Anime. I don't get it
- Thread starter TheRundownRabbit
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Fair point - I've never made an effort to watch anyway but then nothing about it interests me at all. The few clips I have seen though are all pretty much the same thing.Bakaferret said:My thoughts exactly. If you lump anime into one huge category like that, your only impression of what "anime" is must be pokemon, .hack and dragon ball z.Machines Are Us said:
You must be referring to anime fanatics. I don't understand how liking a type of media makes someone the "ultimate nerd". It's like saying "I don't understand why people like TV. It's the ultimate stupid prep thing." when all you've seen is MTV reality TV shows. Honestly, there is a LOT of anime I don't like. A few shows are very intriguing though. And a few are just silly fun. Different strokes for different folks, I guess.Woodsey said:Huh? You mean like in films, TVs, books and games? I don't think you need anime for that.Greyfox105 said:It's interesting because it's better than real life
more interesting things happen. and not to the viewer, so they don't suffer the consequences.
I've never got it, never will and to me it's the ultimate nerdism. And it may be popular on here if that's what you mean, but I only know one person in real life who even acknowledges it.
Ah, this discussion never gets old, does it? Though I am kind of surprised all the discussion is front-loaded towards reason, so far. Where'd all the haters go?
Um...no. That analogy fails. Comparing folk music between countries isn't like comparing Japanese and US cartoons (those are media). It's like comparing, say, Japanese and US action cartoons (Mobile Suit Gundam vs. GI Joe, let's say).theklng said:
Baseball= Men can scratch their members in public and not be reprimanded for it.Del-Toro said:
Football= Homophobic homosexuals can express their feelings for one another.
Lost= You don't have to watch it or hear about it as often as Twilight
Twilight= Shows smarter people how retarded society has become. hopefully bringing on a revolution of epic win and less lolcats.
Technically Avatar is a cartoon, but it drew heavy influences from anime. And it rocked.TheFacelessOne said:
Also, the plague of "I don't get X, why is it popular" threads must stop. I mean, if you don't like something: ok, fine. You don't like it. But questioning why other people like it is rather pointless. It's like asking people what they see in a piece of art, or why they like a particular flavor of ice cream.
To its credit, Akira wasn't finished when the movie was shown. It took a full two years after the movie's release before its author completed it.bulbasaur said:
The difference between anime and western cartoons, is that as a general rule western cartoons are not viewed as even having the potentiality to be a legitimate artform. Some anime really is just pointless entertainment, but some anime tells deep meaningful stories. This is anime's strength, it's ability to address serious issues in a way that western cartoons may never be able to.
I've never liked it. In fact it gives me a headache. I guess it's the low framerate action and unrealistic art style. Also the ridiculous hairstyles.
Often, I believe, why some like it so much is because it's japanese. And to some Japan is some sort of magical super mysterious übercountry. Everything that is even slightly japanese is somehow superior to anything else. And then they want to be japanese and express this by mixing Japanese into their speech, dressing like they THINK people dress in Japan and act like they THINK the japanese do. I find that deeply disturbing. (Although that has very little to do with anime, I associate it with general nipponophilia)
Often, I believe, why some like it so much is because it's japanese. And to some Japan is some sort of magical super mysterious übercountry. Everything that is even slightly japanese is somehow superior to anything else. And then they want to be japanese and express this by mixing Japanese into their speech, dressing like they THINK people dress in Japan and act like they THINK the japanese do. I find that deeply disturbing. (Although that has very little to do with anime, I associate it with general nipponophilia)
NeutralDrow said:
... no. folk music is different from country to country, just as cartoons in countries may vary. i have first hand seen the difference in japanese, slavic/middle-eastern and western cartoons. you argue that anime isn't a genre because you can have different subgenres. let me shatter that for you: an action anime is also an anime. a romantic anime is also an anime. thus, anime is the super genre for all subgenres of anime.
Perhaps I can shed some light on this; I'm not the oldest anime fan but I've been around long enough to see its fandom turn into something entirely different from what it was.
