An excuse for Piracy.

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deathandtaxes

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Jun 25, 2009
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Zachary Amaranth said:
manaman said:
"It's the law" arguments don't work either. Say it was the law that women can't vote, or blacks no longer are allowed to attend school past primary education.
Thankfully, people actually changed the laws regarding women and blacks. I doubt much will be done in the vein of fighting these laws, in part because piracy is primarily self serving while civil rights are not. Of course, when Martin Luther King broke the law, he still paid the price. Most acts of civil disobedience will result in some form of punishment. And it used to be that people actually paid the price. Now it seems like people want to be martyrs without any of the actual suffering.

Sorry, Charlie.

There are very few exceptions in which the laws regarding piracy are unjust. Most excuses for piracy don't trump the rights of the author or owner. Don't like it? Fine, but that doesn't make it unjust.
No you saying the piracy laws are 'just' is like suggesting that execution or forced transportation for stealing a loaf of bread in 18th century England was 'just'.

I get the feeling you have never actually read any of the laws your saying are 'just' and just assuming that they are.
 

Unorthodoxx

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Jan 28, 2009
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There really is no excuses for piracy, but in my experience I've found that you're better off just investing the money in the product. For games and software most of the versions you can get through piracy are plagued with bugs that completely ruin the game or program. And as for music, if you just spend a bit of time researching the album and perhaps reading reviews then you wouldn't really run into that problem. There is even the option to listen to tracks before you buy provided you have internet access, and it seems like many sites are now offering the complete tracks for your listening pleasure.


As for Linkin Park, I don't much care for the band and I don't think I really ever have.
 

LooK iTz Jinjo

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Feb 22, 2009
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teh_Canape said:
well, I cant give any excuse without making myself look like a cheap bastard

but come on

look at these prices and tell me if you wouldnt even think about pirating it
I thought of that too before, but a friend told me a good reasonable thought: If you pick the right game, it should last long enough until you can buy another without getting into bankruptcy.

I am from your area as well, and I can't buy more than a game each two or three months, that's why I make sure to pick the right game, a game that can last that long.

I know it's hard around here, but it's not impossible, I said goodbye to a lot of interesting titles because of it, and I won't die if I don't play it, I'm happy as long as I can pick a game I can enjoy for more than then hours.
 

The Hairminator

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Mar 17, 2009
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That's not it, you could have checked out the songs on youtube before. But you didn't. Because you're a pirate. We all seek the satisfaction of those thrills.
 

Valkyrie101

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May 17, 2010
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I don't have an excuse. I do it because it's free. It's morally wrong, but I'm more concerned about my bank balance.
 

Nazz3

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Sep 11, 2009
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Piracy is alright. You're giving your money anyways to the greedy publishers, the devs who made the game only get their salaries paid. Besides that, the games cost way too much in my opinion.

As for music, meh, its not that big of a deal imo.
 

deathandtaxes

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The Hairminator said:
That's not it, you could have checked out the songs on youtube before. But you didn't. Because you're a pirate. We all seek the satisfaction of those thrills.
No a pirate is someone who steals ships and cargo, stealing data is copyright infringement, sorry to be a pedant but isn't got nothing to do with naval law.
 

teh_Canape

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May 18, 2010
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Experimental said:
I thought of that too before, but a friend told me a good reasonable thought: If you pick the right game, it should last long enough until you can buy another without getting into bankruptcy.

I am from your area as well, and I can't buy more than a game each two or three months, that's why I make sure to pick the right game, a game that can last that long.

I know it's hard around here, but it's not impossible, I said goodbye to a lot of interesting titles because of it, and I won't die if I don't play it, I'm happy as long as I can pick a game I can enjoy for more than then hours.
well, the thing is, I mostly buy multiplayer games, and by the time I can afford them, the multiplayer scene of said games is pretty much dead


especially because I dont own next gen consoles (happened to me in bioshock 2 MP, it was a pain in the ass to find matches on pc, while on 360 there were like 5 games on each mode)
 

Jelly ^.^

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Mar 11, 2010
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I tend to stick to games that are Public Domain, as I don't usually just have a hundred bucks lying around to buy a new game with.

However, I would have no qualms with paying from a game from an Indie developer, and I would have no qualms with pirating a game from a corporate-sized developer/publisher.

Why? In two words: Consumer sovereignty.

We, the market collectively have the capacity to tell companies what we want and what we don't. Naturally we want to encourage the former and steer away from the latter.

