[VID] The Escapist forums moderation is wildly inconsistent (now with data!)
- Thread starter RiseofDaWolfie
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Simple solution: don't break the rules, or anything that could come close to breaking the rules - you know?
You can sit there and count warnings, and debate whether or not a ban is/isn't justified, etc, or you could just... be polite?
Works for me
You can sit there and count warnings, and debate whether or not a ban is/isn't justified, etc, or you could just... be polite?
Works for me
- Mar 13, 2020
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Well, all I know is it's not my job or anyone else's job in moderation to make you all "better people" as a former mod once said. Still can't believe they thought that was their job. Noble in thought, but you have to be on the highest of horses to think anyone's gonna be receptive to that.
We're here to help foster a positive, fun and inclusive community. If you're not actively helping to contribute to that vision, then this probably isn't the place for you.
Thanks! Concerning moderation itt specifically, its good to see it not get nuked instantly.
I don't get it.
Look, Saelune is a kindred spirit who fought for the same principles I do. Our methods varied, but our same goal was the equal representation for all genders, races, sexualities, and ideologies.
Saelune was being fought, mocked, and targeted. And Saelune and a few others like Lil Devils and I fought side by side. Eventually, the ban hammer did fall, because Saelune refused to kowtow and fought back with everything possible.
And the hammer fell infinitely quicker than Houseman or Iron or others who were blatantly aggressive and spreading (ironically) fake news through this site. Personally, I am not a moderator, I didn't swear to uphold what is necessary to keep this peace in these forums. I thank the moderators who do that. I think Saelune could possibly be unbanned without those who did everything to make the situation untenable, but that is not exactly what this conversation is about. The fact that Saelune didn't make a video complaining about the Moderator's treatment also speaks volumes.
I'm sure certain parties will want to make the situation about how they were aggrieved unjustly. If the moderators or Nick wanted, I'm sure they could provide receipts and chances given to Houseman (as they could for Saelune, most likely), which would disprove said theories. However, I think we should make it about something else.
The forum feels better without his toxicity. Read: I didn't say his views. I said his toxicity. It has nothing to do with being conservative or pro-police. Spector Von Baren, Dwarvenhobble, Gorfias and others on this forum have conservative views. They express them in ways that even don't come close to the toxicity of Houseman. I WANT differing views. I want constructive conversations with people I don't see eye to eye with. Because I might not see eye to eye, but there might be a bridge that is formed that we can get to a more tolerant place.
Houseman never tried for tolerance. Is any of that in the vid? Or is he just, again, unjust aggrieved? And we should feel bad because his freedom of speech which only pertains to Governmental Expression and not in any way means he can go to a private company/business and do whatever he wants... was still upheld because once again, Freedom of Speech only pertains to speaking out against the government or in public save for a few things that were deemed a danger to the public.
Saelune was being fought, mocked, and targeted. And Saelune and a few others like Lil Devils and I fought side by side. Eventually, the ban hammer did fall, because Saelune refused to kowtow and fought back with everything possible.
And the hammer fell infinitely quicker than Houseman or Iron or others who were blatantly aggressive and spreading (ironically) fake news through this site. Personally, I am not a moderator, I didn't swear to uphold what is necessary to keep this peace in these forums. I thank the moderators who do that. I think Saelune could possibly be unbanned without those who did everything to make the situation untenable, but that is not exactly what this conversation is about. The fact that Saelune didn't make a video complaining about the Moderator's treatment also speaks volumes.
I'm sure certain parties will want to make the situation about how they were aggrieved unjustly. If the moderators or Nick wanted, I'm sure they could provide receipts and chances given to Houseman (as they could for Saelune, most likely), which would disprove said theories. However, I think we should make it about something else.
The forum feels better without his toxicity. Read: I didn't say his views. I said his toxicity. It has nothing to do with being conservative or pro-police. Spector Von Baren, Dwarvenhobble, Gorfias and others on this forum have conservative views. They express them in ways that even don't come close to the toxicity of Houseman. I WANT differing views. I want constructive conversations with people I don't see eye to eye with. Because I might not see eye to eye, but there might be a bridge that is formed that we can get to a more tolerant place.
Houseman never tried for tolerance. Is any of that in the vid? Or is he just, again, unjust aggrieved? And we should feel bad because his freedom of speech which only pertains to Governmental Expression and not in any way means he can go to a private company/business and do whatever he wants... was still upheld because once again, Freedom of Speech only pertains to speaking out against the government or in public save for a few things that were deemed a danger to the public.
You're praising Saelune and condemning Houseman for toxicity in the same post. Saelune told people to go kill themselves, mocked one person's dead family member, started numerous callout threads and drove at least two people to leave the forum. Her reign of terror in the Wild West forum was truly something to behold.
As far I'm aware, Houseman didn't do anything like that.
or,
I also said that Nick and Moderators could provide receipts on how many chances they gave both Houseman and Saelune.
I also mentioned that Saelune was targeted a great deal by members of this forum, and Saelune fought back. Sometimes, it was preemptively.
If this matter is just going to be about how you personally feel about Saelune and not read what I'm saying, that's fine. But then the conversation is over before it even begun.
