trump is a bit like a war criminal condemning a liar and a cheat. Why Trump ever trusted this snake is beyond me.

I think it has to do with legitimacy. Trump is not the outsider to the elites he claims himself to be, but he is an elite from the business world intruding on the elites in the political world. Its also fairly obvious that he and his cronies are primarily interested in politics to further their personal financial interests. Bolton might not grant any moral legitimacy since he's Bolton but his presence might have put traditional Republicans at ease with the thought that at least someone in Trump's inner circle is concerned about the country over his personal bank account. I think Bolton and also some others like Mathis were always meant as an olive branche towards actual Republicans.

 

[Specter Von Baren]

I have NEVER heard this particular variant of the expression before, and I REALLY want to try to remember this one, because the image is really striking XD

Have you heard the one of "Don't so much take it with a pinch of salt but a handful of pepper."?

 

[tstorm823]

Here's a question I've never pondered until just now: can a lie be classified? If someone reveals information that would be classified if it were true, but the statement is fiction, would the White House be able to remove that content? Trump still doesn't want this book out, but it's apparently been thoroughly checked to not reveal any officially classified information. Should we then assume that anything said that could be classified is therefore inaccurate?

 

[Chimpzy]

Have you heard the one of "Don't so much take it with a pinch of salt but a handful of pepper."?

No, but seems a missed opportunity to instead go for the much more topical "Don't so much take it with a pinch of salt but a faceful of pepper spray"

 

[lil devils x]

Oh I doubt Bolton actually thinks what Trump is doing is wrong. Bolton isn't even pro-democracy, he's for full on dictatorship. He's simply salty he isn't in power anymore, and if baby Bolton can't have power, no one can. He'll give Democrats the talking points and debate fodder they want and collect handsome fees from talk shows, appearances and sales, all out of spite because Donny cast him aside while Bolton is 1000% convinced he's the smartest man in the country.

If that were the case though, he would have still been in office since according to the testimony, it was him vocally opposing Trump repeatedly that was happening long before being let go so likely is what actually lead to him being let go. I am sure Trump would like you to believe that this is out of spite so that people will ignore it, but Trump literally says that about everyone who leaves, and everyone who leaves is telling us the same thing, so it makes much more sense for Trump to be lying than the piles of Trump's "best people" who are all saying the same things about Trump. I have never liked Bolton or his politics, however, we have no reason to believe this is inaccurate, as other's have already testified under oath what Bolton said behind closed doors about Trump's dealings prior to Trump deciding to get rid of Bolton. If he just wanted to go along with Trump, he would still be in his administration. This isn't really an " after the fact" as what was testified to already let us know it was happening long before he left.

 

[lil devils x]

I mean, Bolton is a well known liberal/socialist propagandist /s

But this will change literally nothing, Trump supporter will either not hear about this or only hear about how fake it is. Trump obviously should in jail for so many things but this won't happen. You know, cause the "both side are the same anyway so I don't vote".


Honestly it wouldn't have mattered. The evidence was already overwhelming, every single person who could believe Trump should have been impeached (and then gone straight to jail) was convinced long ago, everybody else would have just ignored this, since Bolton is a well known liberal/socialist /s.

I really hope when all this is over Barr goes to Jail for treason or something like that, it's insane the contempt he has for the law.

It really is insane though how so many of Trump's "Best People" can say the exact same things about Trump, but his supporters STILL claim everyone is lying except for Trump. Trump has told more than 18,000+ lies publicly since taking office, he lies every time he opens his mouth, promotes debunked conspiracies right and left, yet Trump worshippers continue to fall in line and defend him no matter what he does.

 

[Gordon_4]

Here's a question I've never pondered until just now: can a lie be classified? If someone reveals information that would be classified if it were true, but the statement is fiction, would the White House be able to remove that content? Trump still doesn't want this book out, but it's apparently been thoroughly checked to not reveal any officially classified information. Should we then assume that anything said that could be classified is therefore inaccurate?

The only way I can see them letting an inaccuracy through, short of super provable libel, would be that the only way to correct them would involve revealing classified information. I'm sure there's a way with that but its the only scenario I can personally envisage where a blatant inaccuracy could get a free ride.