What behaviours can we implement to succeed in these goals? Making an idea/product/service profitable and unprofitable respectively. Regardless of all the harping on about electronic gaming as a medium of artistic expression and a reason for faster, bigger (or smaller) and better technology to deliver these experiences, at the end of the day, if there is no money in games for a company that makes games, it is out of business. Some of my favourite developers, including DC True (Shadow President, Cyberjudas), Presto Studios (The Journeynman Project series, Myst 3) and to a lesser extent Access Software (shit, everything from the Tex Murphy games, Top Spin 1&2 and the Links golfing franchise)succumbed to this fate (except the latter, which was bought and sold like AIG shares the day after the reverse split before closing because of zombie invasion or some other disappointing, un-noted reason.)

For an industry as 'unecessary' to human life and survival as electronic gaming (I resent that statement as much as you do, but society would not break down if videogames were banned completely and suddenly the same way that if say... electricity or running water were banned, or become as culturally replete if painting or sculpture or television were abruptly and absurdly discontinued), the onus is completely on the companies that participate to justify their place in human society. That leaves us at an at an advantage as consumers, because we have every right to avoid every product that isn't worth as much to us for the price as say, water, or the air we breathe, and to turn down a game because we'd rather be able to afford a month's rent. One would believe that in turn, such a position would mean that all games companies would be pumping out either the most amazing or the most unique masterpieces they can. Well, as we've seen, that's not always the case. Especially in the corporate side of the industry, where we have NYSE floated companies like EA almost exclusively publishing clones of the 4 or 5 popular themes and types of modern game and them with a famous licence slapped to it.

And so, as consumers, we are supposed to either buy what we like, or leave it. However, with the advent of the ability to distribute these unecessary forms of entertainment in ways that publishers and developers would rather you didn't comes the capability for the consumer to have a say in the way the major corporate players interact with their market. More than simply walking away and passively denying profit to an inadequate or insultingly bad cash grab, we can aggressively seek to reduce the market share and profit of such. So it comes down to a question of executing consumer power. Do we passively ignore mediocrity or pure uselessness in the games we buy, or do we aggressively show companies that what they're doing isn't worth paying for? A vote with our feet, or one with our bandwidth?

EDIT:
Oh yeah. Linkin Park. Well, I haven't heard their new album, and if they play their concert in Apartheid Israel, then I won't be interested in them as a band anymore anyway.
 

Cherry Cola

Your daddy, your Rock'n'Rolla
Jun 26, 2009
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Why do people need to excuse what they do?

If you're a pirate, admit that you're an opportunist dickhead and be done with it. Nobody cares if you have an excuse.
 

Talshere

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Jan 27, 2010
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teh_Canape said:
In fairness the orange box is 5 games. Not 1.

CoD4:2 is just a rip off. They upped the price to be on par with console games despite the fact that PC ports dont have to pay licensing fees, which is the major pricing difference when you look at PC equivalent games on consoles, and are no where near as difficult to part as from console to console, meaning its far quicker and cheaper, with no additional licensing required.

Just the whole aspect of CoD4:2 is a rip off. I refused to buy it point blank. In not even sure Id take it if it was offered for free just on principle.

Basically the extra you pay goes straight into Iwards pockets.
 

deathandtaxes

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Jun 25, 2009
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Hubilub said:
Why do people need to excuse what they do?

If you're a pirate, admit that you're an opportunist dickhead and be done with it. Nobody cares if you have an excuse.
and let me reiterate for you : no a pirate is someone who steals ships and cargo, stealing data is copyright infringement.
 

teh_Canape

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May 18, 2010
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Talshere said:
snip v2.5
in all fairnessm MW2 is a pretty good game on it's own (yes, I said it, dealwithit.png)

and the prices there are not only because of they are legit (piracy is pretty big here) but those two are especially expensive because they're imports
 

DanielSPG

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Nov 10, 2009
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blakfayt said:
(I for one think it's insane that a copyright for music lasts for 75 years after an artist dies.
funny story actually. It used to be 40 years after the copyright was given. No matter if the artist was alive or not. But then Mickey turned 40. So they changed the law. Seriously, ur child friendly company called Disney has the power and influence to change the law if enough money is involved,

blakfayt said:
Who the fuck is making his money then? I'll give you three guesses, and the fact that the music industry takes about 70% of all money made via record sales, you should get it right fairly quick) but the industry just wants to put everyone in jail, basically taking away all potential sales from every project they have. Think about it, their potential sales argument is negated by their actions, it's like saying "if you can't pay me I'll kill you" dead men make no money, and what are the chances that a woman of 35 is gonna come up with a million dollars to pay the industry back after they sue her? Like hell.
Also we only charge money for finite things, (things that there are limited number of) before the internet there were only so many CD/records of a single album, now that the internet exists anyone can get a copy at any time, why the hell should some one get paid? Talent? Ok, you let me know when everyone should send their money to Leonardo for painting the Mona Lisa that we have all probably viewed a virtual copy of on the internet before. Same difference. I'm an aspiring musician, I've recently started to learn how to play guitar and I'm working on vocals and I'm pretty good at writing, so I'm gonna join the music industry one day, but I'm sure as hell not gonna be like all the other rock stars who complain that their millions of dollars won't keep paying the insurance on their priceless vehicles. Let's be honest, we pay hollywood too much money now, why the hell do they need more? Tell you what, when every rock star in the world sells their highly expensive old cars and gives that money to the poor I'll stop downloading the occasional album (only downloaded one album in the past three months, only had two good songs, go figure).
I agree with you wholeheartedly that the music industry's roll in current music REproduction is overrated. Why some1 should get paid for making music that is available on the internet? Cus it's a day job... I'm sure you can play the guitar quite nicely and you singing is lovely etc.. But if you want to make quality recordings and good music, it will either take you decades to finish one album or you wont have time to earn your living. That and you gotta record the shit. Dont give me crap about home recordings U want something to sound professional u go to a studio.

