#094: Introductions

[monkeymangler]

I find it funny that the brooding angsty protagonist has become a JRPG cliche when it is pretty much exclusive to Final Fantasy and even then just Final Fantasy VIII. IIRC Cloud Strife's original characterization at the start of Final Fantasy VII was cocky and arrogant and a bit of a smart ass. He only got broody and angsty later on when he found out much of his life was a lie, which Square turned into his defining characteristic for some reason.

Well, Cecil in IV spent a good chunk of the game in an emo coma and Terra was there for much of VI. None were hitting the eyeliner and Dashboard Confessional quite like good ol' Squall Leonhart.

I'll give you Cecil, but I don't remember Terra being all that broody or angsty. Nevertheless we're still talking about a cliche that's exclusive to Final Fantasy being associated with all JRPGs.

Eh... Star Ocean has its share of emoness, as does .Hack. Depending on your choice of series, it might be harder to find a series that doesn't have that happen a lot.

 

[The_State]

Well, Cecil in IV spent a good chunk of the game in an emo coma and Terra was there for much of VI. None were hitting the eyeliner and Dashboard Confessional quite like good ol' Squall Leonhart.

I'll give you Cecil, but I don't remember Terra being all that broody or angsty. Nevertheless we're still talking about a cliche that's exclusive to Final Fantasy being associated with all JRPGs.

I just recently played through FFIV. I think Cecil was pretty even keel, aside from being upset that he was complicit in the slaughter of a village of innocents, or that the kingdom he fought for was going insane and turning completely evil, or that the woman he loved was stolen away from him by his best friend's turning his back on him and fighting alongside the enemy for no discernible reason, and of course the onset of a world-ending calamity. What I'm getting at here is that he had every reason and right to be a bit down about things. And he never fell into an "emo coma". He got to feeling a bit helpless while visiting a village that he, not a couple weeks prior, invaded and robbed of its most treasured possession. Dude did some bad shit for bad people and felt bad for doing it. There is nothing wrong with that. In fact, it's more consistent characterization than most characters receive in those sorts of situations.

 

[Kajin]

I love how they somehow manage to look like characters in their own right, specific final fantasy characters, and every JRPG character ever. All at the same time. It's the trifecta of character design parody.

 

[immortalfrieza]

I find it funny that the brooding angsty protagonist has become a JRPG cliche when it is pretty much exclusive to Final Fantasy and even then just Final Fantasy VIII. IIRC Cloud Strife's original characterization at the start of Final Fantasy VII was cocky and arrogant and a bit of a smart ass. He only got broody and angsty later on when he found out much of his life was a lie, which Square turned into his defining characteristic for some reason.

That's not exactly true. Even if they aren't the protagonists the brooding angsty character has always existed in some form or another in all media. Chances are anything that has a large enough cast has at least one and video games are no exception, it's just that Cloud and Squall are the ones that end up coming to mind to the fans where JRPGs are concerned.

I just recently played through FFIV. I think Cecil was pretty even keel, aside from being upset that he was complicit in the slaughter of a village of innocents, or that the kingdom he fought for was going insane and turning completely evil, or that the woman he loved was stolen away from him by his best friend's turning his back on him and fighting alongside the enemy for no discernible reason, and of course the onset of a world-ending calamity. What I'm getting at here is that he had every reason and right to be a bit down about things. And he never fell into an "emo coma". He got to feeling a bit helpless while visiting a village that he, not a couple weeks prior, invaded and robbed of its most treasured possession. Dude did some bad shit for bad people and felt bad for doing it. There is nothing wrong with that. In fact, it's more consistent characterization than most characters receive in those sorts of situations.

Don't you know? Any character especially if male cannot be sad for any reason and nor for any length of time whatsoever or they are emo, no matter how many and how extreme the justifications for doing so. Characters must always either be emotionally dead or in a near constant state of fury to not be considered emo.

That's an exaggeration, but not much of one. The fact is "emo" has become a pretty meaningless term that is slapped on any character that shows even the slightest sign of being sad at any time no matter how justified that is by the fans.

 

[KarmaTheAlligator]

My favorite bit of Squall's angst is when then arrive at Galbadia Garden and they're all in that little waiting room....Squall starts thinking about how people refer to dead people in the past tense, gets himself all worked up, then suddenly shatters the silence by shouting out "NO ONE'S GOING TO REFER TO ME IN THE PAST TENSE!!!" before running out of the room...leaving everyone there to just blink and say "......what the fuck?!"

What the hell? I don't remember this at all, but that's hilarious.

OT: Love how they went to Erin to discuss the situation, as if they assume she's the leader by virtue of not being cheerful like Rad.

