Designing a "Serious" Zombie RPG

Keane Ng

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Designing a "Serious" Zombie RPG



Zombies are everywhere these days, but very few games take the concept as seriously as DoubleBear Productions' ZRPG, an open-ended RPG from two ex-Obsidian staffers that's a "serious examination of a national crisis or natural disaster."

Annie Carlson of ZRPG [http://www.doublebearproductions.com/]" as it's being called for now, is a far cry from the recent rash of undead-themed titles, PopCap's wacky lawn defense sim included. Instead of a game where, as her partner-in-crime Brian Mitsoda puts it, zombies are "just something fun to shoot," the ZRPG takes a serious, psychological approach to the idea of a zombie apocalypse, and that's something Carlson has wanted for some time.

"Seriously, though, it's a game I always wanted to play," Carlson told The Escapist. "Something that took a more gradual, psychological take on something that's overwhelming and horrifying, where you have to fight to keep your sanity and sense of agency - you can't just grab a gun and hope to wipe all the bad guys out. You haven't won, you're not winning, you're not even close to losing - you've lost."

The theme of ZRPG, as Carlson and Mitsoda describe it, is survival. Built in the engine running Age of Decadence [http://www.irontowerstudio.com], a Fallout-style RPG from Iron Tower Studio, ZRPG is an open-ended, single-player, turn-based, erm, zombie RPG. "The focus is on survival, the survivors," Mitsoda said. "Unlike other games that are just about blasting zombies, the difficulties in this game stem from dealing with the other personalities in the group, the threats from outside the group, and the dangers of daily existence in the absence of law and the presence of desperate humans and persistent undead. It's more about the humans than the zombies."

For Mitsoda, the relevance of the zombie setting in his game goes beyond the conceptual and into his real life experience. Having seen what disaster truly looks like living in Miami during Hurricane Andrew, the idea of social breakdown isn't just fiction for him. "There was destruction everywhere you looked...it took months to get things back to a modest definition of normal," he said. "Having lived through something like that, I felt a zombie scenario allowed me to take my own personal experience and work it into a broader examination of how humans deal with a crisis beyond their control."

No offense to Valve or PopCap, but this is a whole other level of the zombie thing than it seems like anyone has touched upon in games recently. But while deep concepts are cool and all, can we trust that the game will live up to the ideas behind it? DoubleBear is leaking out info on gameplay systems (check out this discussion [http://www.irontowerstudio.com/forum/index.php?topic=990.0] of how noise works in the game), but for now at least we know that Carlson and Mitsoda have serious RPG design cred. They both worked at Obsidian, and Mitsoda, who has done work at big names like Black Isle and Troika, was a writer and designer on Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines.

Judging from DoubleBear's work experience, I'm going to guess the ZRPG will be more akin to the first two Fallout games than Final Fantasy VII. And though it takes a much grittier look at its themes than its zombie game peers, on some level, there will be some fundamental things in common. "[Plants vs. Zombies] is a funny idea that lasts because there's a compelling and very fun game behind it, though, and ideally that's what I want to be at our core as well," Carlson said. "The zombie part should be icing for some. Very, very disgusting icing. "

Mmm. Zombie icing.


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bue519

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Oct 3, 2007
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Hmmm their game kind of reminds me of Urban Dead, my favorite low tech Zombie Rpg.
 

ohgodalex

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May 21, 2009
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Turn based combat? As much as I love the idea of a serious game with innovative sound elements, I'm predicting a case of "Alone in the Dark" fever for this game.
 

Proteus214

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Jul 31, 2009
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Honestly, I think Valve has cornered the market on zombie games. I don't think they're going to be able to top Left 4 Dead.
 

Mr.Pandah

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Jul 20, 2008
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Ugh, I read Turn based and was completely turned off. I can't feel pressure if its the traditional Turn Based strategy that everyone knows. If they manage to switch that aspect of it, I think it'll turn out better. As for now, I'm sadly uninterested. It sounds like a fantastic idea though.
 

Jedoro

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Sounds fun to me. I'd love a zombie game where you can't kill them all. It would provide a good source of fear.
 

Therumancer

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Nov 28, 2007
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Hmmm, well I have mixed opinions about the entire thing to be honest. I understand what they are going for, but the problem I see is that most "psychological zombie horror" works by having a group of "normal" people who react unrealistically to the situation and ofentimes refuse to learn. It should also be noted that the Hollywood definition of "Normal" often strikes me as being at least mildly retarded. Typically in such a movie there are at most one or two people who have even an iota of common sense.

The thing with an RPG based around the concept is simply that most players aren't going to play characters who are "normal people" and if they do, they are going to rapidly cease to be normal people the longer they survive and the more they learn.