America used to view animation as something for kids only. Kids are stupidly easy to impress. After 20 years I watched Thundercats and the opening sequence still rocked but the dialogue was contrived, the characters were flat, the plots were simple (and contrived to resolve in 20 minutes), and for all the weaponry involved combat was pretty weak--no blades cut skin. But at ages 6-12, we loved this crap. We watched those 30-minute toy commercials and begged mom for everything. Then we moved on to better stuff before you could say "7th grade."
That was America. Japan had no such view on animation. Japan didn't have America's billions and was open to telling stories through animation because it was cheaper. Japan had a culture where the visual novel (manga) was a valid, professional way to relay information and stories. Japan never went through anything like America's 1950's where the Senate brainwashed parents into thinking comics "rot the brain." Japan also has a samurai-rooted culture and the side effect is that half-assed work is not acceptable.
Dragon Ball Z went underground in the states around the mid-90s. It did things no American cartoon had ever done before. People FOUGHT. Not that bullshit where a stray laser beam hits a cave wall and rocks separate heroes and villains. Not that bullshit where someone trips, gets caught, goes to jail, and escapes. Dragon Ball Z was the first time I saw what high-powered combat REALLY might have been like. They punched HARD. They BLED. And you know what else? They CURSED. Animated characters displaying human frustration and rage--things kept off the stage by America's "protect the kids (from shit we do)" culture.
And DBZ was the weaker one. Bubble Gum Crisis 2032 deals with life after the apocalypse, corporate greed run amok, and having to face your friends on the battlefield. Gundam shows war without claiming one side is "evil," but taking the more realistic route and showing that both sides have opposing viewpoints. Ranma 1/2 is one of the funniest things you will ever see but America is to anti-transgender to ever welcome it to television. (Japan doesn't have Jerry Fallwell.)
Seeing that there was animation that grew up with me, I had to get my hands on it. When you have to get something that is hard to get, you need DEDICATION. You have to be clever. You have to learn who has what. I even got a book and learned some Japanese so I could find things more easily. We had to band together. There was no Internet, Facebook, Myspace, or cell phones. It was damn hard to find other people that even knew about anime, let alone had something you didn't. (I airbrushed Goku on the back of a denim jacket. That got noticed only by those who knew it. I can't do that now; everyone knows Goku.)
We formed clubs. Communities. When the internet came up we created info sites. We put conventions together. We told as many people as we could about this great stuff that wasn't like anything you got in America. We got jobs and became consumers. WE CREATED A CUSTOMER BASE THAT MADE IT WORTHWHILE FOR CORPORATIONS TO SPEND BIG MONEY ON LICENSING AND PRODUCTION. That was the end of the fandom I knew.
Circa 2000 the flood gates opened. DBZ and Pokemon hit TV, then Yuugi-Oh. A generation many times larger than ours was introduced to anime not as this wildly different thing that was hard to get, but as something cool on TV. You turn it on and it's there.
-----------------------
History lesson over. So what's the big deal about anime?
It's the Japanese way of using animation to tell a story. Beyond the style of art it involves rich characters, an intelligent handling of the subject matter, and treating your audience like thinking beings instead of simple children. Avatar is anime. Its creators have adapted Japan's way.
Even Pokemon has deeper levels. Pokemon is about attaining personal growth by working to understand the different beings around you. Ashe doesn't succeed until he learns to trust and understand Pikachuu. The original Japanese opening theme explains this (in metaphor), but was replaced by America's marketing jingle "Gotta catch 'em all."
Edit: This is not to say Japan is incapable of producing cheap bullshit to sell to the kids. Only anime's best and brightest (or at least what is deemed "sellable") get picked up by corporations and sent across the planet. When we say "anime," we're talking about that "best and brightest" subset of all animated material from Japan.
America used to view animation as something for kids only. Kids are stupidly easy to impress. After 20 years I watched Thundercats and the opening sequence still rocked but the dialogue was contrived, the characters were flat, the plots were simple (and contrived to resolve in 20 minutes), and for all the weaponry involved combat was pretty weak--no blades cut skin. But at ages 6-12, we loved this crap. We watched those 30-minute toy commercials and begged mom for everything. Then we moved on to better stuff before you could say "7th grade."
