Agoraphobic PS3 Owner Sues Sony over PSN Ban

[bridgerbot]

from the PSN EULA:

5. WALLET
All access to content may only be purchased from SCEA using funds from the PSN wallet, where available. All purchases made by the Sub Account or the Master Account must be made through a PSN wallet that is automatically associated with a Master Account. A Sub Account does not have its own separate wallet. Master Accounts can set a maximum spending amount for each Sub Account, effective at the beginning of the following month. A Master Account holder can fund the PSN wallet up to a maximum amount determined by SCEA ("Limit"), using either (i) a credit or debit card; (ii) a prepaid card or promotional code where available; or (iii) other payment methods approved by SCEA and made available from time to time in each specific country. SCEA reserves the right to refuse purchase of any wallet funds for any reason. Except as otherwise permitted by applicable law or as expressly provided in this Agreement, funds added to the wallet are non-refundable and non-transferable. Purchases of access to content are not refundable. Wallet funds have no value outside PSN and can only be used to purchase access to content from SCEA through PSN. Subject to applicable law, wallet funds that are deemed abandoned or unused by law will not be returned or restored.

ergo, he deserves NO refund for unspent monies in the wallet.

Your conclusion is faulty. You can't take someone's money and not give them a product. It's not legal. Sony can waste as much paper as they want in saying it's non-refundable, but if they took his money and gave him nothing, he has every right to get it back. That particular part of the lawsuit he can actually win.

The rest of his claims about violating his first ammendment rights is a bunch of non-sense, it's a free service and he violated their conduct policies (that part they can win easily).

Wrong, he consciously put his money in there, it hasn't been used for anything it's still sitting there, nobody has access too it however. so he either has to ***** moan and plead for them to unban him, very unlikely with the fuss he's throwing. or just deal with not getting his cash back. it's like having a frozen bank account, the money is still there you just don't have access to it.

Tis you and not I that are wrong.

Well obviously he "consciously" put his money in there, very few financial transactions occur unconsciously.

No, it's not a frozen bank account, there is no legal investigation or creditor seeking to collect debt that had the account frozen. You can't take someone's money, put it in an account, deny that person access to the funds, and not give it back to them. If that goes to court, I guarantee you he'll be able to get his wallet funds back.

 

[Zersy]

Would you guys do the same if you were in his position ?

I'd politely ask for it back, I would'nt take them to court over it.

That proves you are sane and are a nice guy with common sense (commen sense is not very commen)

 

[bue519]

Perhaps your right. But, when does a company have to step in a protect their user from being harassed for something like this.

The company should not have to step in, that's why they made their TOS they way they did. No illegal drug comments, no sexual content, no religion... blah blah blah.

...and that perhaps Microsoft could not just be an over protective dick.

Perhaps she could just follow the rules like everyone else.

EDIT: I mean cmon so a lesbian can be your teacher, politician, or any other job. But they can't be your friend on x-box live?

Ya, I'll play with lesbians, but I expect them to follow the same rules that I have to follow, they don't get special treatment. So how about they don't make any statements that they have sex with women, and I won't make any statements that I have sex with women, and *together* we'll go blow the crap out of alien monsters?

Yeah, but you can probably admit that you are a heterosexual male with out getting punished, but you can't admit your a homosexual female? My only problem with her would be if you was trying to use X-box live as a dating service and started soliciting herself. But, it seems all she had to do was put it in her profile to get banned. I mean if I say that I "skull f*****" you in a game would that be considered a sexual advance. Yet, I hear crap like that all the time in X-box live.

 

[bridgerbot]

Wait actually hold up I've got a question, his accounts been banned all around I get that, but would that extend to the store. That's not interacting with users, so is he making a big deal out of nothing or can someone actually confirm that you can no longer buy/access the store.

I just wanna get this out of the way before we continue arguing like 5 year olds pretending to be gentleman

To access the store you have to be able to log in to the PSN, at least, I've never been able to get into the store w/o logging in to PSN, if I'm not logged in and I attempt to get into the store it says "not logged into PSN".

