A question about Mass Effect 3's ending (spoiler alert)

[viranimus]

It is explained. Its just people do not understand what it is they are experiencing. The answer is incredibly simple, but you have to look at things through a figurative perspective rather than taking everything literally. There is a very specific reason why no one is on the citadel. Why the citadel is not wrecked. Why you encounter a whole area of it no one is familiar with, and how various people are there along with you such as Anderson and TIM

With as blatant as it has been thru the entire series it astounds me I have yet to encounter anyone who has even come close to broaching its intended meaning.

Is this about the Indoctrination Theory? If it is, then let me refute it for you:

A. If your effective military strength is not high enough, Destroy is your only option (that kind of neuters the whole theory right there).

B. If it is correct and the entire ending is a coma dream, then the game never actually ends. Or it does, with Shepard lying bleeding an broken in war-torn London while the Reapers wipe out all space faring civilizations because the Crucible couldn't dock.

And that is just off the top of my head. I can come up with more reasons if I think about it.

Now if I missed your point (and just made a massive strawman argument) then I apologize and ask that you elaborate on what was so blatant that everyone else could not see.

Although indoctrination theory plays a small part of it as do all of the individual endings as well as the way it is reinforced by EC, the true meaning is far far more grandiose than just IT

 

[The Ubermensch]

I remember people were tweeting these questions to people on the BW team during Ending-Gate;

I can't remember who but they replied something along the lines of 'Those characters you are asking about could of escaped in shuttles when they saw the reapers coming' & 'parts of the citadel wards can still be shielded you know'

Basically 'lots of speculation for everyone'

In retrosepct they were going for a Gainax ending; and they pulled it off but it didn't if with the rest of the game. They should have also known that if you do a Gainax ending you piss a lot of your fans off.

If its okay with you I'll explain what happens if you pick synthesis


Ah; Komm Susser Todd, you fix everything

As you can see; as the Lance of Longinius enters Liliths head vagina eyeball thing; that's a metaphor for how much up their own ass the Bioware writing staff were.

 

[Goofguy]

Food for thought, anyone think the Citadel DLC will do anything to give some closure on this subject? Sure, it's about Shepard getting caught up in some controversy on the Citadel and faffing about catching up with old squadmates and friends but do you think we'll get some extra Citadel cutscenes for the end battle?

For the record, I don't care much about ME3 anymore and I don't know if I'll be playing its last DLC. I was merely pondering as to what Bioware has in store for its last bit of single player content.

 

[acey195]

This very question was actually asked directly to the devs during Pax 2012 during their conference:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=m8BSg9KIe0k#t=2656s

in short: most likely there would have been casualties, but there would be survivors, especially with the control ending, where it is less damaged

 

[Zetatrain]

It just seems kind of weird that so many characters (of varying importance) would just drop of the map like that. Though I suppose it could just be another loose plot thread like why the Reapers brought the Citadel to Earth in the first place instead of sending it into dark space for the remainder of the harvesting.

How would they be able to send the Citadel into dark space? Its my understanding that the Citadel is the only mass relay to leads into dark space and I don't think mass relays can teleport themselves.

 

[NinjaDeathSlap]

There's no solid answer (which is a problem). However, we can make an educated guess of there being at least a few survivors. When the Reapers take the Citadel, there only immediate concern is moving it to a safer location, rather than taking the time to systematically harvest everybody on it. My guess is, they entered the system in force, smashed the defending Citadel fleet, took out strategic positions for mounting a defense on the station itself (C-Sec HQ, any ground-based artillery etc.) and then proceeded straight away to move it without bothering about anything else. Casualties in areas specifically targeted would be extreme, but otherwise there may not have been that many at first.

Obviously, casualties on the Citadel will be far greater in the Destroy and Synthesis endings, due to the station breaking apart. However, we don't know just how advanced the life-support on the station is. I'm guessing for something that size there's no one system that, if it loses connection, kills everything on the station. More likely, life-support is more localised, so it's plausible that even on the fragmented pieces of the station, many people could still survive at least long enough to be evacuated.

So, I don't think everyone died. In fact, it's possible that, especially for the Control ending, casualties on the station itself could have been relatively low.

