Atheism Vs. Anti-Theism

[Isaac Dodgson]

Getting back to the OP for a second...

The confusion between the two groups, Atheists and Anti Theists can be related to the confusion children have when you try to explain to them that all squares are rectangles, but not all rectangles are squares. All Anti Theists happen to be Atheists, but not all Atheists are Anti Theists, and this confusion, not to mention ignorance of the two groups would be part of the reason why most Atheists get more riticule than they deserve...

People are fundamentally retarded as a whole, I mean I can remember someone claiming to me that they were an Agnostic Jew... Nearly had an aneurism trying to comprehend how he arrived at that conclusion

 

[hcselaw]

Am i the only one who pretends to respect the beliefs of others, but really thinks that everyone else is mentaly ill?

 

[Limasol]

Christopher Hitchens is an anti-theist, because he is opposed to religion, i am a staunch Atheist. The difference between us is while he would like to personally beat down every world religion i would simply prefer is religion disappeared.

 

[Moloch-De]

I go with teh agnostic crowd. I mean no atheist can prove to me that there is is absolutly no higher power or at least something mysterious in the univers. In fact if he trys i have the failsave backup of Heisenberg and he will stay with me at least until we get some serious quantum computing running

For the other side i think religions have good sides e.g. rules you follow without the need of a policeforc to enforce them.
The problem starts when Belivers get together in Numbers because than they get power and mainly use it to do verry irrational stuff. Examples are the Crusades, terrorist attacks and not one unce less frightening the fact that some kids in the U.S wnon't be taught scientific facts like evolution.
I wouldn't tell someone to stop belive in god or the Flyng-Spagethi-Monster unless they can do harm that way and since (i assume) we all live in differend democratic countrys they actually can.
this comic illustrates it really well:
http://xkcd.com/154/

 

[Nightfalke]

What I'm getting at is; if everyone is flawed, what gives these specific people the unique ability and right to tell everyone else how to achieve perfection?
Nothing, nothing more than the fact that they claim that the God who created all peoples equal would give them, and them alone, the right answer.

What gives a particle physicist the right to tell everyone that they are made of quarks? What gives them the unique ability and right?

If you say training, education, and a knack for physics, then you have my answer for what gives the clergy the answers (Except swap physics for theology...). Again, speaking only for Catholicism, because that is what I believe, a priest basically gets a masters degree before he becomes a priest. Are priests perfect? No more than you or I. But that is also why there are many different schools of thought on theology.

 

[WhitemageofDOOM]

Why is there a REASON for anything? Why do causes have effects and vice versa?

What we perceive to be chaos is, in fact, order; effects determined by causes too complex or abstract to comprehend easily.

You've got it wrong, humans are designed by evolution to find pattern and order, we are so good at finding patterns we find them where none exist.
The universe is fundamentally chaotic. There is no underlying order, no hidden variable, no rhyme or reason.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

Reductio Ad Absurdum. Bad argument.
It might be that there might be a kink in my train of thought, but I don't see a reductio ab absurdum in it.

Brief resume : Invisible rhinos not existing doesn't imply that Unseen Entities also don't exist.

Proof : Wind Power.

 

[Xaryn Mar]

Am i the only one who pretends to respect the beliefs of others, but really thinks that everyone else is mentaly ill?

Probably (sp?) not. I get that thought sometimes, especially after hearing/reading something some retarded believer has done or said.

 

[sequio]

If i were trolling i'd say something like "All atheists are retarded." I was commenting on my own observation of the massive ego stroking taking place. The fact that you take my comment as trolling only re-affirms the idea that you have a massive ego.

Well this has put me in rather much of a dilemma.
Nothing you've claimed obviously, my own claims.
If you wheren't a troll, you wouldn't have made a post that does not at all contribute to the subject, neither would it be offending to anyone reading it.
Yet again you confirm that you're a troll by slinging another insult at me.

Now the dilemma I spoke off:
If I had not responded to your post, it would mean I could not answer.
However since you're a troll, I'm obviously being trolled by doing so :/

Mjeh, I rather make a fool out of myself THAN LET SOMEONE BE WRONG ON THE INTERNETS.

My orignal comment was never directed at you, it was an observation of this thread in general. Per my response, the fact you took my comment as to be directed specifically at you shows how self involved you are to think that a random passerby would single you out; I only responded because you replied to my comment. To say my post was offending to others (specifically you and apparently no one else to warrant a reply) and therefore an attempt at trolling is ridiculous. It was only offending to you because you took it personally, and since you take such ambivalence as an affront the problem is clearly with you and you alone. I'm calling the kettle black, i.e. people affirming with like minded people about what they already believed. That is circle jerking, that is ego, and you have it too. Get over it.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

Like the smoking topic, as long as you don't push it in our faces, we don't mind what you do.

Probably also applies to 99% of the topics here.

 

[mtk2a]

Why is there a REASON for anything? Why do causes have effects and vice versa?

What we perceive to be chaos is, in fact, order; effects determined by causes too complex or abstract to comprehend easily.

You've got it wrong, humans are designed by evolution to find pattern and order, we are so good at finding patterns we find them where none exist.
The universe is fundamentally chaotic. There is no underlying order, no hidden variable, no rhyme or reason.

lol. Then why is the atomic mass of an atom of hydrogen always 1.00794 amu? Why is the gravitational constant 6.67300 x 10^-11 m^3 kg^-1 s^-2? Why are water molecules always composed of 2 hydrogen and 1 oxygen? Why does 2+2 always equal 4?

"ur wrong"

 

[Jobz]

Spoiler: Khell On Being Anti-Theist

Die hard Anti-Theist here. Not the randomly-pick-a-fight kind, I like to think I'm as open minded as how you describe true atheists.