 

[Bindal]

My favorite bit of Squall's angst is when then arrive at Galbadia Garden and they're all in that little waiting room....Squall starts thinking about how people refer to dead people in the past tense, gets himself all worked up, then suddenly shatters the silence by shouting out "NO ONE'S GOING TO REFER TO ME IN THE PAST TENSE!!!" before running out of the room...leaving everyone there to just blink and say "......what the fuck?!"

What the hell? I don't remember this at all, but that's hilarious.

OT: Love how they went to Erin to discuss the situation, as if they assume she's the leader by virtue of not being cheerful like Rad.

They basically had only to pick between Gunny and Erin as Rad isn't human and a wizard, which together is USUALLY not the leadrole in JRPGs - and we don't know what happened inbetween, they may have done the sensible thing and ASKED. Their Tifa-Counterpart does appear to be at least to some degree have common sense.

 

[The Great JT]

Holy shit, Spud the Carnie grew up and became a weeaboo.

 

[Canadamus Prime]

I find it funny that the brooding angsty protagonist has become a JRPG cliche when it is pretty much exclusive to Final Fantasy and even then just Final Fantasy VIII. IIRC Cloud Strife's original characterization at the start of Final Fantasy VII was cocky and arrogant and a bit of a smart ass. He only got broody and angsty later on when he found out much of his life was a lie, which Square turned into his defining characteristic for some reason.

That's not exactly true. Even if they aren't the protagonists the brooding angsty character has always existed in some form or another in all media. Chances are anything that has a large enough cast has at least one and video games are no exception, it's just that Cloud and Squall are the ones that end up coming to mind to the fans where JRPGs are concerned.

That was kinda my point. There have been many non-angsty protagonists in JRPGs and even Final Fantasy in particular, but for some reason everyone only thinks of Squall and Cloud. And even Cloud wasn't originally angsty.

I find it funny that the brooding angsty protagonist has become a JRPG cliche when it is pretty much exclusive to Final Fantasy and even then just Final Fantasy VIII. IIRC Cloud Strife's original characterization at the start of Final Fantasy VII was cocky and arrogant and a bit of a smart ass. He only got broody and angsty later on when he found out much of his life was a lie, which Square turned into his defining characteristic for some reason.

Well, Cecil in IV spent a good chunk of the game in an emo coma and Terra was there for much of VI. None were hitting the eyeliner and Dashboard Confessional quite like good ol' Squall Leonhart.

I'll give you Cecil, but I don't remember Terra being all that broody or angsty. Nevertheless we're still talking about a cliche that's exclusive to Final Fantasy being associated with all JRPGs.

Eh... Star Ocean has its share of emoness, as does .Hack. Depending on your choice of series, it might be harder to find a series that doesn't have that happen a lot.

Dragon Quest doesn't that I know of.

Well, Cecil in IV spent a good chunk of the game in an emo coma and Terra was there for much of VI. None were hitting the eyeliner and Dashboard Confessional quite like good ol' Squall Leonhart.

I'll give you Cecil, but I don't remember Terra being all that broody or angsty. Nevertheless we're still talking about a cliche that's exclusive to Final Fantasy being associated with all JRPGs.

I just recently played through FFIV. I think Cecil was pretty even keel, aside from being upset that he was complicit in the slaughter of a village of innocents, or that the kingdom he fought for was going insane and turning completely evil, or that the woman he loved was stolen away from him by his best friend's turning his back on him and fighting alongside the enemy for no discernible reason, and of course the onset of a world-ending calamity. What I'm getting at here is that he had every reason and right to be a bit down about things. And he never fell into an "emo coma". He got to feeling a bit helpless while visiting a village that he, not a couple weeks prior, invaded and robbed of its most treasured possession. Dude did some bad shit for bad people and felt bad for doing it. There is nothing wrong with that. In fact, it's more consistent characterization than most characters receive in those sorts of situations.

That's true too. Although I never finished FFIV.

 

[Naturally Sound]

Remember the year of releases back then? No thanks to nostalgia, emo characters were a thing back when FF8 was released. Squall's defining character trait related to many of us FF fans back then. Granted, I NEVER understood Cloud going full emo in AC after his showdown with Sephy when the player already has the gist he toughened up after the death of his girl, avenged her, and recovered from his identity crisis. Lingering guilt? Nah. Either way, it was probably the most off-putting characterization in the whole movie.

My point being: Archetypes - overused or catering to a specific demographic. Character traits seen in... uh, Pit and to a slightly lesser extent Tidus are ripped from Shonen manga like Naruto which are the most popular(by age group)Japanese manga.

 

[JimB]

#094: Introductions

Let's discuss it like civilized people.

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Rad's expression in that second panel, though.

Escapist people, make me a plushie of wizard Rad and I will buy the Jesus out of it. Not even kidding.