 

[NinjaDeathSlap]

It just seems kind of weird that so many characters (of varying importance) would just drop of the map like that. Though I suppose it could just be another loose plot thread like why the Reapers brought the Citadel to Earth in the first place instead of sending it into dark space for the remainder of the harvesting.

How would they be able to send the Citadel into dark space? Its my understanding that the Citadel is the only mass relay to leads into dark space and I don't think mass relays can teleport themselves.

Not to mention, the other function of the Citadel is that it's the main 'factory' for processing organics into Reapers during the harvest. A function it wouldn't be able to perform from several million light years away.

 

[PissOffRoth]

Remember this part of the game, right when you teleport up to the Citadel?

That mess is what happened to the people on the Citadel. Maybe a few resourceful people got away, but I'm betting most of them are corpses in hallways.

 

[Austin Manning]

Although indoctrination theory plays a small part of it as do all of the individual endings as well as the way it is reinforced by EC, the true meaning is far far more grandiose than just IT

While I don't see how the extended cut reinforces the indoctrination theory (if anything it tears it apart more effectively than I did) that is a discussion for another time. Would you care to elaborate on this far more grandiose interpretation of Mass Effect's plot, or are you merely trolling?

 

[Austin Manning]

Remember this part of the game, right when you teleport up to the Citadel?

That mess is what happened to the people on the Citadel. Maybe a few resourceful people got away, but I'm betting most of them are corpses in hallways.

I always got the feeling that those corpses (though the ones pictured are Cerberus for some reason) were the people brought up through the beam from Earth, not the previous inhabitants of the Citadel.

 

[Austin Manning]

How would they be able to send the Citadel into dark space? Its my understanding that the Citadel is the only mass relay to leads into dark space and I don't think mass relays can teleport themselves.

The Reapers could just physically move it there without a relay, 3 establishes that they don't need a relay to enter or leave the galaxy. Even, for arguments sake, if they can't they could still send it someplace the armada and Crucible couldn't reach, like the Omega 4 relay or some unexplored part of the galaxy. Heck they could have just moved it to a system, destroyed the nearest relay and repaired the damage after they'd finished harvesting everyone.

 

[Austin Manning]

Not to mention, the other function of the Citadel is that it's the main 'factory' for processing organics into Reapers during the harvest. A function it wouldn't be able to perform from several million light years away.

I'm not sure if they really need the Citadel for that though. The Collectors didn't seem to have any trouble processing organics into Reapers from their base.

 

[bug_of_war]

I actually prefer not knowing what happened. I think that the mystery is always better than saying, "Oh no! this is what happened to them" because then it just makes me feel less a part of the game and more a wikipedia editor. I don't need to know what happens to everyone, all I need to know is what my job is, and if I survived, maybe I would like to hear how they dealt with the situation, but I died and that's the end of my story, I've done my job and now it's time for everybody else to move along.

I'm surprised this hasn't been brought up on this website, or at least I haven't seen this come up on here. Ah well, good to see a legit question that has come out due to curiosity rather than argument.

 

[viranimus]

Although indoctrination theory plays a small part of it as do all of the individual endings as well as the way it is reinforced by EC, the true meaning is far far more grandiose than just IT

While I don't see how the extended cut reinforces the indoctrination theory (if anything it tears it apart more effectively than I did) that is a discussion for another time. Would you care to elaborate on this far more grandiose interpretation of Mass Effect's plot, or are you merely trolling?

Ill reiderate, IT is only a minor part of it, just as much as RBG are their own respective parts of it.

As for elaboration, No. I would not. Part of the joy of the ME3 ending is being able to see clearly what sooooo many other people continue to be completely oblivious to despite it being repeatedly beaten into their heads over the course of three games. As for trolling, No. I might derive a bit of perverse satisfaction of being slightly ahead of the curve on this. However Me stating there is something everyone is missing isnt some incendiary statement meant to provoke response. If anything It is intended to provoke thought. To get the players thinking "What could I have possibly missed" It would be wrong of my to just blurt it out at this point given how many have yet to grasp it. Its a matter of finding ones personal truth in it and to tell you would deprive you of it. If you want to see it, you must first abandon your personal biases of the story. Try to figure out the story THEY are trying to tell you. Accept they are telling you something you do not want to consider. Stop trying to rationalize it in a literal sense and see it in a figurative and metaphorical sense. The answer is there and the joy of it is discovering it.

