CritialGaming said:
Xprimentyl said:
Buy a game of pool and then try throwing the balls into the holes physically and see if anyone let's you "enjoy" the game however you want.
Ah, see, my throwing the pool palls WOULD affect others (i.e.: damaging a table I don?t own, balls bouncing and hitting someone else, etc.,) so my analogy still stands, but I?ll run with your counter: if I BOUGHT a pool table and chose to throw the balls around in my own home, then yes, the American Poolplayers Association may not agree, but it?s mine to enjoy as I so choose.
CritialGaming said:
I am all for a person playing a video game however they want. So long as they are PLAYING. Skipping is not playing the game. If you don't wanna deal with the "busy-work" i.e. playing the game. Then go watch a youtube video, why spend you money to not play a game that is meant to be played?
The God Mode cheats still at least require the playing interaction with the media, despite loosing all challenge.
Like so many internetz debates, this one may devolved into one far from the issue and into a battle for rightness and semantics. I said how anyone chooses to ENJOY THEIR ENTERTAINMENT; ?playing? is implied, yes, but there?s enough room for a distinction and differentiation. Even so, because you?ve this deep conviction they?re not ?playing? by skipping a tough bit, can you not still feel that way
and the option to skip still exist? Again, how are you validated knowing that everyone is ?playing? their games? If I buy a game disc and use it as a coaster, does that mean the physical version of the medium shouldn?t exists in lieu of digital so games can ONLY be played? I appreciate you?re a purist, but preferring everyone else be denied a harmless option because it doesn?t align with your ideal seems unnecessarily rigid.
CritialGaming said:
Xprimentyl said:
Does anyone really buy a game to skip through it? How does a skip somehow make a difficult game for "everybody"? It doesn't it just means that anybody can press a button to not play. That's the point that you, err, or anybody else on this thread fail to counter. SKIPPING IS NOT PLAYING! If you pay to PLAY and then choose to NOT play, then why did you waste your money? Because you are not enjoying something you are not experiencing.
It's like saying, "I've never had ice cream, but I really like Ice cream."
Again, semantics, but ok, ?skipping? is not ?playing,? there; you?re acorrect. However it IS using the medium one purchases as one so chooses to get their version of enjoyment out of it. And like I said, the idea that skipping would become a cancer and pervade all of gaming is a thousand miles from the nearest border of far-fetched. The vast majority of the games I own have some form of difficulty option, and the only one I?ve ever played on Easy was Dragon Age: Origins because fuck that game. A skip function would be the same way, there for those desperate/casual enough to use it and all but ignored by everyone else. ?Why did [they] waste [their] money?? Not your money and, by extension, not your problem. My girlfriend bought tickets for her and a girlfriend of hers for a country music concert; I hate country music, but it was HER money; I don?t feel country music should be banned from the music industry; I?ll play my music while she?s gone and we?ll BOTH enjoy ourselves; see how that works? And your ice cream analogy is again exaggerated and reaching. Let?s assume the person who chooses to skip a tough bit had to ?play? long enough to get to said tough bit; let?s further assume that they?ll resume playing
after skipping said tough bit; I don?t think it?s fair to say
?they never [played.]? Did they miss a portion of the game, of course, but does that discount their investment, their personal desire to continue on with the game or their enjoyment? No, sir.
How does including a skip option make a difficult game for ?everyone?? It allows anyone who wants to try it the opportunity to do so as they see fit. It?s an OPTION (I?ve type that word more times in the past two days than I have in my entire life.) going back to Dark Souls again, if the game was literally just a series of boss fights ala Mike Tyson?s Punchout where you literally just went from one boxer to the next, then yes, a skip option would be inane. Fortunately, Dark Souls has a world rich with lore, secrets and lesser battles to be enjoyed stuffed in between its bosses; the bosses are just overpowered barriers, fun for some, frustrating for most, but not necessarily surmountable by all. A lot of people gave up (myself included up until last year) and never got to experience much of the game beyond the Undead Parish IF they got that far. I personally wouldn?t take issue if someone wanted to skip O&S to get to the latter half of the game. Do they get the achievements, souls or item drops from the battles they skip? No, but they can experience new areas, they can probably beat later bosses who?re aren?t nearly as tough as O&S, etc. And who knows, maybe after a little bit of confidence seeing the world and beating other bosses, they might want to play AGAIN, this time grinding out O&S with their newfound experience; maybe they?ll buy Dark Souls 2 and 3? No one on the ?nay? side of this seems to want to considering the potential
positive implications of appealing to a broader (if less skilled) audience. After all, skipping doesn?t detract from the difficulty; it?s still there for the purists and hardcore; those folks can still wear their scars as badges of honor for any willing to ogle them in slack-jawed awe; it just allows other a peek beyond brick walls so they don?t have to feel their money and/or time was entirely wasted.
CritialGaming said:
Xprimentyl said:
This is true, nobody is doing anything but digging heels into the dirt. However I wish that wasn't the case. I am more than willing to budge on any issue if someone provides a legitimate point, but so far nobody has done anything but say, "people should be able to enjoy things however they want." Which I've countered several times already and the moment someone can explain to me how not experiencing something is enjoying it, I'll be happy to budge and bow down to you.
I don?t know what else to tell you other than this whole debate started out as a discussion over whether an option to skip bosses should exists assuming that option would affect no one and nothing save those who might want to exercise that option and since has just become a sounding board for everyone to list all the reasons THEY wouldn?t use it, and those reasons are fine and valid; what I haven?t heard a valid, objective argument for is why anyone else shouldn?t.
And I?m not looking to be ?bowed to,? c?mon; if nothing I say sways you or anyone else in here, that?s fine. I?m just going to state my point on the issue as I see it, and that?s simply that more options are never a bad thing, that?s why I?m big into polygamy. (Kidding.)