I hate religion. I think it is mostly a crutch for weak willed people, but it does have its uses from time to time. My problem with faith stems not from the belief in a higher power, but in the belief in all the dogma surrounding each religion.

On its own, the whole love everybody aspects of most religions is a good thing, and I have no problem with people who simply try to live an honest and kind life. I don't go picking fights with people like this, it's the bible belts, fundamentalists, and religious activists I abhor. More though than I hate the hardline religious nuts, I actually have more loathing for the middle-ground people. The ones who believe they have to live by the bible's rules, or by what the church says. Not hardcore like the fundies, but the kind of person who will tell you they can't work on a Sunday because it's a sin.

Why would I hate these people? They aren't as dangerous as fundamentalists, they aren't shoving it in my face like evangelists... It's because they are SHEEP. It's one thing to take the lessons of a book like the bible and apply them to your life, it's a whole other thing to follow the rules as laid out. A book written over two thousand years in the past by multiple anonymous sources, translated multiple times throughout the ages, and filled with propaganda in each revision... You're going to follow THAT as if it's the word of God? Grow a fucking brain.

God does not care what you do/don't eat. God does not hold any day of the week as holy. God does not consider sex a sin. These are all things a man has written in to suit his own purpose. The Mormons are the most shining example of his bullshittery, the Book of Mormon being the work of a normal man with no more connection to God than any other living being, an elaborate lie to shape a society in his preferred style. I'm not saying you can't take away some good wholesome values from the Book of Mormon, or the Bible, or event the Koran... But to live your life by its scriptures is fucking pathetic.

So I am an anti-theist. I don't believe in God, I don't believe in Religion, but I don't believe that means we should do away with all the good it can bring even if it is a falsehood... But I DO believe that you shouldn't go too far with faith, and I fight any attempt to turn people into sheep.

You sir, have a way to make me see the logic even in things I disagree with and typically dislike. Well done.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

That is circle jerking, that is ego, and you have it too. Get over it.

Actually, circle jerking is more commonly defined as a group of individuals agreeing with each other at the exclusion of outsiders. Personally I don't think we agree all that much, but to an outsider it may seem overwhelming at first.

Start your posts with "No, you are!" a lot though, and the circle may close.

 

[Cheesus333]

Arguing existentialism on a message board is pointless.

Everyone is so certain of their infallibility, neither side is ever moved by the others argument.

Here's what I think: The religious and the atheist are both wrong, neither side knows shit from shit, and they're both full of jerks.

Humanity is annoying.

Such a shame that, as right you are, those that actually agree care too little to reply, and those that disagree rule the world.

 

[Jolly Madness]

Mmmm... I generally have a little against most religions since they (+power and money) are the reasons for most wars through the history. Without the belief of a higher god, I think the world would be a much better place, and just because some people were scared that when they died, it would be the end... millions had to be slaughtered in the name of god...
So I say... go Buddhism!

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

lol. Then why is the atomic mass of an atom of hydrogen always 1.00794 amu? Why is the gravitational constant 6.67300 x 10-11 m3 kg-1 s-2? Why are water molecules always composed of 2 hydrogen and 1 oxygen? Why does 2+2 always equal 4?

"ur wrong"

Well, despite your mixture of high and low brow; you fail to consider that all your maths are based on measurements, which are all manmade, so artificial.

How long exactly is a second, without referring to any other measurement of time?

 

[sequio]

That is circle jerking, that is ego, and you have it too. Get over it.

Actually, circle jerking is more commonly defined as a group of individuals agreeing with each other at the exclusion of outsiders. Personally I don't think we agree all that much, but to an outsider it may seem overwhelming at first.

Start your posts with "No, you are!" a lot though, and the circle may close.

I know, I'm just really cranky today because I missed breakfast -_-.

 

[mtk2a]

lol. Then why is the atomic mass of an atom of hydrogen always 1.00794 amu? Why is the gravitational constant 6.67300 x 10-11 m3 kg-1 s-2? Why are water molecules always composed of 2 hydrogen and 1 oxygen? Why does 2+2 always equal 4?

"ur wrong"

Well, despite your mixture of high and low brow; you fail to consider that all your maths are based on measurements, which are all manmade, so artificial.

How long exactly is a second, without referring to any other measurement of time?

Measurement of time is related to atomic activity. Time is itself relative to the vibration of subatomic particles and therefore cannot be measured independently. Units of time are, as you say, artificial.

2+2=4 is not based on measurements.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

That is circle jerking, that is ego, and you have it too. Get over it.

Actually, circle jerking is more commonly defined as a group of individuals agreeing with each other at the exclusion of outsiders. Personally I don't think we agree all that much, but to an outsider it may seem overwhelming at first.

Start your posts with "No, you are!" a lot though, and the circle may close.

I know, I'm just really cranky today because I missed breakfast -_-.

Best meal of the day. Grab yourself some sugar.

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

lol. Then why is the atomic mass of an atom of hydrogen always 1.00794 amu? Why is the gravitational constant 6.67300 x 10-11 m3 kg-1 s-2? Why are water molecules always composed of 2 hydrogen and 1 oxygen? Why does 2+2 always equal 4?

"ur wrong"

Well, despite your mixture of high and low brow; you fail to consider that all your maths are based on measurements, which are all manmade, so artificial.

2+2=4 is not based on measurements.

How long exactly is a second, without referring to any other measurement of time?

Measurement of time is related to atomic activity. Time is itself relative to the vibration of subatomic particles and therefore cannot be measured independently. Units of time are, as you say, artificial.

So, that would make velocity, displacement etc. all artificial as well. The units we give them are the average measurement we have observed; (And Quantum Physics/Higgs even squashes that), so it's not really a 'proof' for anything.