Im sure you will continue to see this as a trollish answer, but that is the furthest thing from the truth. I would love to see more people resolve it, but that so few have is part of the beauty and eloquence of it all. I cant make you see the seriousness in my statements, but I hope it would at least challenge you to consider it.

 

[NinjaDeathSlap]

Not to mention, the other function of the Citadel is that it's the main 'factory' for processing organics into Reapers during the harvest. A function it wouldn't be able to perform from several million light years away.

I'm not sure if they really need the Citadel for that though. The Collectors didn't seem to have any trouble processing organics into Reapers from their base.

Well, the Citadel and the Collector Base are the two biggest single structures you encounter in the ME trilogy, and we have no idea if The Collector base would have been big enough to fully complete a Capital Class Reaper on its own, and the Citadel is the only place with Keepers on it to help out with the process. They may well not strictly need it, but even so the efficiency of their operation would be severely diminished without it.

 

[knight steel]

Internet:
Thus saith the Lord:
Since you refuse to give me answers and ending
All through the gaming industry...

I send a pestilence and plague
Into your house, into your bed
Into your streams, into your streets
Into your drink, into your bread
Upon your console, on your computer
Upon your accounts in your life
Into your dreams, into your sleep
Until you break, until you yield
I send the swarm, I send the horde
Thus saith the Lord

Fan:
Once I called you friend
Once I thought the chance
to give you money
Was all I ever wanted...

Internet:
I send the thunder from the sky
I send the fire raining down

Fan:
And even now I wish that God
had chose another
Serving as your foe on his behalf
Is the last thing that I wanted...

Internet:
I send a hail of burning ice
On ev'ry field, on ev'ry town

Fan:
This was my adventure
All this pain and devastation
How it tortures me inside
All the innocent who suffer
From your stubbornness and pride...

Internet:
I send the locusts on a wind
Such as the world has never seen
On ev'ry leaf, on ev'ry stalk
Until there's nothing left of green
I send my scourge, I send my sword
Thus saith the Lord!

Fan:
You who i called my friend
Why must you call down another blow?

Internet:
I send my scourge, I send my sword

fan:
Give me my answers and ending

Fan and internet:
Thus saith the Lord

creators:
You who I called customer
How could you have come to hate me so?
Is this what you wanted?

Internet:
I send the swarm, I send the horde...

Creator:
Then let my heart be hardened
And never mind how high the cost may grow
This will still be so:
I will never give you your answer's and ending's...

Internet:
Thus saith the Lord:

Fan:
Thus saith the Lord:

Creator:
I will not...

[fan, creator, and internet]
give your (my) answers and ending!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=UB7Y2qOQ_3k

 

[gmaverick019_v1legacy]

Although indoctrination theory plays a small part of it as do all of the individual endings as well as the way it is reinforced by EC, the true meaning is far far more grandiose than just IT

While I don't see how the extended cut reinforces the indoctrination theory (if anything it tears it apart more effectively than I did) that is a discussion for another time. Would you care to elaborate on this far more grandiose interpretation of Mass Effect's plot, or are you merely trolling?

Ill reiderate, IT is only a minor part of it, just as much as RBG are their own respective parts of it.

As for elaboration, No. I would not. Part of the joy of the ME3 ending is being able to see clearly what sooooo many other people continue to be completely oblivious to despite it being repeatedly beaten into their heads over the course of three games. As for trolling, No. I might derive a bit of perverse satisfaction of being slightly ahead of the curve on this. However Me stating there is something everyone is missing isnt some incendiary statement meant to provoke response. If anything It is intended to provoke thought. To get the players thinking "What could I have possibly missed" It would be wrong of my to just blurt it out at this point given how many have yet to grasp it. Its a matter of finding ones personal truth in it and to tell you would deprive you of it. If you want to see it, you must first abandon your personal biases of the story. Try to figure out the story THEY are trying to tell you. Accept they are telling you something you do not want to consider. Stop trying to rationalize it in a literal sense and see it in a figurative and metaphorical sense. The answer is there and the joy of it is discovering it.