Saelune mainly posted in Biden's confirmation thread. If what you're saying is there, there's only 132 posts. I did a search for Saelune's name and Kill, and die. Nothing came up. I did a search for your name and kill, and your last post came up. So... Ok.
I'll even allow that Saelune did that in v1. I don't have a complete mental record of all the post that happened there. But even if that is the case... that's forum's v1. This is v2.
More importantly, say if Saelune said that. It's not good. Something I wouldn't do. I admit that. I don't know if it occurred, but that's neither here nor there for this situation.
Comparing that to the level of toxicity that grew dissention in America to the level of January 6th is really no true comparison. One earns a "Damn, uncalled for" and the other gets the FBI looking through our forums to see if we're housing (I didn't even mean for that pun) dissenters.
Actually, I said Saelune was a kindred spirit who fought for the same ideals and that our methods varied.
I also said that Nick and Moderators could provide receipts on how many chances they gave both Houseman and Saelune.
I also mentioned that Saelune was targeted a great deal by members of this forum, and Saelune fought back. Sometimes, it was preemptively.
If this matter is just going to be about how you personally feel about Saelune and not read what I'm saying, that's fine. But then the conversation is over before it even begun.
Saelune mainly posted in Biden's confirmation thread. If what you're saying is there, there's only 132 posts. I did a search for Saelune's name and Kill, and die. Nothing came up. I did a search for your name and kill, and your last post came up. So... Ok.
I'll even allow that Saelune did that in v1. I don't have a complete mental record of all the post that happened there. But even if that is the case... that's forum's v1. This is v2.
More importantly, say if Saelune said that. It's not good. Something I wouldn't do. I admit that. I don't know if it occurred, but that's neither here nor there for this situation.
Comparing that to the level of toxicity that grew dissention in America to the level of January 6th is really no true comparison. One earns a "Damn, uncalled for" and the other gets the FBI looking through our forums to see if we're housing (I didn't even mean for that pun) dissenters.
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Well, he does have a nice speaking voice. Kind of Captain Holt from Brooklyn 99 meets William Shatner. But that music, oh my God, that music made me more angry than anything in the video.
Anyway, I'm going to be the guy who says it, do we really need another Houseman thread? We already have one that sits at 12 pages, couldn't they be merged?
Anyway, I'm going to be the guy who says it, do we really need another Houseman thread? We already have one that sits at 12 pages, couldn't they be merged?
Three minutes is three and a half minutes more than I'm willing to waste on that.
Saelune did not lie, gaslight or troll. Instead she was honest and consistent the whole time and tried to argue in good faith
But Saelune also did not believe in civility, expressly so, was easily provoked and quite willing to escalate. Of course that also made her a prime troll magnet and she was indeed targeted often. I would take her over Houseman any time of day but her behavior is still not something particularly conductive to a civil forum community and i can see reasons for a ban (I won't go through all the posts just to confirm it). I had the impression her behavior only got problematic after the Trump victory which she didn't took well (that is an understatement, she talked about suicide) and always hoped she would eventually get a grip on herself but alas that never happened.
I never had access to the Wild west forum but the idea was to not import vendettas from the old forum over here.
I also think i remember Wolfie and would thus be willing to assume he is indeed not a Houseman alt.
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Never went to the Wild West forum. Always sounded like the sort of cesspit that was never going to create much joy in the world.
Of course Houseman spent days preparing a 30 minute video because he's fuming about getting banned from a site with 20 people on it.
The forums are much nicer with saelune, houseman, and yoshi gone. They've been spreading drama for years. Good riddance, don't let the door hit you on the way out.
The forums are much nicer with saelune, houseman, and yoshi gone. They've been spreading drama for years. Good riddance, don't let the door hit you on the way out.
The examples I gave came from the V1 forum, but Saelune has been banned from the V2 forum as well. So it seems likely the bad behaviour continued. Unless she requested a ban, that could be possible.
I suspect the FBI have got bigger things to worry out than Houseman's posting history on the Escapist forum.
I really liked the Wild West forum. It was nice to be able to have conversations without the passive aggressiveness that was pervasive in the rest of the forum, particularly Religion and Politics. At times on the Escapist it seemed there were groups deliberately stalking members with high warning counts, like a pack of wolves going after wounded prey. That wasn't a factor in the Wild West forum. I also felt it helped to clear the air, and I revised my opinion of a few people after seeing them post there for a while.
The problem was that there were a bunch of people opposed to the Wild West forum who decided to intentionally make it as toxic as possible to get it deleted.
Oh to have the optimism that a functionally non-moderated space on the Internet was going to be a bastion of classy discourse. Blind fuckin' Pew could have seen that entire sub-forum was going to be fucking Chernobyl within a week.
It was a popular forum so obviously it must have held some appeal for a lot of people. If I remember rightly in terms of posts it was verging on beating the main forum.
Yeah because it was Grand Theft Auto in forum form. And as the sales of that long lost to edgefest bullshit game series have proven, when given the opportunity to misbehave in a virtually consequence free environment people will go from Zero to Cartmen in less than five seconds.
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