I'd also like to disagree with you that I am pretending to be a gentleman, I'm more like a 5 year old who reads a lot.

Other than that, I really don't have anything left to say other than repeat myself. I also know that there's about 1000 other court cases somewhat similar to this one, where someone didn't receive what they were expecting from a company/person, the buyer sues and gets their money back. In this guy's case, he was expecting to be able to buy off of PSN, since he now can't buy off of PSN, there won't be much of a case.

 

[bridgerbot]

Yeah, but you can probably admit that you are a heterosexual male with out getting punished, but you can't admit your a homosexual female? My only problem with her would be if you was trying to use X-box live as a dating service and started soliciting herself. But, it seems all she had to do was put it in her profile to get banned. I mean if I say that I "skull f*****" you in a game would that be considered a sexual advance. Yet, I hear crap like that all the time in X-box live.

In that reguard, I agree with you, those people should be booted, but in all fairness, it's a lot harder to monitor microphone chat comments than profile text. PSN has a report system (which I haven't used), idk if Xbox Live does (I've only briefely played that at my friend's house). So I do agree with you that people making those microphone comments should be booted.

 

[niglett]

okay i read the lawsuit and it has a few good points and a huge bad one rawr!!!!
good point one: the psn should not ban you completely from its self you should at least be able to reach the PlayStation store and the money that is stored on your wallet.
good point two: being band from a game should be based on weather your hacking the game or cheating.
good point three:yes you can mute the other players so you don't have to here there filth or staticy feed back music in the back ground.

bad point rawr!!!: $55,000!?!?!? that's a lot of money for having you feelings hurt. he should only get the amount in his wallet account and to pay the layer if he wins.

 

[bridgerbot]

The difference between those 1000 cases was they didn't break the terms of contract, since the contract lays everything out in print and he agreed to it he has no case. and again, JAPANESE company, do they even fall under american law?

Hold on, so first, there is a big difference between a contract and terms of service. He violated terms of service, Sony's only recourse (for what he had done) is to stop his service. If it had instead been a contract, there's other things they could have done. Both a contract and terms of service must abide by state and federal laws.

Anything in a ToS/Contract that's not legal immediately gets thrown out if it goes to court.

You are correct, a Japanese company does not fall under american law, but an america company, such as SCEA inc (Sony Computer Entertainment America inc) does.

Yes, some of those other 1000 cases broke terms of service/contract, but they contained things that weren't legal, so it didn't matter.

 

[PizzaDentist]

Hmmm, Agrophobia is a fear of crowds you say? LIke any phobia shoulsn't he be able to get over it somehow, locking him in a room with 50 people ?
Doesn't sound like a disability regardless of the subject.

Well then it's just ignorance run rampant.

Are you afraid of having your head in a crocodile's mouth... then maybe we should just stick your head in one and let you man up a bit...

 

[ThenNinjaLion]

Im guessing he either mic spammed or is a racist, those are the two most common ban cases besides hacking. You know general flaming.

 

[ElArabDeMagnifico]

I don't mean to be a dick, though I can't help but wonder if someone who is agoraphobic may be a teensy bit...crazy.

 

[Uncompetative]

Look. I'm genuinely sympathetic... but SONY could best resolve this by offering him an out of court settlement:

A 360 with 12 months Xbox LIVE Gold Account membership, Halo 3 and a wireless headset.

 

[Uncompetative]

Hmmm, Agrophobia is a fear of crowds you say? LIke any phobia shoulsn't he be able to get over it somehow, locking him in a room with 50 people ?
Doesn't sound like a disability regardless of the subject.

It's "agoraphobia" not "agrophobia". That is fear of 'The marketplace" (i.e. crowds), as opposed to fear of 'Intensive Farming'.

;-)

 

[Anton P. Nym]

You can't take someone's money, put it in an account, deny that person access to the funds, and not give it back to them. If that goes to court, I guarantee you he'll be able to get his wallet funds back.

No, but you can kick someone out of a concert for being unruly and not refund them for any beer tickets they've purchased.

