Subverse "apologize" for allowing known racist youtube to cover their game

[SilentPony]

The absolute state of porn game developers and gamers

Its a shame the alt right took the concept of space pimping and fucking alien babes with 3 space boobs and turned it into something gross and perverse. Now you can't even enjoy Mass Effect character humping each other without some dickless white dude complaining about how there are too many brown people in the Ultramarines. And shame on StudioFOW and all the porn studios for losing sight of their mission; to bring 3D porn to teens and gamers all over the world, not to pander to right wing shut-ins who think the equator people are gonna steal their women, and that by massively funding a space sex simulator they're somehow sticking it(meaning their penis) to the man(in a no-homo way, 'cause you know...right wing).

 

[CaitSeith]

The makers of sci-fi sex game Subverse apologized after teaming up with a racist YouTuber, then backtracked

An awkward 'sorry-not-sorry' from the creators of one of Kickstarter's 16th most-funded video game project.

www.pcgamer.com

Honestly I am not surprised to see StudioFOW throw in their lot with Arch to give him coverage of their game since it sticks it to the bland if at least socially conscious corporate world, especially since Subverse had an ad that took a stab at Sony.

And good on pcgamer locking comments before Arch's supporters can fester like the CoD video on letting players be nonbinary.

So they apologized and then they took it back. Nothing lost, nothing gained. Definitely a non-issue.

Remember this game was funded on the principle of owning the left for their implied prudishness

LOL. Why do the supporters need games? They are already living in a fantasy outside of reality.

 

[Gyrobot]

Its a shame the alt right took the concept of space pimping and fucking alien babes with 3 space boobs and turned it into something gross and perverse. Now you can't even enjoy Mass Effect character humping each other without some dickless white dude complaining about how there are too many brown people in the Ultramarines. And shame one StudioFOW and all the porn studios for losing sight of their mission; to bring 3D porn to teens and gamers all over the world, not to pander to right wing shut-ins who think the equator people are gonna steal their women, and that by massively funding a space sex simulator they're somehow sticking it(meaning their penis) to the man(in a no-homo way, 'cause you know...right wing).

Problem is companies these days have a policy of mass appeal and appeasement over standing their ground and telling the critics to go take a stick and shove it.

Plus porn games also have the issue of being even worse at monetization than Battlefront on the management front that even the most greedy exec would think is poor business acumen. See Breeding Season as the reason why no AAA want to make porn games via subsidiaries.

 

[Trunkage]

40k is one of those things I had passing interest in but never actually got into so I dunno what to say on that front. From what I heard 40k human women are used like cows or something right? Forced to breed to keep the human race alive or something? If you think of it in those terms I guess each woman can give you like 20+ soldiers in the long run so I guess it makes sense in that setting to not have them fighting because even if with body mods ensuring they're equal to men why use 1 unit of fighting when you could get 20 units out of it. I guess I can see em fighting if they're trying to survive and are pushed to the brink of death but then again this brink of death would have to take place over a long enough period where you'd take women and have time to train them and not put them in the breeding program, which I don't think is how dire cataclysmic events occur most of the time. I can more easily see such a thing happening so quick they would have no time to train any new fighting hands.


But yeah this is my super layman's understanding of that argument, I could be missing a ton of minor points for and against so take it for what it is.


edit: What if you had a granny squad? Where post-menopausal women are taught to fight? Maybe make em snipers or something? I guess that could work, but again I dunno how all the mechanics of this world really operate. Maybe they're too beat up by that point to be able to fight or maybe they somehow negated menopause or something with their space tech.

Some of the space marine live thousands of years due to genetic modification. I don't know if space marines even have a granny phase.

Arch's point was that women are weaker and couldn't handle genetic modification... despite tha fact only about 10% of men surviving fhe process

 

[SilentPony]

Arch's point was that women are weaker and couldn't handle genetic modification... despite tha fact only about 10% of men surviving fhe process

From what I can gather Arch is old guard 40k, been around for decades. But so am I, so I can firmly tell him to go fuck himself he has no understanding of 40k lore.
Even back when the lore was women couldn't be space marines because certain geneseed required the male adolescents body to fully develop, something about needing a certain amount of testosterone. But that's A. bad sci fi, and B. Old lore and its become an enshrined 'No girls allowed' sign that most of us just sigh at as a relic of 80s British culture.
Nowadays, and Im guessing Arch hates it, but there's a new breed of Marine and they've done a sorta soft reboot of a lot of the genetic flaws/hiccups Marines had, because it was getting a little out of control with dragon humans and werewolves and goat marines, etc...
So now everyone is back to square 1 not a furry Marine, and there have been hints that the next step for Marines will be fixing it so women can become Marines, both in lore they've hinted and GW openly says that if they think it'll make money they'll do it. And there is momentum building because players like Arch, old guard who are too conservative/sexist/racists to allow sci fi fake women 40,000 years from now to be genetically engineered werewolf space vikings because it diminishes their IRL masculinity, are basically being uninvited from the hobby. And there has been a serious outreach to women and girls recently to try and get them into the hobby, and if enough little girls want toy models of women as space marines GW ain't about to turn down the sales, even if they have to Star Trek their way to it lore wise.

