Analyst: EA's Spent $500 Million On The Old Republic

SkeletonGuy

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May 25, 2011
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You guys underestimate how much marketing costs, just to refresh your memories microsoft spent 500 million dollaroos only advertising the kinect, and now EA is pulling the same kind of times square stunts and a commercial every 5 seconds on spike tv.

The actual dev costs might not be even a fraction of that, maybe pachter wasn't so far off when he said dev costs might only be $80m then they spent the rest on marketing

P.S. I think if this game fails it won't be a good thing since up to 300 people could lose their jobs but I don't want it to succeed, maybe if it does badly we won't see more WoW clones and no more franchise cash-ins, I don't want an assassins creed mmo or an elder scrolls mmo or any crap like that
 

Me55enger

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I believe RTW took this calibre of risk with APB.

And that is a game that deserves infinately more than Star Wars: Taken Orally, Rectum.
 

Me55enger

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Zing said:
MMO developers need to get their head out and gain some fucking innovation and creativity.
Saw this after I posted.

You sir, are the making of a legend.

As a game genre so reliant on the devotion of time from its fanbase, whoever wants to dethrone WoW needs creativity and innovation.

Top marks there.
 

Genixma

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Sep 22, 2009
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I think the only thing I am worried about is that the title reads "EA's spend $500 Million on The Old Republic." why I am worried about it? I expected it to say "And it shows" o_o But it seems it doesn't.
 

flaviok79

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Feb 22, 2011
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Well, I love Bioware and hope the game succeed's. If it comes to consoles, I'll buy it. But such inflated budgets for games attached to movies' franchises bring to my memory the Atari-ET fiasco that caused the entire videogame industry to crash in the early 80's.
 

Durgiun

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Orks da best said:
Durgiun said:
Orks da best said:
Durgiun said:
Please let it fail, please let it fail, please let it fail.
what ye want swtor to flop. you do know what would happen if it did right?
I'm guessing a lot of people at EA and BioWare would be fired? I dunno, I'm not a businessman.
It would also lead to further stagnation in the mmo industy, and likly in other parts too. and do we want further stagnation?
Point well taken, but I honestly don't give a rat's about MMOs.
 

Ukomba

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What makes this annalist any more credible than the dozen other annalists? Most of the others were predicting a price tag around 300 million. So unless this guy wants to show some hard numbers some where, I see no reason to believe he's correct. To quote Al Gore:

"Two thousand scientists, in a hundred countries, engaged in the most elaborate, well organized scientific collaboration in the history of humankind, have produced long-since a consensus that" SWTOR cost 300 Million to make.

But then, big numbers make headlines. How long until an annalist shows up prediction 700 Million?
 

Treblaine

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cieply said:
Treblaine said:
Omnific One said:
Hey, maybe if this fails and EA gets annoyed, they might try to sell Bioware. And you know a company with a ton of investment capital? Bethesda. That would be a dream come true.
The only way you will get Bioware (with its current value) from EA is from their cold dead hands, i.e if the company descends into bankruptcy and is forcibly liquidated and to sell off all their assets before they are shut down.

That, or all the STAFF of Bioware quit in a mass exodus and effectively set up a clone company like Respawn Software from Infinity Ward. Of course if Bioware suddenly forget how to make good games and stop making profit EA might sell, but then it is more likely the studio will be liquidated than sold.
You are aware that according to their financial report EA failed to generate profit for several consecutive years (at their lowest point, their loses were 25% bigger than their revenue)? Since the release of TOR and, despite of what all the paid reviews say (I will never forgive escapist Dragon Age 2 blunder and nighter should you), poor reception and tons of bugs, stocks of EA plummeted to the ground. Right now their executives are selling their own stock in EA en masse. Just interesting facts worth knowing.

I have no idea how escapist can say that this game has a positive lunch with statistics showing 30-40% drop in players during the FREE month (http://www.swtorarena.com/statistics/)
Well, as much as I'd like to pop a bottle of champagne and cheer the vanquishing of the EAvil Empire, but I'm afraid I've seen companies go as long as a decade making losses but staying alive by various "too big to fail" tricks and loans and conniving. They could go busto, but they ain't gone till the bailiffs arrive to strip their offices of any valuable furniture.