Im sure you will continue to see this as a trollish answer, but that is the furthest thing from the truth. I would love to see more people resolve it, but that so few have is part of the beauty and eloquence of it all. I cant make you see the seriousness in my statements, but I hope it would at least challenge you to consider it.

every single opinion on the game has been spoken 100x over, just judging by the youtube videos alone of most people who broke down the plot of each game across hour long videos. If all you are going to do is speak in monotone riddles, you are getting nowhere and do come across more as a troll rather than stating your opinion and provoking debate/discussion. to steal your own words "I'm sure you will continue to see this as a trollish answer" but really you are coming across like some future space man on his high and mighty horse, like no one could've possibly came up with your interpretation of the events in the games.

Spoiler

I'm really not trying to piss you off, that will maybe be a side effect of this post, but really, your post is coming across very overly pompous like the kid who snickers and makes comments behind peoples back as they walk by. I really hope that is not the case.

OT: I'm actually not sure, it's been a hell of a long time since i did a solid playthrough of me3 (not to mention the 20-30 games i've played into a pulp since it), but as some people have said some of the secondary (not sure exactly what to call them) writers have confirmed some do live, i'd leave it best just to go with that.

 

[Austin Manning]

snip

Normally I'd call that a troll or make some snide comment, but since you actually transcribed one of my favourite songs from one of my favourite Dreamworks films I'm just going to sit back, clap, and smile.

 

[knight steel]

snip

Normally I'd call that a troll or make some snide comment, but since you actually transcribed one of my favourite songs from one of my favourite Dreamworks films I'm just going to sit back, clap, and smile.

Thanks I'm glad you liked it and it made you happy ^_^, it's one of my fav song/movies too!
But why would you think I was a troll?
I wasn't trying to hurt,provoke or trick anyone.......

 

[viranimus]

every single opinion on the game has been spoken 100x over

That is not even remotely true. Every individual has different experiences and perspectives. With such opinions would be infinite in infinite variation.

If all you are going to do is speak in monotone riddles, you are getting nowhere and do come across more as a troll rather than stating your opinion and provoking debate/discussion.

Im simply speaking in the manner that the solution is presented in. If I am a puzzle, it is clear why the real solution has yet to be uncovered by the general public. Now as for provoking discussion or debate. That wasnt my intention when I entered this. I entered to express the response that the reasons why no one was on the citadel, Why the citadel was unfamiliar, and so many more anomalous questions are in fact present IF you are willing to see them.

but really you are coming across like some future space man on his high and mighty horse, like no one could've possibly came up with your interpretation of the events in the games.

Please understand, I come off like that in part because this isnt the first time ive stuck a toe in the water to try to give the answer a gentle nudge only to be met with sticks and stones. So I expect the response. But I have also seen entirely too narrow of a view taken, just like the idea that all the possible ideas have been considered. And I know that is not true. In fact I think some people HAVE in fact considered it for a moment, but they do not want it to be true so they ignore it, shun it and forget that the thought ever crossed their mind because it is not what they would want and the concept of a flawed and broken ending as infuriating as it might be would be preferable.

Spoiler

I'm really not trying to piss you off, that will maybe be a side effect of this post, but really, your post is coming across very overly pompous like the kid who snickers and makes comments behind peoples back as they walk by. I really hope that is not the case.

No no no, You havent, and please do not take my dissection as trying to retaliate. Simply put it is not possible to upset or offend me, and I would much rather someone speak their mind openly than to speak with forked tongues in bitter mouths (cookie for refs). Im a big boy, I can more than take what I dish out and realistically all we are doing is discussing, even if I am relegated to discussing vaugeries. I value dissenting opinion as its where I am able to expand my thought outside what I would normally think, even if I initially disagree with it. Again, this isnt the first time I have rpesented it. I have seen in the past how it has been received. But you have to consider that if what I have seen in it is in fact correct then me blurting it out would be worse than any spoiler. So the high horse future man might be an apt analogy, but not for the secret knowledge, but for blurting out its existence. However I only did so again to address the OP and explain there is in fact a rational reason for their question, even if it is unusual if not unorthodox.