Point being Arch doesn't seem to understand even the out of date sexist reasons why there are no female space marines and instead used his IRL sexist disregard for women as the reason.

 

[Gyrobot]

From what I can gather Arch is old guard 40k, been around for decades. But so am I, so I can firmly tell him to go fuck himself he has no understanding of 40k lore.
Even back when the lore was women couldn't be space marines because certain geneseed required the male adolescents body to fully develop, something about needing a certain amount of testosterone. But that's A. bad sci fi, and B. Old lore and its become an enshrined 'No girls allowed' sign that most of us just sigh at as a relic of 80s British culture.
Nowadays, and Im guessing Arch hates it, but there's a new breed of Marine and they've done a sorta soft reboot of a lot of the genetic flaws/hiccups Marines had, because it was getting a little out of control with dragon humans and werewolves and goat marines, etc...
So now everyone is back to square 1 not a furry Marine, and there have been hints that the next step for Marines will be fixing it so women can become Marines, both in lore they've hinted and GW openly says that if they think it'll make money they'll do it. And there is momentum building because players like Arch, old guard who are too conservative/sexist/racists to allow sci fi fake women 40,000 years from now to be genetically engineered werewolf space vikings because it diminishes their IRL masculinity, are basically being uninvited from the hobby. And there has been a serious outreach to women and girls recently to try and get them into the hobby, and if enough little girls want toy models of women as space marines GW ain't about to turn down the sales, even if they have to Star Trek their way to it lore wise.

Point being Arch doesn't seem to understand even the out of date sexist reasons why there are no female space marines and instead used his IRL sexist disregard for women as the reason.

I thought this was thread was about Arch sponsoring a problematic porn game. Not Warhammer.

 

[BrawlMan]

I thought this was thread was about Arch sponsoring a problematic porn game. Not Warhammer.

After seeing @SilentPony post, I find it relevant to the situation. Just goes to show how much of an asshole Arch is and why he should not have been sponsored in the first place.

 

[Dreiko]

From what I can gather Arch is old guard 40k, been around for decades. But so am I, so I can firmly tell him to go fuck himself he has no understanding of 40k lore.
Even back when the lore was women couldn't be space marines because certain geneseed required the male adolescents body to fully develop, something about needing a certain amount of testosterone. But that's A. bad sci fi, and B. Old lore and its become an enshrined 'No girls allowed' sign that most of us just sigh at as a relic of 80s British culture.
Nowadays, and Im guessing Arch hates it, but there's a new breed of Marine and they've done a sorta soft reboot of a lot of the genetic flaws/hiccups Marines had, because it was getting a little out of control with dragon humans and werewolves and goat marines, etc...
So now everyone is back to square 1 not a furry Marine, and there have been hints that the next step for Marines will be fixing it so women can become Marines, both in lore they've hinted and GW openly says that if they think it'll make money they'll do it. And there is momentum building because players like Arch, old guard who are too conservative/sexist/racists to allow sci fi fake women 40,000 years from now to be genetically engineered werewolf space vikings because it diminishes their IRL masculinity, are basically being uninvited from the hobby. And there has been a serious outreach to women and girls recently to try and get them into the hobby, and if enough little girls want toy models of women as space marines GW ain't about to turn down the sales, even if they have to Star Trek their way to it lore wise.

Point being Arch doesn't seem to understand even the out of date sexist reasons why there are no female space marines and instead used his IRL sexist disregard for women as the reason.

Not sure if I'm reading this right but it sounds like you're saying he's right about his assessment and in the future (not now) it may change because they want to make girls play this game, or something like that?

I think terminology like "soft reboot" is a sneaky way of going around the fact that women still can't turn into marines apparently. It's an underhanded way of going around the fact that there's not been an actual reboot but you personally opine that the company is headed in that direction, which is not something that should influence your view of hard lore.

It doesn't matter how you feel about the lore being sexist or old or what have you, focusing on those bits is besides the point. Either they can turn into one or they can't. If they can't, saying that they shouldn't is an act of protecting the entirety of a universe that you should want preserved if you are to call yourself a fan.


And I dunno, if they can turn into dragon hybrids and stuff, losing that stuff but gaining just plain old women is super lame imo. I think it's extremely lazy to call wanting to keep all that cool-sounding stuff sexist lol.