I want EA gone because of Origin and I know they are too proud to ever back down, they will keep up their bullshit until we relent and they get their evil way with their endorsed spyware. They
 

Treblaine

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Peuter said:
Treblaine said:
Omnific One said:
Hey, maybe if this fails and EA gets annoyed, they might try to sell Bioware. And you know a company with a ton of investment capital? Bethesda. That would be a dream come true.
The only way you will get Bioware (with its current value) from EA is from their cold dead hands, i.e if the company descends into bankruptcy and is forcibly liquidated and to sell off all their assets before they are shut down.
Everyone refusing to buy and play the $500 million costing SW:TOR would be a step in the right direction.


If it bleeds (money) we can kill it

Awesomeness ==> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlicWUDf5MM <== Awesomeness
 

Ironic Pirate

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008Zulu said:
I read $500 million and my right eyebrow shot up so high it flew right off my face.

It will be years before they make their money back, if at all. Right now all the servers are based in America yeah and they have said that anywhere outside will have lag issues? Do they really expect America's 300 million population to buy 1.5 copies each? To say nothing about the subscription fees.
Wait, does the game only cost a dollar? Otherwise your math is a bit... off.

Anyway, notice that an Analyst said this? Michael Pachter is an analyst. That's the level of accuracy we're dealing with here.
 

Sonic Doctor

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Jan 9, 2010
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isometry said:
Your speculating numbers are way too low.

You immediately give it a huge drop off of 1 million of it's subscribers disappearing. Which, considering the reviews and full reception of the game, I'm easily willing to accept that it won't go under 2 million for at least a year. But, you also don't look at the period that should be coming in the next few months, as with most every MMO, they will start offering free trials. I seriously believe that in the first few months they can gain at least 3 million free trial players, and at least hold 1.5 million of them maybe even more as subscribers.

So by the end of the year, we are looking at at least 3.5 million subscribers. But, it rather short sighted to only look at one years time. TOR is built to last and last as long as WoW has. I'll cut it down a bit and say the game keeps steady for 5 years.

Let's say, and it isn't that out there to say it, that after this year, TOR holds onto at least 3.5 million subscribers for another year. Do the math:

3,500,000 X 15 = 52,500,000 in one month. 52.5 mil X 12 = 630,000,000 for that year. Now I'm not even counting the purchasing of the game over the first year. Let's estimate that every one of that 3.5 mil buy the game at the 60 dollar cost. 3.5 mil X 60 = 210,000,000. Now on top of that, I'll add in what I speculate they will make on subscriptions as the game grows before the end of this first year: My speculation is at least 400 million and having at least 3.5 million players by the end of the year and holding that number for at least the next year.

So adding up those two years, we are looking at (first year with subs + game buys) 610 million, adding the 630 million from the second year of subs, that is 1.24 billion dollars in just two years alone, with possibly a plus or minus at least 200 million as a safe margin for error estimation. Now if it stays that stable for another 3 years, tack on another 1.89 billion to the number.

That is just 5 years, a safe estimate of 3.13 billion. Now, lets compare that to my estimates of three regular cross platform KotOR games, using your numbers. Now let's give BioWare and EA the benefit of the doubt and say they properly develop each KotOR game and each game has a development cycle of at least two years for each game. Let's say as you said, they only spend 100 mil on each game for production, that's 300 mil, but I'll also count in the advertising for the games, I'll be stingy on that and say they only spend 50 mil on advertising for each game. So in total over 6 years they would have spent 450 million on the three games. Now lets say that each game only gets 3 mil copies sold each, subtracting some from what TOR makes in box sales, because single player KotOR games would lose a portion of the demographic that TOR hits.

So total over three games 9 mil copies sold multiplied by 60 dollars for each copy, that equals 540,000,000. Subtract 450 mil, and you are looking at only a 90 mil profit over 6 years. That isn't much, so let's give them a positive handicap, and say that some how the games sell 3 mill on each platform, PC, 360, and PS3. That is now a 270 million dollar profit.

