She-Hulk Shaming is a wonderful euphemism we should use more often. That aside, come on Goyer, I thought you were cool, not a dick. Makes me nervous about what you're doing with Wonder Woman now.
Batman v Superman Writer Called Out For Sexist She-Hulk Shaming
- Thread starter MovieBob
- Start date
Because misleading comic covers and spoofing and satirizing the tropes she's being accused of aren't a thing? And because a female character having sexual relationships with multiple characters must mean she was only created as fan service right?gigastar said:Right, first id like to remind people what the page image for fanservice on TvTropes is.
And She-Hulk has had relationships with many male characters over the years.
So his comment isnt entirely unfounded.
Give me a break.
Lots of character have sex in comics, but everyone seems to love calling out She Hulk about her sexual exploits.gigastar said:Right, first id like to remind people what the page image for fanservice on TvTropes is.
And She-Hulk has had relationships with many male characters over the years.
So his comment isnt entirely unfounded.
I would claim that the way she approaches sex isn't any weirder than pretty much any sitcom that features women in the main cast, like Friends (Rachel has a new boyfriend every two episodes) or Ally McBiel or even Sex in the City.
Plus calling her chunky is just retarded. The woman has a bigger frame because she packs on giant frame from packing on huge amounts of Irradiated MUSCLE. Nothing annoyes me more than seeing SheHulk in a professionally drawn comic and she has the same figure as a play boy bunny.
"[...] though said screenplay [BS
oJ] is currently being rewritten by Chris Terrio."
Well I guess that's.. better? Goyer should be fired. I don't know if this incident justifies it, but they should just ride the outrage wave and embrace the opportunity to sack this guy before he ruins anything else.
oJ] is currently being rewritten by Chris Terrio."Well I guess that's.. better? Goyer should be fired. I don't know if this incident justifies it, but they should just ride the outrage wave and embrace the opportunity to sack this guy before he ruins anything else.
It's shit like this that infuriates me to no conceivable end.
For those who are unenlightened, allow an actual fan of She-Hulk to offer some insight. Yes, Stan Lee and and John Buscema made her to " prevent producers of the Incredible Hulk TV series from making knockoff characters of their own". They did the same thing for Spider-Woman. Yes, her Savage She-Hulk run was not that great. That said, she is a character that has improved over the years both in writing and in development. Thanks to writers like Roger Stern and John Byrne, she slowly became her own woman. She was a member of the Avengers and the Fantastic Four at one time in her life. Her fourth wall breaking exploits were due to Byrne's run on Sensational She-Hulk (this was long before Deadpool made it his own thing). I would also like to point out that she had a spectacular run in 2004-2005 with Amazing Spider-Man writer Dan Slott. Today, she is back in a new series being written by Charles Soule (another great title I'd like to recommend).
It's insulting on so many levels that Goyer is seen as DC's go-to-guy for their comic book movies when he has no fucking clue about comics and zero respect for its fan-base. You want to know why DC Comics and Warner Bros are seen as a fucking joke?! Its because they hire insufferable ass-wipe like him. -_-
For those who are unenlightened, allow an actual fan of She-Hulk to offer some insight. Yes, Stan Lee and and John Buscema made her to " prevent producers of the Incredible Hulk TV series from making knockoff characters of their own". They did the same thing for Spider-Woman. Yes, her Savage She-Hulk run was not that great. That said, she is a character that has improved over the years both in writing and in development. Thanks to writers like Roger Stern and John Byrne, she slowly became her own woman. She was a member of the Avengers and the Fantastic Four at one time in her life. Her fourth wall breaking exploits were due to Byrne's run on Sensational She-Hulk (this was long before Deadpool made it his own thing). I would also like to point out that she had a spectacular run in 2004-2005 with Amazing Spider-Man writer Dan Slott. Today, she is back in a new series being written by Charles Soule (another great title I'd like to recommend).
It's insulting on so many levels that Goyer is seen as DC's go-to-guy for their comic book movies when he has no fucking clue about comics and zero respect for its fan-base. You want to know why DC Comics and Warner Bros are seen as a fucking joke?! Its because they hire insufferable ass-wipe like him. -_-
What makes this hilarious is that I know for a fact there is a porn parody of the Avengers and She-Hulk is played by... you guessed it, Chyna (random aside: "Chyna in green body paint" my be the least titillating pitch for porn I have ever heard). Don't ask me how I know this. *shiftyeyes*MovieBob said:
OT: I'm sadly not surprised by this. people who don'y know or care about comics seem to have the weirdest tenancy to end up in charge of them.
Sexism: "is prejudice or discrimination based on a person's sex or gender." [wikipedia]
Prejudice: "prejudgment, or forming an opinion before becoming aware of the relevant facts of a case" [wikipedia]
Discrimination: "prejudicial treatment of an individual or group based on their actual or perceived membership in a certain group or category" [wikipedia]
Mr. Chipman, you penned the title to this article. Could you explain why you think the expressions, "She's still pretty chunky. She was like Chyna from the WWE." and/or, "A chick you could f*** if you were Hulk, you know what I'm saying?" are sexist or even shaming?