Some of the space marine live thousands of years due to genetic modification. I don't know if space marines even have a granny phase.

Arch's point was that women are weaker and couldn't handle genetic modification... despite tha fact only about 10% of men surviving fhe process

Oh wow, so this is super high fantasy then.

And apparently this is something hardcoded in the original lore, that people now think is bad, like the Orc thing in DnD. I just think it's extremely lazy and uncharitable to attribute wanting to keep the old lore as-is to sexism. To me that's just the normal thing a fan does. And yeah if you wanna call this game sexist, that still means you must like its sexism if you are a fan. There's no conflict here lol.

 

[Iron]

Not sure if I'm reading this right but it sounds like you're saying he's right about his assessment and in the future (not now) it may change because they want to make girls play this game, or something like that?

I think terminology like "soft reboot" is a sneaky way of going around the fact that women still can't turn into marines apparently. It's an underhanded way of going around the fact that there's not been an actual reboot but you personally opine that the company is headed in that direction, which is not something that should influence your view of hard lore.

It doesn't matter how you feel about the lore being sexist or old or what have you, focusing on those bits is besides the point. Either they can turn into one or they can't. If they can't, saying that they shouldn't is an act of protecting the entirety of a universe that you should want preserved if you are to call yourself a fan.


And I dunno, if they can turn into dragon hybrids and stuff, losing that stuff but gaining just plain old women is super lame imo. I think it's extremely lazy to call wanting to keep all that cool-sounding stuff sexist lol.

I personally wouldn't like women space-marines. I'm good with the adepta sororitas. I like the juxtaposition. Some groups are masculine, others are feminine.

 

[Dreiko]

I personally wouldn't like women space-marines. I'm good with the adepta sororitas. I like the juxtaposition. Some groups are masculine, others are feminine.

Angel maiden race? Cool!

 

[Iron]

Angel maiden race? Cool!

Their lore is also pretty nice. They're pretty popular as well. I think it's a mistake if GW drops this and just makes Space Marines both sexes.

 

[SilentPony]

SNIP

Apologies, I didn't make the lore vs Arch clear enough. The Discord posts and Youtube transcripts show Arch saying women can't be space marines because they're not strong enough to make it. But that's not the lore. The lore is that the genetic implants used don't work with female anatomy. The fault isn't in the women, its in the science of the post-human gene editing. But Arch seems to imply women could in theory become space marines, but none have been strong enough yet, when female strength was never the issue.

And the reason I call it old lore is because it is. Its a start-up company's marketing to teenage boys in 1980s Britain, who didn't want to play as women. And then they came up with the lore later to justify the lack of female models. The lore is now 30 years older, way more enhanced and deep and thought out, ranging hundreds of novels, thousands of short stories, codexes, movies, games, tv shows, etc...But they're still clinging to this one old piece of lore because some old guard 40k fans liked the idea of "No Girls Allowed" when they joined, and that's not really a viable strategy anymore.

 

[Dreiko]

Apologies, I didn't make the lore vs Arch clear enough. The Discord posts and Youtube transcripts show Arch saying women can't be space marines because they're not strong enough to make it. But that's not the lore. The lore is that the genetic implants used don't work with female anatomy. The fault isn't in the women, its in the science of the post-human gene editing. But Arch seems to imply women could in theory become space marines, but none have been strong enough yet, when female strength was never the issue.

And the reason I call it old lore is because it is. Its a start-up company's marketing to teenage boys in 1980s Britain, who didn't want to play as women. And then they came up with the lore later to justify the lack of female models. The lore is now 30 years older, way more enhanced and deep and thought out, ranging hundreds of novels, thousands of short stories, codexes, movies, games, tv shows, etc...But they're still clinging to this one old piece of lore because some old guard 40k fans liked the idea of "No Girls Allowed" when they joined, and that's not really a viable strategy anymore.

Hmm, I guess you can look at the science being imperfect, or the women being too weak to endure the imperfect science. I think both interpretations are equally plausible here. But yeah if you improve the science somehow it makes sense to let em turn into marines as well though for sure.


And I think they're doing the same thing they were doing back then in their marketing, they just are trying to appeal to teenage (and older) girls who don't wanna play as boys, only, they're not a startup any more, so they lack that excuse.


But yeah I see, there's definitely an argument to be made here to allow the technology to evolve. I hope if they do go that direction they at least write a cool way of achieving that. Though those angel maidens don't look too bad to me lol.

 

[Gordon_4]

Not sure if I'm reading this right but it sounds like you're saying he's right about his assessment and in the future (not now) it may change because they want to make girls play this game, or something like that?