Now, let's look at TOR profit margin over 6 years, speculating another good 3.5 million subscriber year, for a number of 3.76 billion over 6 years. Now lets give them a high yearly run cost of 100 mil a year, so 600 mil added to the original 500 mil, that is 1.1 billion in expenses over 6 years. So in the end by my calculations, TOR would have a profit of 2.66 billion over those 6 years. That way over shines three cross platform KotOR games over six years.

Now, I'll be even more generous to the 3 KotOR games and give TOR a negative handicap from my estimation and say what if they only make half of my estimated profits, and they only make 1.33 billion, well that still would mean that TOR would out shine those 3 KotOR games by just barely under 5 times the profit. Basically that half estimate would be a player base of only 1.75 million each year. Which isn't far off from your yearly of only 1 million.

The thing that makes your calculation too small, is that you are not thinking of the demographics that TOR hits, it hits more demographics than WoW.

WoW reaches the demographics of only Warcraft fans, MMO fans, Fantasy game fans, and Fantasy fans in general.

TOR reaches the demographics, Star Wars fans in general(vast in numbers compared to original Warcraft fans), Star Wars game fans(considering there is a larger SW game base than Warcraft game base, that means there is a bigger fan base for SW games), MMO fans, Sci-fi game fans, and Sci-fi fans in general. TOR only hits one more demographic than WoW, but since Star Wars far out shines WoW in shear number of fans, since Star Wars is way more iconic and known in history compared to WoW, the possible player base for TOR actually reaches higher than WoW's 12 million subscriber record. I'm willing to safely bet that TOR's possible player base is some where in the 60 million range each year. Of course it won't reach that as an all at once record, but with typical player adding and losing by only a WoW standard, I could safely say that TOR could possibly beat WoW's yearly subscriber record by at least a couple million.

EA/BioWare will have no problem making a decent or even better profit with TOR.
 

Vampire cat

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Apr 21, 2010
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If it cost 1/10 of this figure... It still wasn't worth it. One of my favorite universes to make a game out of, it wouldn't take much to have me banging at the door for a copy. The combat is dull and looks shit... No really, for a game THIS expensive you'd expect good looking combat! They even say in hteir "combat" trailer (it's on Youtube) that they wanted to take all those cool moves from the movies and put them into the game so that combat would look great, but it doesn't! None of the attacks seem to blend any better than WoW's combat does, which is also not a very good looking or engaging game in terms of actual gameplay. The story and quests may well be great, but that only gets me half way...

Engaging and good looking combat is possible. Heck, copying the combat from the old Jedi Academy games would almost cut it in a modern game with some polishing, and that's my aboslute favorite kind of combat system, where you make your attacks based on active key combinations rather than tapping your skills bar and waiting for the character to execute their moves.

So your left trying to roleplay in the middle of loads of running and jumping morons that there is no way around becuase this game doesn't have a single player / coop mode... Or does it? Is there one hidden somewhere, is there some way to unlock it? Oh please god, let there be...
 
Jun 5, 2010
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Haters in this thread be hatin' all up on SWTOR. I love this game, I find its going to be bigger then people say I quit WoW for it because guys seriously? your going to call this a horrible WoW clone? have you even played the game? hell, have you even played WoW. becuase I have, I have since burning crusade and SWTOR is an improvement of WoW in many ways. The majority of SWTOR haters right now are people who dont want to give up on their world of warcraft they spent so much time in and are wary of the direction its going in (pokemon and pandas) and are spewing their hate on a MMO thats doing well to try and reassure yourselves.

for me im never going back. not to warcraft.
 

ThunderCavalier

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Nov 21, 2009
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Well...

I honestly hope that this doesn't bomb, just because I have a liking for some of EA's games and for BioWare in general, and I'm afraid that this might cause some damage to them if this fails.

At the same time, though, I honestly do not care whatsoever for MMOs, so...