That was America. Japan had no such view on animation. Japan didn't have America's billions and was open to telling stories through animation because it was cheaper. Japan had a culture where the visual novel (manga) was a valid, professional way to relay information and stories. Japan never went through anything like America's 1950's where the Senate brainwashed parents into thinking comics "rot the brain." Japan also has a samurai-rooted culture and the side effect is that half-assed work is not acceptable.
Dragon Ball Z went underground in the states around the mid-90s. It did things no American cartoon had ever done before. People FOUGHT. Not that bullshit where a stray laser beam hits a cave wall and rocks separate heroes and villains. Not that bullshit where someone trips, gets caught, goes to jail, and escapes. Dragon Ball Z was the first time I saw what high-powered combat REALLY might have been like. They punched HARD. They BLED. And you know what else? They CURSED. Animated characters displaying human frustration and rage--things kept off the stage by America's "protect the kids (from shit we do)" culture.
And DBZ was the weaker one. Bubble Gum Crisis 2032 deals with life after the apocalypse, corporate greed run amok, and having to face your friends on the battlefield. Gundam shows war without claiming one side is "evil," but taking the more realistic route and showing that both sides have opposing viewpoints. Ranma 1/2 is one of the funniest things you will ever see but America is to anti-transgender to ever welcome it to television. (Japan doesn't have Jerry Fallwell.)
Seeing that there was animation that grew up with me, I had to get my hands on it. When you have to get something that is hard to get, you need DEDICATION. You have to be clever. You have to learn who has what. I even got a book and learned some Japanese so I could find things more easily. We had to band together. There was no Internet, Facebook, Myspace, or cell phones. It was damn hard to find other people that even knew about anime, let alone had something you didn't. (I airbrushed Goku on the back of a denim jacket. That got noticed only by those who knew it. I can't do that now; everyone knows Goku.)
We formed clubs. Communities. When the internet came up we created info sites. We put conventions together. We told as many people as we could about this great stuff that wasn't like anything you got in America. We got jobs and became consumers. WE CREATED A CUSTOMER BASE THAT MADE IT WORTHWHILE FOR CORPORATIONS TO SPEND BIG MONEY ON LICENSING AND PRODUCTION. That was the end of the fandom I knew.
Circa 2000 the flood gates opened. DBZ and Pokemon hit TV, then Yuugi-Oh. A generation many times larger than ours was introduced to anime not as this wildly different thing that was hard to get, but as something cool on TV. You turn it on and it's there.
-----------------------
History lesson over. So what's the big deal about anime?
It's the Japanese way of using animation to tell a story. Beyond the style of art it involves rich characters, an intelligent handling of the subject matter, and treating your audience like thinking beings instead of simple children. Avatar is anime. Its creators have adapted Japan's way.
Even Pokemon has deeper levels. Pokemon is about attaining personal growth by working to understand the different beings around you. Ashe doesn't succeed until he learns to trust and understand Pikachuu. The original Japanese opening theme explains this (in metaphor), but was replaced by America's marketing jingle "Gotta catch 'em all."
Edit: This is not to say Japan is incapable of producing cheap bullshit to sell to the kids. Only anime's best and brightest (or at least what is deemed "sellable") get picked up by corporations and sent across the planet. When we say "anime," we're talking about that "best and brightest" subset of all animated material from Japan.
If you want to start with anime, Start with Akira. Then move on to something else. Now if you want to read manga, start with Akira. Then move on to something else. Now Akira is responsible for introducing Anime for the second and final time. Astroboy was the first and was not as critically acclaimed as until Akira itself made the genre of anime as a landmark on the U.S. People are going to have different opinions of the movie, but all I have to say is that if it were not for this movie.Anime and manga would not have been introduced to you, the fans and questioners alike (well, I suppose the questioners are going to probably wish that anime had never existed).