In other words, producing the music of professional quality still costs money. The persons producing the music will want to pay rent, eat etc and still be full time profesional musicians. So if you don't pay for an mp3 online, how will they get paid? Live shows are a great example, but not every musician or music genre will play live. The answer just isn't that simple.

So how do we keep it fair? You make a good point when you say the artists don;t need the money after they die. So consider this. A musician makes a song. He charges an hour rate for his time writing the song, he adds production costs to this, this added up gives us figure X. This musician, in order to keep being a musician professionally, must earn X off this song. As soon as X is reached the music can then be freely available. So how are we going to achieve this? Let the musician do his own promotion, charging X/(expected amount of copies distributed) per copy? Think about the promotion a -beginning- professional musician would have to do to get people to notice his or her song between the millions of songs available on the internet already. And what if X is reached. Stop selling the song? or offer it for free? That would be unfair to the people that DID actually pay in the period before X was reached. So maybe the artist should simply sell the song for X to an external distributor. In which case we're almost back to the original situation of the "music industry" Reproducing your music. Like I said, I don;t have the answers. I know saying: music should be free, period. is definitely NOT the answer, nor is piracy.
 

LadyMint

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Apr 22, 2010
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I'm not really a fan of Linkin Park. But, I understand your sentiment with downloading/piracy.

I would prefer to pay for something rather than pirating it, but at times that option isn't available for what I'm specifically looking for. Like episodes of a TV show that I don't have access to for one reason or another. And while I know people scoff at the "try before you buy" argument, as someone who purchases PC games more often than console ones, I find it to be the most accurate excuse for me. I have become a dedicated and paying fan of a few franchises thanks to "borrowing" a copy from someone. I've also saved myself money by finding out that a game wasn't as enjoyable as I thought it would be based on reviews and footage.

I don't pretend to be some champion for consumer justice trying to justify piracy. I just know that some companies wouldn't have me as a paying customer at all if I hadn't tried their product for free first.
 

Talshere

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teh_Canape said:
Talshere said:
snip v2.5
in all fairnessm MW2 is a pretty good game on it's own (yes, I said it, dealwithit.png)

and the prices there are not only because of they are legit (piracy is pretty big here) but those two are especially expensive because they're imports
The campaign is by all accounts very good, even if it dropped the whole "realism bid". But its no longer then the MW1 campain, and they buggered over the online aspect because they removed player hosted servers in favour of the crappy P2P system consoles have to suffer, then surprise surprise they try and sell us map pack, things that previously we've never had to do because the the PLAYERS generated hundreds of maps of equal quality. Possibly even better.

But if we are paying over the odds by £5-£10, then taking into account how much more the pound and dollar are worth, piled on top of the fact they are imports, is it any wonder they are stupidly overpriced. No game is worth 40 quid for what....8 hours worth of campaign?
 

orangecharger

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Nov 13, 2009
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Interesting links regarding Canada's copyright laws, it's media levy, and the Supreme Court's view on P2P file sharing in Canada.

http://www.michaelgeist.ca/content/view/2238/125/

http://www.billboard.biz/bbbiz/content_display/industry/e3i31d64fe32d365c0270aa4c9f526c985f

Um the only time Linkin Park was sort of cool was 10 years ago? Wait no I am thinking of Limp Bizkit -- Linkin Park was never cool.
 

8-Bit Grin

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Apr 20, 2010
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I don't make excuses, I admit that I'm a penny pincher like a mature human being.

Video games are a hobby, and food is a necessity.

In order to eat what I'd like and at the same time have fun, I sometimes 'pirate' games.

It's a very selfish way of thinking, but I never claimed to be a selfless individual.
 

quantumsoul

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Jun 10, 2010
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I've done some some pirating. I have no need to justify it nor am I proud of it. I just didn't want to spend the money. Did Black Beard need to justify his piracy? Of course not. We all sometimes do bad things out of selfishness. Just don't do it all the time or buy after you like it.