2019-2020 coronavirus pandemic (Vaccination 2021 Edition)
- Thread starter McElroy
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Yeah, it literally did.
Also, case numbers don't matter to begin with. It's about hospitalization counts.
Good discussion on the dumb messaging about having to continuing masking after vaccinations. Great information about how closing schools is extremely asinine.
Fact Checker: WHO did not say PCR tests grossly inflate positive test numbers
Yeah, the words I'm looking at here look very different than what I said.
I didn't say anything about grossly inflating anything.
Changing test methodology that should lower the number of cases does not mean that the cases were grossly inflated.
It just means that false-positives weren't being ruled out, and now they are (to a greater degree).
The fact checker says numbers shouldn't change whether grossly or not.
"This is not new information. This is essentially a reminder from the WHO to testing laboratories," said Jonathan Jarry, a science communicator with the McGill University Office for Science and Society. "This notice is not an admission that the PCR test for COVID-19 does not work or is wildly inaccurate."
WHO didn't say PCR tests cause many false positives
A conservative news site mischaracterized a message from the World Health Organization, claiming that the United Nationswww.politifact.com
No it doesn't. Neither does the source
But I can't prove a negative, other than telling you to read it and the source in full, and note that it never says "the numbers shouldn't change"
So can you prove that either says 'the numbers shouldn't change"?
The "fact-checker" just takes issue with the claim that "the WHO admits the cases were grossly inflated", which they didn't. They didn't "admit" that. They just sent a memo cautioning against false negatives.
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From your source:
"Purpose of this notice: clarify information previously provided by WHO."
Exactly what dude said...
"This is not new information. This is essentially a reminder from the WHO to testing laboratories," said Jonathan Jarry, a science communicator with the McGill University Office for Science and Society. "This notice is not an admission that the PCR test for COVID-19 does not work or is wildly inaccurate."
The WHO guidance is a reminder to follow the PCR instructions properly. Correct instructions have already gone out, and they are being restated.
Is there actual evidence the PCR tests were not being done properly in the USA? Random claims from urologists don't amount to a hill of beans.
The fact checker points out that even false positives from over-cycling would be "rare". This also exists with the context that if the swab is poorly performed, it is vastly more likely to cause a false negative. And that many people are likely to be taking a lateral flow test, which is well known to produce a much higher proportion of false negatives. So cases are likely to be systemically under-reported more than over-reported.
So all in all, this is a heap of nothing.
The only part of that that contradicts what I said was when I editorialized and said "they switched the rules", when they didn't, they just "released guidance" that "clarified" information. The result of which should result in fewer false-positives, and thus, fewer cases.
Given that these tests aren't killing anybody, who the hell cares? People mostly talk about the 400,000 deaths, not the case count.
It entirely depends on the numbers being used but single PCR test positives if they were being included will obviously lead to higher numbers than testing to eliminate false positives.
What evidence do you have for that - both, 'they switched rules as soon as...', and 'it's good for Biden'?
OMG DUDE, THERE'S NOT GOING TO BE FEWER CASES.
They're only reiterating how to do the tests properly, which they already did BEFORE.
If someone reiterated to you to clean your workstation at work at the end of the day, your workstation wouldn't get any cleaner because you're already cleaning it everyday.
The article is literally meaningless to pretty much everyone.
And again, case numbers don't matter to begin with. 20 kids testing positive is meaningless for example while a vulnerable person going to the hospital from infection is meaningful.
See above
Based on the UK NHS data they've been taking 1 positive PCR as indication of an infectionOMG DUDE, THERE'S NOT GOING TO BE FEWER CASES.
They're only reiterating how to do the tests properly, which they already did BEFORE.
If someone reiterated to you to clean your workstation at work at the end of the day, your workstation wouldn't get any cleaner because you're already cleaning it everyday.
The article is literally meaningless to pretty much everyone.
And again, case numbers don't matter to begin with. 20 kids testing positive is meaningless for example while a vulnerable person going to the hospital from infection is meaningful.
See above
Test results for COVID-19
Find out what your NHS COVID-19 rapid lateral flow test result means.
www.nhs.uk
I'd imagine conditions are similar in the USA due to the desire to save tests or test more people rather than doubling up.
The CDC site for the USA doesn't say take a second test just seemingly says if you test positive to take action not if you test positive get a 2nd test to be clear.
"They switched rules" is just my editorializing, and isn't accurate.
It's good for Biden, in that this "reminder", if followed, will lower the number of new cases, which media outlets may take as a sign that the virus is going away under Biden's watchful eye so they might praise him for it.
Why would they remind people to do it the correct way, unless they had some reason to believe that it wasn't being done correctly?
Yep, that's corroborated by the Doctor who authored the tweet.
Tennat? Baker? Capaldi? Tell me it's not McGann
(slight edit on your quote to make a joke. Forgive me.)
This has been a thing for months. The statement from WHO is by no means [ulr=[URL]https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/29/health/coronavirus-testing.html]the[/URL] first time this has come up[/url]. To take the meat out of that link since it's NYT and paywalled if you can't get through it, a virologist in August was shocked they were doing PCR tests at 40 cycles, thinking that too likely to return positive results for non-infectious people and return positive results for people who had gotten over the virus months prior. She suggested 30-35 should be the cut-off to call someone's test negative.
To be fair, the CDC has recommended 33 as that number, but the CDC has also recommended against large economic shutdowns in all but the most dire circumstances, so it's pretty obvious that states and private entities have been ignoring CDC guidance the whole time.
To be fair again, there's not a whole lot of downside to a false positive. If they're deathly ill, it's hardly a false positive, and telling a healthy person to quarantine for two weeks isn't the most horrible thing in the whole world. It's, at worst, overly-cautious. And like, it's not as though we're reporting more infected people than actual, there are certainly real infections many times over the measured positives tests.
But it's not the total case count that matters. It's the death toll. And if you combine hyper-sensitive testing that can return a positive with a fragment of virus, and reporting guidelines that require every person who tests positive and dies to be recorded as a covid-death, you can no longer have a reference for how many people are actually dying of covid. Are 4000 people dying of covid a day, or has 50% of the country been infected at some point and nobody is dying of covid? The truth is certainly somewhere between the two, but there's no way of knowing where, given the methods they've chosen to measure with.
That doesn't have anything to do with the WHO's restating of how to do a PCR test.Based on the UK NHS data they've been taking 1 positive PCR as indication of an infection
Test results for COVID-19
Find out what your NHS COVID-19 rapid lateral flow test result means.
I'd imagine conditions are similar in the USA due to the desire to save tests or test more people rather than doubling up.
The CDC site for the USA doesn't say take a second test just seemingly says if you test positive to take action not if you test positive get a 2nd test to be clear.
Why do parents remind their son/daughter about some basic thing when they're 30/40 with a family of their own?
By the way, case numbers already started going down in the US and UK before this WHO restatement. I'm sure you'll think it's some world wide conspiracy against Trump when it's just, you know, the much more likely explanation that more people wanted to and got tested during the holiday period so they could be more confident in their safety celebrating the holidays.