-- Steve

 

[squid5580]

*Fanboy mode on*
Just buy an Xbox
*Fanboy mode off*

But what if he got banned for something ridiculous like telling people he's also gay. You can get banned from XBL for that too.

If it's something like that situation, he deserves his thousands of dollars. If he was intentionally being a prick and hiding behind his disabilities, he deserves a swift kick in the ass.

Can anyone tell me what exactly he was banned for? What did he do, we can't exactly pass judgement without that info.
That's what we're supposed to be doing here right?

I see nothing ridiculous about identifying yourself as gay. Except if you meant that it's silly to do so in a room filled with faux-macho 13 year-old boys even I, a skinny shut-in, could most likely take out with a nice mallet and a head start. But I digress, as interesting as such a confrontation would be.

I meant that it would've been ridiculous if that was the reason he was banned.

What if he did get banned for that reason? Does that excuse him from the rules if the rules clearly state that saying your sexual orientation could incur the wrath of the banhammer?

Wouldn't it be ironic if he was banned for running around telling everyone he is straight.

And she wasn't banned for telling anyone. She was banned for putting it in her profile. If she had just simply told everyone in every game she ever played she would still be playing.

I would suggest reading this before going off on XBL treatment of her

http://www.xbox.com/zh-SG/live/legal/codeofconduct.htm

It is laid out quite clearly in more than 1 point.

I think they would have an excuse if they were braking a rule that's bigoted and discriminatory to begin with, yes. If someone is really being discriminated against, they have every right to sue. I just want to know if this guy is really being discriminated against or if it's like Cartman saying he has Tourettes.

And thanks for the link. Their practices are worse than I thought. It's hard to believe this is an American company. It's amazing anyone is left on XBL considering the 3rd rule is Don't scream, yell, or threaten. Has anyone here ever put on a headset on XBL and NOT heard any of these things?

I take it you didn't read the "What to do" part. It would be one thing if there was nothing you could do and were forced with either listening to it or just not playing. MS isn't your mommy or daddy. MS has provided you with everything you need to enjoy your experience on XBL. They just expect you to have the common sense to use it. it isn't thier job to protect you from anything you might find offensive that another might say over thier headset. They have simply said you are a big boy or girl if someone is screaming, threatening or doing whatever you might not like you can do something about it. And at the same time for the good of the whole community (not in the best interest of any special interest group or demographic the whole community) lets not put certain things in your profile. If you cannot abide by this simple rule you risk being banned. It is no different here at The Escapist. The "no trolling" rule is there not because they are dicks. It is there for the good of the community as a whole. If you insist on trolling you will be banned. You don't get to troll since you belong to a minority or a special interest group or a specific demographic. the law doesn't see race, gender or anything else. It is thier for one and all. The only way a troll skates scott free is when you and I don't report it. Then we can't then blame the mods for letting the troll skate when we didn't do our part to stop it. Which is exactly what is happening when the excuse:

"Well I have seen other profiles in violation of the Code of Conduct."

"Did you report it"

"No"

So you didn't do your part out of sheer laziness and then expect MS to do thiers? Maybe MS is wrong. Maybe giving gamers a bit of responsibility is too much for us to handle. Maybe they were wrong giving us online capabilities. Maybe they should shut down all the servers, refund all gold members or at the very least end all chat options and profiles. We can go the way of the Wii with little to no voice chat and friend codes. No texting either. Can't have that now can we? Too many insults might be typed instead of spoken.

Or we can grow the fuck up and take responsibility for ourselves. For our own protection. For our own enjoyment. And do what we came there to do in the first place. To not worry about this person's or that person's lifestyle choices, or to be sure the entire community knows about mine or yours, and play some games.

 

[ReaperCon89]

surely if the guy suffers bad from agrophobia a law suit would aggitate his condition by forcing him out of the house at some point, for court appearence etc. Although as many of you have already said in order to really pass judgement *climbs down off high horse* we need to see what he did to get banned.