I think terminology like "soft reboot" is a sneaky way of going around the fact that women still can't turn into marines apparently. It's an underhanded way of going around the fact that there's not been an actual reboot but you personally opine that the company is headed in that direction, which is not something that should influence your view of hard lore.

It doesn't matter how you feel about the lore being sexist or old or what have you, focusing on those bits is besides the point. Either they can turn into one or they can't. If they can't, saying that they shouldn't is an act of protecting the entirety of a universe that you should want preserved if you are to call yourself a fan.


And I dunno, if they can turn into dragon hybrids and stuff, losing that stuff but gaining just plain old women is super lame imo. I think it's extremely lazy to call wanting to keep all that cool-sounding stuff sexist lol.


Oh wow, so this is super high fantasy then.

And apparently this is something hardcoded in the original lore, that people now think is bad, like the Orc thing in DnD. I just think it's extremely lazy and uncharitable to attribute wanting to keep the old lore as-is to sexism. To me that's just the normal thing a fan does. And yeah if you wanna call this game sexist, that still means you must like its sexism if you are a fan. There's no conflict here lol.

Warhammer 40K is.......well it’s something alright. It’s Lore so far as I have observed is really wide. There is literally something and someone for everyone but it’s also really, really silly. Like on the surface it seems like concentrated awesome but there’s a weird undercurrent of wink wink nudge nudge self awareness in some of it depending on the writer.

Mind you I despise some of the core lore requirements, but it’s got a hell of an aesthetic.

 

[Trunkage]

Angel maiden race? Cool!

Yeah, they are. I also liked their faith based magic is different origin from others

Their lore is also pretty nice. They're pretty popular as well. I think it's a mistake if GW drops this and just makes Space Marines both sexes.

why would they disband the Sister of Battle? There is probably enough demand for both.

Plus you don’t really need to change Soace Marine models. They’re all being genetically modified. They’re probably should look similar. Maybe some more ‘feminine’ looking faces

Also, due to lore reasons, I wouldn’t mind if femMarine were seen as heretical.

 

[Trunkage]

I thought this was thread was about Arch sponsoring a problematic porn game. Not Warhammer.

Sorry man, Arch is a weirdo

Also, this is normal

 

[Iron]

Yeah, they are. I also liked their faith based magic is different origin from others

why would they disband the Sister of Battle? There is probably enough demand for both.

Plus you don’t really need to change Soace Marine models. They’re all being genetically modified. They’re probably should look similar. Maybe some more ‘feminine’ looking faces

Also, due to lore reasons, I wouldn’t mind if femMarine were seen as heretical.

I think sisters of battle were created to sell female models that aren't guardsmen. Female space-marines would fill that niche.

 

[Gordon_4]

Fuck it, Warhammer thread. Here’s “If the Emperor had a Text to Speech Device” laugh and enjoy.

 

[Trunkage]

I think sisters of battle were created to sell female models that aren't guardsmen. Female space-marines would fill that niche.

Maybe. I think they’ve evolved into their own thing. The biggest issue is that space marine are so popular, they drown everything else. A lot of leaderboards are dominated by them, so GW makes more. I don’t think SoB have had a new model in 10 years. A lot of races are like that.

 

[Thaluikhain]

I think sisters of battle were created to sell female models that aren't guardsmen. Female space-marines would fill that niche.

They didn't really sell female models that were guardsmen, beyond 1 Catachan special weapon, 1 tanith and 2 last chancers (only the first of those maybe being around when sisters came out), and later 2 female commissars (1 special edition, 1 you can still buy).

With the exception of the escher range, some inquisitors from the witch-hunters range (which they discontinued, they kept the male ones) and some figures from Mordheim, they hardly ever sold any female humans that weren't sisters.

I'm opposed to female marines (unless it's new primaris marines, I guess), because it's been established since forever that marines are male only. Yeah, maybe that was stupid (less so if the idea was originally warrior monks in space), but retroactively changing that would be like sticking C'tan in, making the Machine God the Void Dragon and giving everyone gravity guns and Centurion suits since forever and just not mentioning it.

Maybe. I think they’ve evolved into their own thing. The biggest issue is that space marine are so popular, they drown everything else. A lot of leaderboards are dominated by them, so GW makes more. I don’t think SoB have had a new model in 10 years. A lot of races are like that.

About a year ago that was true, Since them the SoB have an entire new plastic range, with all of the old models (unless you count preachers and missionaries) no longer available.

The new plastic are technically nice, but GW has gone away from the old days of having seperate arms and legs and torsos and doing what you want with them, nowdays it's all part 36 and 37 and 38 must go together, you can assemble this model with your choice of two guns if you are lucky. Also, they were high heels and like walking on tiptoe so you can't stick them to the bases.