A lot of people who read shonen, and who are still 30+ need to grow up with their tastes. I see 23-30 year olds who read manga who should be reading something to more of their age. Sure they have their "individual" tastes but at the same time they are old enough to discern that the manga that they are reading is a little too young. We have heard of the saying "act your own age" but to evolve in terms of the maturity of your taste is something that we should also try to attempt, and if it is not for us, then we should retreat and stay in our comfort zone.
A lot of people who read shonen, and who are still 30+ need to grow up with their tastes. I see 23-30 year olds who read manga who should be reading something to more of their age. Sure they have their "individual" tastes but at the same time they are old enough to discern that the manga that they are reading is a little too young. We have heard of the saying "act your own age" but to evolve in terms of the maturity of your taste is something that we should also try to attempt, and if it is not for us, then we should retreat and stay in our comfort zone.
Most anime (though not all) is immature in some deep way. Not that I can't and don't enjoy quite a few of them despite of it, but still...
Maybe it's because the writers seem to have no grasp of subtle character development. Seriously, suddenly bursting into over dramatized monologue about their inner workings at the least bit of provocation? Or opening up in a up during dialogue slashing out every second sentence like it's a life changing truth you've kept inside you for years, other characters gasping for air at that like it was the most shocking thing they've ever heard? (Why do they always even care so deeply about every detail of the main character's soul life so much, it just doesn't make any sense... a fricking classic Mary Sue move.)
And in general, why do anime characters need to express their toughts and emotions in so damn dramatically (literally yelling the last sentence of their whichever deep or "deep" rants way more often that is reasonable... the character they are talking to gasping air and otherwise looking more shocked than the situation warrants).
Not the case in all anime, but very often. Just too theatrical, too often, to the point it just becomes awkward.
And despite being incredebly blunt in the terms of story telling technique, they still of manage to make it incomprehensible half the time.
Maybe it's because the writers seem to have no grasp of subtle character development. Seriously, suddenly bursting into over dramatized monologue about their inner workings at the least bit of provocation? Or opening up in a up during dialogue slashing out every second sentence like it's a life changing truth you've kept inside you for years, other characters gasping for air at that like it was the most shocking thing they've ever heard? (Why do they always even care so deeply about every detail of the main character's soul life so much, it just doesn't make any sense... a fricking classic Mary Sue move.)
And in general, why do anime characters need to express their toughts and emotions in so damn dramatically (literally yelling the last sentence of their whichever deep or "deep" rants way more often that is reasonable... the character they are talking to gasping air and otherwise looking more shocked than the situation warrants).
Not the case in all anime, but very often. Just too theatrical, too often, to the point it just becomes awkward.
And despite being incredebly blunt in the terms of story telling technique, they still of manage to make it incomprehensible half the time.
I don't understand how you don't get it. Anime is like american comics, a genre with a large variety of consepts. Sure some are close to impossible to understand why they get so populare, but the same things can be said in all of the western comicgenre.
Oh well, i guess it's all about each mans taste.
Oh well, i guess it's all about each mans taste.
In general, my guess is just that some people (like me) like anime artstyles and tropes.
Also, since it can never be said enough, anime is a rather broad thing. There's almost certainly something out there you would like. If I may recommend a good gateway series, I'll recommend Cowboy Bebop. Pretty much everyone without exception likes that series.
Also, since it can never be said enough, anime is a rather broad thing. There's almost certainly something out there you would like. If I may recommend a good gateway series, I'll recommend Cowboy Bebop. Pretty much everyone without exception likes that series.
I started watching FLCL and if you watch it for a long time, images of Japanese, Anti-American Propaganda will be burned into your eyes.
LOL
LOL
The escapist is advertising an Anime Festival..........In New York
whats next, Capitilist Convention in Russia or AA meetings in Ireland
whats next, Capitilist Convention in Russia or AA meetings in Ireland
Its just a form of entertainment for geeks like movies or comic books. There's really no difference in regular animation and Anime. It just, for some reason, appeals to nerds more. Most likely because it always has a very relatable protaginest fighting for the love of the hottest girl in the world with some supernatural shit thrown in for good measure.
Like I said, for nerds. In other words, me.
Like I said, for nerds. In other words, me.