It seems to me that the first phrase is only a physical description. The second is speculation about a corporation's reason to bring the character into existence. Either way, making a determination of whether an opinion is sexist or not usually requires knowledge of what factors, if any, were considered in the formation of that opinion, in lieu of someone actually saying, "--because she's a woman." As the definition of sexism requires: the opinion must be based on a person's sex or gender. His opinion may well be formed on other factors surrounding the character-- how have you determined that they are not? Am I missing something?
Prejudice: "prejudgment, or forming an opinion before becoming aware of the relevant facts of a case" [wikipedia]
Discrimination: "prejudicial treatment of an individual or group based on their actual or perceived membership in a certain group or category" [wikipedia]
Mr. Chipman, you penned the title to this article. Could you explain why you think the expressions, "She's still pretty chunky. She was like Chyna from the WWE." and/or, "A chick you could f*** if you were Hulk, you know what I'm saying?" are sexist or even shaming?
It seems to me that the first phrase is only a physical description. The second is speculation about a corporation's reason to bring the character into existence. Either way, making a determination of whether an opinion is sexist or not usually requires knowledge of what factors, if any, were considered in the formation of that opinion, in lieu of someone actually saying, "--because she's a woman." As the definition of sexism requires: the opinion must be based on a person's sex or gender. His opinion may well be formed on other factors surrounding the character-- how have you determined that they are not? Am I missing something?
MovieBob said:
Hey Goyer, you know "Hulk" is in her name right? She's not "She Glamour Model", or "She Twig". She's "She *I crush cars into sardine cans f***ing* HULK"! Of course there was titillation involved in her character creation (like every mainstream heroine created for series of never-ending stories that serve as ad vehicles for peddling crap to boys and - more-so now - men). Did Goyer not see what DC did to Catwoman or the Teen Titans?
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Better a woman that actually looks like she can throw a truck around than that american apparel model who's joints WB will destroy trying to beef her up to play Wonder Woman. They better give her a good insurance plan because I'm anticipating the need for knee surgury down the line.
Calling her chunky is like calling an outside linebacker a tub-o-lard. Is Goyer going to go up to an outside linebacker and call him a tub-o-lard? No (a- it would be a lie; b- it would be a stupid thing to do). Everything eslse he said was idiotic too. Ye gods, this Goyer guy is a dumbass!
My favorite response to this was by Alan Kistler, who said Just to clarify some points, She-Hulk was indeed created in 1980 by men: Stan Lee and John Buscema. And generally, She-Hulk is not portrayed as the only woman the Hulk can have sex with because first and foremost, they?re cousins, and the Hulk has had several romantic interests in the comics. Also, we?d be remiss if we didn?t add it?s an extremely offensive thing to say about a female character. Since her introduction, She-Hulk has been a woman of agency and strength, one who quickly took control of her mutation to become a hero and who has never let herself be held back by sexist double-standards and the expectations of others who can?t handle her power, intelligence and sexual confidence.
You know what other super-heroine is traditionally seen as having a large build? Wonder Woman.
I wanted post a Picard Facepalm, but Goyer just isn't worth it.
I wanted post a Picard Facepalm, but Goyer just isn't worth it.
OH. MY. JESUS. GOD.
We're effectively fucked out of seeing any respect in translating DC's most iconic heroes as long as this guy's at the helm. First Manhunter, now this?! Time to cry.
We're effectively fucked out of seeing any respect in translating DC's most iconic heroes as long as this guy's at the helm. First Manhunter, now this?! Time to cry.
I'm more offended by his shitty writing than him saying stupid things about comic book characters.
*looks at question*
Are you serious? I really can't tell.
Anyway, the "chunky" but is pretty freaking stupid in this context. I mean, has he seen the Hulk?
The "why" is a little more difficult than that, as they often created female versions of their superheroes so other people couldn't.Baresark said:
I'm pretty sure the least titillating pitch would be "Chyna in green bodypaint opposite Sean Waltman as Wolverine...."major_chaos said:
*looks at description*90sgamer said:
*looks at question*
Are you serious? I really can't tell.
Anyway, the "chunky" but is pretty freaking stupid in this context. I mean, has he seen the Hulk?
Who has been portrayed in the past as a chick for Superman to fuck, so I'm not sure that necessarily helps.Happiness Assassin said:
For the record, Marvel staked a claim on the May 6th date first, they just hadn't announced which film they were going to put there at the time WB decided to delay BvS.DevilWithaHalo said:
So it was WB who misplaced the company brain cell in this instance.
Um... no. BvS was originally going to be released a whole two months after Avengers 2.Kumagawa Misogi said:
Actually She Hulk was forced into a 'relationship' with The Hulk in Old Man Logan, resulting in a entire clan of inbred hulk hicks that controlled the west coast.
Of course this was one of those 'alternate/what if' series that had Bruce Banner go evil so make what you will.
Of course this was one of those 'alternate/what if' series that had Bruce Banner go evil so make what you will.
Admittedly, I am not familiar enough with the character to know of the satire angle that seems to be inherent with her, and would assume that she's just eye candy for the Hulk comics. I think this is an example of someone with no idea what they're talking about talking about something. The difference is I'm not going to go on a podcast without knowing what I'm talking about, and this guy is.
Well, he did cling to the Nolans' coattails pretty tight for all those years, so now every time he's brought up on TV or in articles it's always "David S. Goyer, writer of The Dark Knight Trilogy"Zontar said: