I'm going to blame BioShock Infinite given that it does the Half-Life style (albeit much more heavy handedly than both HL and BioShock 1) and quite a lot of people bought and loved that. Then the "uh it's just an interactive movie" accusations were thrown en masse at The Last of Us less than four months later, despite the otherwise positive reception.Casual Shinji said:There's been a rise recently of the "pure gaming" mindset, where if the player isn't in control at all times the game isn't allowed to be designated as such. Just as when a game has button prompts it's automatically seen as being nothing but QTE's.Vault101 said:can I just say THANKYOU for being one game person who doesn't think cutscenes are the devil and can actually acknowledge their good points? I mean don't get me wrong when they go bad theyre bad but there's no need to throw "the baby out with the bathwater" so to speak
There are about a billion mods pretty much anywhere you care to look to skip it, and they can skip anything from the stupid cart ride, the tutorial section, to large chunks of the game. And while that intro was rather annoying, it really doesn't make sense to say it's "so heinous there's a mod to get rid of it". There's a mod to turn all the dragons into a professional wrestler as well. Just because a mod exists doesn't mean something must have been so broken a mod was required. Occasionally that is the case (the game is virtually unplayable without some kind of UI mod), but the vast majority of mods are just pointless bullshit.MarsAtlas said:There's a mod on NexusMods to skip it. I don't know if it skips to you having just ran into the fort seeking shelter from the dragon, or if it skips that bit entirely. I actually came to the comments section just to point out that Skyrim is so heinous that there's a mod to get rid of it.
I think you've nailed it. I never understood the praise that HL2 got for its cut scenes, the plot and characters were uniformly terrible.Scow2 said:... No he didn't. Not really.Maze1125 said:Try reading. He addressed that.loa said:Ever skipped a cutscene in half like 2?Shamus Young said:1. Don't stop gameplay if you don't have to.
...
5. LET ME SKIP THE CUTSCENES.
If it doesn't stop gameplay, you usually can't skip it.
You have to wait until doctor whatshisface opens the door for you, until claptrap has made every single last lame joke so you can finally get to the game and of course, that skyrim intro tho.
And, honestly - if you have a segment of non-critical exposition and the only interactivity that makes sense is wandering around... it's far, far better to just replace it with a skippable cutscene. Moving the head/wandering in circles is NOT 'gameplay'.
The Last of Us certainly seemed to have kicked it into high gear. But it's the overall critical and commercial succes that games like TLoU, but also Infinite and Telltale have gathered that suddenly made a lot of people rally under the 'Pure Gaming Race' banner. Eventhough there are no more (interactive) cutscenes now than there were in the 6th generation. They just have a bit more effort put into them now, which for some is enough to have the fear of God struck into them, because this obviously means the cinematics are gonna come and take their games away in the night.Evonisia said:I'm going to blame BioShock Infinite given that it does the Half-Life style (albeit much more heavy handedly than both HL and BioShock 1) and quite a lot of people bought and loved that. Then the "uh it's just an interactive movie" accusations were thrown en masse at The Last of Us less than four months later, despite the otherwise positive reception.
Well, it was praise at the time. That game is already 10 years old and it has aged.Fox12 said:I never understood the praise that HL2 got for its cut scenes, the plot and characters were uniformly terrible.
Tales of Xillia/+2 have you press start to pause the cutscene and open a menu where you can choose to skip the scene. Pause and skip combined. I've seen that in multiple games and that's really the best of both worlds.FirstNameLastName said:Honestly, any designer who makes unskippable cutscenes before boss fights ought to be taken to GDC and put in stocks for all the world to laugh at. It absolutely baffles me that people think this is acceptable.
I've never understood why accidentally skipping the cut-scene is still used as a defence of the indefensible (making them unskippable). Just make it so you need to hold a button down for a short period and the problem is removed entirely. I've heard of games that also make you press multiple buttons, or press a button twice in quick succession.Pyrian said:True. And as a designer, you don't want people accidentally skipping your cutscene, especially if it includes vital information. So what's a good solution? Maybe just press escape, lol.loa said:If it doesn't stop gameplay, you usually can't skip it.
But Shadow of the Colossus has cutscenes. A lot of them, and they are used to great effect.Piorn said:I just find it a crime to have cutscenes at all. The magic of video Games is to make the player feel like stuff happens to you. The player projects himself into a world and learns it's rules, so every moment of gameplay, the player should be able to act on these rules. This goes for quicktime events, too.
Don't simply take away control of the player without reason, let the player keep control, and create ingame reasons. If you don't want the player to move, don't make controller input ineffective, but show the character's attempt at following the input and let the player understand why, in the game world, this movement is currently restricted. Show the character struggle to jump, struggle to move. When your character is tied up and you press "punch", don't do a "I can't do that right now", show him pulling the chains!
The connection between your hands and the Character must always be there!
A great example is part of the ending "cutscene" of Shadow of the Colossus. You keep control of your character, the attack button is still the attack button, and you move and turn to fight. And at the end, you, the player, are struggling, not some character in a cutscene. You use the same controls you've used the entire game, trying to win a struggle you can't win. It happens to you.
Didn't The Last of Us do it Half-Life style too, though? I don't recall a lot of cutscenes in that game.Evonisia said:I'm going to blame BioShock Infinite given that it does the Half-Life style (albeit much more heavy handedly than both HL and BioShock 1) and quite a lot of people bought and loved that. Then the "uh it's just an interactive movie" accusations were thrown en masse at The Last of Us less than four months later, despite the otherwise positive reception.
The Last of Us has more of a David Cage attitude outside of the cutscenes. Half-Life and BioShock would have you stand there soaking in the exposition. Usually The Last of Us has you do an obligatory button action like climbing a wall, breaking a car window or picking up a plank of wood to prop it up against something. In other words The Last of Us does token efforts to push you into interactivity rather than having a cutscene that you are stuck with due to the ability to walk about, depending on where you are on the spectrum (Dead Space - Half-Life 2 - BioShock).Steve the Pocket said:Didn't The Last of Us do it Half-Life style too, though? I don't recall a lot of cutscenes in that game.Evonisia said:I'm going to blame BioShock Infinite given that it does the Half-Life style (albeit much more heavy handedly than both HL and BioShock 1) and quite a lot of people bought and loved that. Then the "uh it's just an interactive movie" accusations were thrown en masse at The Last of Us less than four months later, despite the otherwise positive reception.
Ok I admit cutscenes aren't as bad as I made them out to be.DrOswald said:But Shadow of the Colossus has cutscenes. A lot of them, and they are used to great effect.Piorn said:[...]
I find the idea that the player should retain control at all times is ok for some games and really bad for others. Half Life 2 is excruciating to replay because of the many mandatory, unskippable dialog scenes that just plain suck and are made all the worse because they insist the player must still be in control of Gordon at all times. If you are going to have a non scene that is by nature non interactive go all the way and use the tools at your disposal to make it interesting to watch. Pretending a non interactive scene is interactive is perhaps the worst thing you can do. I would rather just watch a "shot reverse shot" scene than have to control the camera in a shot reverse shot scene.
Cutscenes are just a tool. Refusing to use them (or desperately pretending they are not there) is as foolish as misusing them.
Fortunately, you don't have to say it; blocking player input has already been described as a grand innovation by the game design luminaries Jon McIntosh and Ben Kuchera.I'm not going to say you should never block player input, but this happens way more often than it should.