It should also be noted that Zombie horror is not all that uncommon, I think you'd be hard pressed to find anyone in the US who has no experience with the genere at all, even if they don't care for it. Even dealing with niche markets like fanboys your dealing with a lot of people who have probably spent an unhealthy amount of time thinking about the hypothetical possibility of a zombie uprising. Consider that we've got numerous best-selling video games (Resident Evil, Left 4 Dead, etc...) Zombies are a stock villain in ann kinds of fantasy and science fiction, then we've got numerous board games (Last Night On Earth, etc..) and paper and pencil RPGs like "All Flesh Must Be Eaten" and "Dead Reign". Not to mention the movies themselves which remain popular enough where it seems your seeing at least one or two churned out for direct to video release every year.

The point being that barring the initial disbelief, most people aren't going to be "OMG, what is that??!?!?". It's a bloody zombie, we've been looking at bloody zombies since we were five. As teenagers we watched dozens of zombie movies... really.

I guess my point is that ZRPG sounds interesting at first, but honestly I've oftentimes felt the "FPS" or "combat RPG" take on the genere was accurate to where things would wind up before too long. Making a whole game out of the "ZOMG! There are Zombies" reaction that would last maybe 5 minutes if that seems like a problem.

It's sort of like a lot of other horror concepts in various media. Once they get past introducing the concepts and the intiial shock, a lot of them have trouble actually DOING anything with it. A good example of this would be a paper and pencil RPG called "Nightbane". A lot of GMs are good with the "Boo there is a monster invasion, and your a monster too!" but then have trouble dealing with the fact that in the end it's more of a fantasy/dark super heroes type game based around monsters beating the living crud out of each other than it is based on actual horror and suspense (other than as a trapping). The same thing applies to Zombie RPGS and such, and frankly I could see this game suffering from the same problem (if I'm describing it correctly). "We don't want to make another zombie bashing game" seems to be their motif, but honestly that is what happens when the zombie genere is explored seriously past the very beginnings.

What's more when you get down to it, even if .01% of the human population survives and is unaffected the Zombies ultimatly lose. It might take a while, but anyone with even a mild amount of creativity can come up with ways to kill the things by the tens of thousands (and we've ALL thought of stuff like this watching Zombie movies). Sure the numbers seem endless but there are only so many people on the planet. To put things into perspective if you had say 5 people you could probably "kill" "everyone" in your neighborhood fairly quickly if they were all mindless shamblers that could be relied upon to move towards you. Then you could take the show on the road to neighboring areas or other towns since there are only going to be so many people in a given area to have been zombified. Given time, humans are going to reproduce, and frankly you'd be shocked at how quick humans can be disposed of (ie Vanishing Villages in Vietnam and such, when they weren't even zombies) never mind effectively mindless zombies.

Well enoguh rambling.

Good luck with the game, I'll keep an eye on it, will probably buy it if it seems decent in the end, but honestly I'm not sure if a decent game can be developed around those concepts (as I understand them).
 

UsefulPlayer 1

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Feb 22, 2008
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YAY!

I've been waiting for a game like this, though I like the idea in my head better but who doesn't like their own idea?

Anyhow, Turn-based? Not liking that idea too much, but maybe it'll fit and I'll have a grand time surviving in the zombie apocalypse.
 

More Fun To Compute

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Nov 18, 2008
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I'm enthusiastic about this one. Mitsoda has a great track record with games like Vampire: Bloodlines which has some of the best writing in any game ever. The game has a great set of features, I have wanted a survival RPG with turn-based combat for ages.
 

Pali

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Jul 16, 2009
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On the one hand, I'm excited, because it is indeed something I'd be curious to play. On the other hand, I'm extremely jealous someone has beaten me to the punch.

I few years back, I was thinking about how I'd do a zombie RPG. I had imagined that at the beginning of the game, you'd have to organize some kind of transportation, like hot-wire a car or something, then get supplies like fuel (defend a gas station while your vehicle is guzzling up) and water (break into a convenience store), as my hypothetical game would've included a physical needs system like they included in some of the hardcore Fallout 3 mods.

Of course, that was just a pipe dream - I have no experience in making or grasp of doing any programming or game design. It was just some fun "What if" scenario. Anyway, I'm looking forward to ZRPG.
 

D.C.

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Oct 8, 2008
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This has just become the game i'm looking forward to the most. I don't care how they long they decide to take as long as they do my hype justice.
 

Woem

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May 28, 2009
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"[A] Fallout-style RPG from Iron Tower Studio, ZRPG is an open-ended, single-player, turn-based, erm, zombie RPG"

Sold!

The hud and weapon stats already look like the original Fallout. So when is this done?

 

CD-R

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So it's going to be like the walking dead comics. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Walking_Dead
 

Simalacrum

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Apr 17, 2008
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hmmm, sounds pretty interesting, if you ask me... psychological horrors are always more scary than just blood and gore, afterall... (case in point? I'm a total coward yet I don't find SAW scary)