 

[GonzoGamer]

*Fanboy mode on*
Just buy an Xbox
*Fanboy mode off*

But what if he got banned for something ridiculous like telling people he's also gay. You can get banned from XBL for that too.

If it's something like that situation, he deserves his thousands of dollars. If he was intentionally being a prick and hiding behind his disabilities, he deserves a swift kick in the ass.

Can anyone tell me what exactly he was banned for? What did he do, we can't exactly pass judgement without that info.
That's what we're supposed to be doing here right?

I see nothing ridiculous about identifying yourself as gay. Except if you meant that it's silly to do so in a room filled with faux-macho 13 year-old boys even I, a skinny shut-in, could most likely take out with a nice mallet and a head start. But I digress, as interesting as such a confrontation would be.

I meant that it would've been ridiculous if that was the reason he was banned.

What if he did get banned for that reason? Does that excuse him from the rules if the rules clearly state that saying your sexual orientation could incur the wrath of the banhammer?

Wouldn't it be ironic if he was banned for running around telling everyone he is straight.

And she wasn't banned for telling anyone. She was banned for putting it in her profile. If she had just simply told everyone in every game she ever played she would still be playing.

I would suggest reading this before going off on XBL treatment of her

http://www.xbox.com/zh-SG/live/legal/codeofconduct.htm

It is laid out quite clearly in more than 1 point.

I think they would have an excuse if they were braking a rule that's bigoted and discriminatory to begin with, yes. If someone is really being discriminated against, they have every right to sue. I just want to know if this guy is really being discriminated against or if it's like Cartman saying he has Tourettes.

And thanks for the link. Their practices are worse than I thought. It's hard to believe this is an American company. It's amazing anyone is left on XBL considering the 3rd rule is Don't scream, yell, or threaten. Has anyone here ever put on a headset on XBL and NOT heard any of these things?

I take it you didn't read the "What to do" part. It would be one thing if there was nothing you could do and were forced with either listening to it or just not playing. MS isn't your mommy or daddy. MS has provided you with everything you need to enjoy your experience on XBL. They just expect you to have the common sense to use it. it isn't thier job to protect you from anything you might find offensive that another might say over thier headset. They have simply said you are a big boy or girl if someone is screaming, threatening or doing whatever you might not like you can do something about it. And at the same time for the good of the whole community (not in the best interest of any special interest group or demographic the whole community) lets not put certain things in your profile. If you cannot abide by this simple rule you risk being banned. It is no different here at The Escapist. The "no trolling" rule is there not because they are dicks. It is there for the good of the community as a whole. If you insist on trolling you will be banned. You don't get to troll since you belong to a minority or a special interest group or a specific demographic. the law doesn't see race, gender or anything else. It is thier for one and all. The only way a troll skates scott free is when you and I don't report it. Then we can't then blame the mods for letting the troll skate when we didn't do our part to stop it. Which is exactly what is happening when the excuse:

"Well I have seen other profiles in violation of the Code of Conduct."

"Did you report it"

"No"

So you didn't do your part out of sheer laziness and then expect MS to do thiers?

Not laziness, apathy; read what I typed up there. What part of my statement made you think I agree with their code of conduct, want to help them enforce it, or want ms to ban anybody? I think gamers should be able to state what kind of people they like to have sex with and really don't care what these kids yell out on xbl because I usually don't care when I wear the headset and when I do get annoyed, I'll put any jerks in their place myself: I wasn't that d-bag who always told the teacher when she forgot to assign homework. And besides, they pay for it, they can say whatever they want on it as far as I'm concerned. If MS want to be nazis, they can regulate everything themselves: I don't work for them and I'm not going to turn people in because they don't want to live by those rules.

What I find very illuminating is that the dbags who do go to MS saying that the lesbian scares them don't also "cry to mommy" about all of these screamers, yellers, and threateners.

 

[A random person]

The kid should be banned from life.

irl banhammar GOOOOOOOO

Spoiler: I believe the irl banhammer is something like this.

But on topic, why doesn't he communicate using the internet in general if he's agoraphobic?